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I agree Chicago and burbs do very well maintaining and providing forest preserves, but as a whole, there just isnt much nature to escape to. I now live in Phoenix, and there are so many areas to get away to, so many parks to hike, etc. Theyre also exceptionally maintained and cared for, which I love. Here I can drive 10 minutes from home, hike 15 minutes, and be surrounded by pristine desert preserves, with dozens upon dozens of miles of hiking trails, and not see a single home or power line. While I loved hiking the forest preserves back in IL, they just cant compare to what I have here.
Agreed. Illinois is a very rural state, and one can get to RURAL area a lot more quickly from downtown Chicago than one might think. But like I said in the previous post, rows of corn is not nature.
I do think however, that eastern cities (Chicago included) do have suburbs that have woods in the middle of suburban neighborhoods. The actual built up parts of western cities by and large are not likely to have deer right in town (one is more likely to see deer in the middle of a DuPage County suburb than they are in a Orange County suburb), but apart from that, anyone who knows how to drive and read a map, is going to have unlimited outdoor adventures in a western city not available in an eastern city.
Maybe because that's a nonsensical point? Most nature in the U.S. is "manipulated".
Even in our national forests and national parks, most of what you see is due to human intervention. Even outposts like Northern Maine and Michigan's Upper Peninsula and huge chunks of Alaska were essentially clear-cut in the 19th century, so what you see now are basically 20th century "tree farms".
Maybe in some areas yes, but for the most part those forests grew back on their own. Even when an area is clear cut, all the understory is still there to take over.
I wouldnt have included Vegas anyways... its surrounded by wide open desert, easily accessible to all. Lots of parks outside of town to hike and explore.
If Chicago didnt have the lakefront, I would rank Chicago real high. Its a concrete jungle for dozens and dozens of miles. Luckily for suburbanites, there were lots of "forest preserves" all over the place, which were saved from development, which had hiking, biking, fishing, etc, for people. But overall, Chicagoland in general is just way overdeveloped, not much in the way of nature whatsoever.
I find Chicagoland devoid of nature, less because of Chicagoland itself but because of what is OUTSIDE Chicago. Illinois is 90% covered in corn and soybeans.
LA metro area has nearly twice the population of Chicago metro area, and you have way more access to pristine wilderness because all the areas NOT urban are mountains, deserts, rugged coast, federal/state land, etc. and not agriculture.
Its a controlled environment. I mean, yeah its closer to nature than asphalt and concrete, but its not much more natural than a suburban lawn without the houses.
I suppose if that cornfield is abandoned and natural succession takes over then it becomes nature again and slowly turns back into natural prairie or whatever, but during active production, no its not nature.
Controlled environments don't exist in nature? Seems to me that even our small friends, the ants, control their surroundings.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tex?Il?
I mean, yeah its closer to nature than asphalt and concrete, but its not much more natural than a suburban lawn without the houses.
Asphalt and concrete are both made(by nature) of natural materials, so I don't know what you are getting at.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tex?Il?
I suppose if that cornfield is abandoned and natural succession takes over then it becomes nature again and slowly turns back into natural prairie or whatever, but during active production, no its not nature.
So if a cornfield made by nature is abandoned, by nature, it then becomes nature?
Controlled environments don't exist in nature? Seems to me that even our small friends, the ants, control their surroundings. Asphalt and concrete are both made(by nature) of natural materials, so I don't know what you are getting at.
So if a cornfield made by nature is abandoned, by nature, it then becomes nature?
Well if thats the case, then everything and everywhere is nature. Which would make this whole debate a moot point. Is that what you are getting at?
Well if thats the case, then everything and everywhere is nature. Which would make this whole debate a moot point. Is that what you are getting at?
You are smarter than the natural bear. . .
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