Does Toronto's urban structure have more in common with large US Midwest Cities or large US Northeast Cities? (live, comparison)

[Atticman]

Originally Posted by Othello Is Here

True but NYC,BOS,PhiL are more densely populated and built than Toronto.

Not true.

[Othello Is Here]

Originally Posted by Atticman

Not true.

So Toronto is more densely populated?

[Atticman]

Originally Posted by Othello Is Here

So Toronto is more densely populated?

Toronto's city limits have a much bigger area than Philly and especially Boston, it's not an apples to apples comparison. At approximately 20,000 ppsm, the population density of Toronto's old, pre-war urban inner core is greater than that of Philly or Boston's comparable area.

[Atticman]

These density figures are about 5 years out of date, some cities have further densified since then, others have lost density.

20,000ppsm densities
New York: 8,133,721
London: 3,345,638
Los Angeles: 1,957,346
Chicago: 1,120,257
Toronto: 993,659
Montreal: 803,131
SF-Oakland: 746,826
Philadelphia: 743,549
Boston: 559,756
Washington DC: 318,232
Vancouver: 295,282
Miami: 272,074
Honolulu: 145,363
San Diego: 99,539
Baltimore: 77,946
Seattle: 58,192

30,000 ppsm or more

New York: 6,638,237
London: 1,632,807
Los Angeles: 582,817
Toronto: 404,272
Chicago: 380,879
Montreal: 376,068
SF-Oakland: 328,494
Philadelphia: 237,754
Boston: 213,268
Vancouver: 145,090
Washington DC: 146,061
Miami: 92,969
Honolulu: 90,672
San Diego: 20,907
Seattle: 19,134
Baltimore: 15,506

50,000 ppsm or more
New York: 4,537,104
London: 302,260
Toronto: 173,254
Los Angeles: 105,717
SF-Oakland: 93,803
Chicago: 89,369
Boston: 56,569
Vancouver: 50,421
Montreal: 36,338
Honolulu: 31,009
Philadelphia: 29,908
Washington DC: 26,379
Miami: 19,316
Baltimore: 5,237
Seattle: 4,921
San Diego: 4,921

[Edward234]

Originally Posted by Atticman

Toronto's city limits have a much bigger area than Philly and especially Boston, it's not an apples to apples comparison. At approximately 20,000 ppsm, the population density of Toronto's old, pre-war urban inner core is greater than that of Philly or Boston's comparable area.

Maybe they're referring to the density of the built environment?

[trainrover]

Originally Posted by bostonkid123

all 4 subway lines in Toronto are at or over capacity

I'm afraid not; the Sheppard line is sorely underused.

Originally Posted by goat314

These cities are also defined by their tight gangways between residential units, which gives the illusion of a row-house type street-wall, but they units rarely connect like they do in East Coast cities.

Phew! because reading so many references to row housing puzzled me trawling this thread for valid statements. The city's row buildings are chiefly found along its main roads, plus shortening the handlebars of your bikes is unnecessary when between the semi-detached 'row' housing.

Originally Posted by TheProf

these 3 cities and the regularity of their street grids. Of these 3 in terms of building style, Toronto

Muddling axes with grid isn't right; the following input of mine recalls how so:

Originally Posted by trainrover

Its density's contrived if you will. The city there isn't interlaced like most places I've been to. Its development is highly protective of its town-and-country make-up. It's a massive quilt of neighbourhood cells where any type of road traffic is inevitably routed to its main roads; directly crossing town on any quieter side street's an impossibility. Coupled to the lack of boulevard expansions there, the combination of all this is why plying its unnecessarily busy, narrow roadways burns out human beings like you and me. Plus there's no complementary network of alleys either, and if you should encounter one it's quaintly called a laneway.

Anyhow, out of the dozens of dozens of American towns and cities I myself have visited, Spokane-WA is the one that reminds me of this place.

[Atticman]

Originally Posted by trainrover

Phew! because reading so many references to row housing puzzled me trawling this thread for valid statements. The city's row buildings are chiefly found along its main roads, plus shortening the handlebars of your bikes is unnecessary when between the semi-detached 'row' housing.

He wasn't talking about Toronto not having rowhouses, he was referring to Chicago. Toronto has countless rowhouses found in sections along its oldest residential streets, not just along main roads. With most having peaked roofs and small front lawns, they may not look like typical Philly or Baltimore style rows, but if you look closely you will find that that are indeed connected. They're everywhere in the old residential areas around the downtown area, look around!

[NOLA101]

Originally Posted by Edward234

Maybe they're referring to the density of the built environment?

I assume, yeah, they're talking about density of built environment.

Philly has much tighter urbanity than Toronto, with narrower streets, smaller blocks, fewer setbacks and vastly more rowhouses. It feels much more intensely urban, IMO.

Toronto has much higher household sizes (probably due to far more immigrants who, for cultural reasons, have multiple generations in one unit, and generally more crowding due to unaffordability).

[NOLA101]

Originally Posted by Atticman

HWith most having peaked roofs and small front lawns, they may not look like typical Philly or Baltimore style rows, but if you look closely you will find that that are indeed connected. They're everywhere in the old residential areas around the downtown area, look around!

Toronto isn't really a rowhouse city. They exist, of course, but the housing typology is like other Great Lakes cities, even in the inner city.

Older homes tend to be detached, with setbacks, like you would see in Buffalo, Cleveland, Chicago, Detroit, Milwaukee.

[Atticman]

Originally Posted by NOLA101

Toronto isn't really a rowhouse city. They exist, of course, but the housing typology is like other Great Lakes cities, even in the inner city.

Older homes tend to be detached, with setbacks, like you would see in Buffalo, Cleveland, Chicago, Detroit, Milwaukee.

It's only once you get further away from downtown (particularly to the North) that detached homes start to dominate, as for the closer in neighbourhoods East and West of downtown, rowhouses are often the dominant typology. Take a cruise up this street on streetview. https://goo.gl/maps/B5VexDbSvz32

There are hundreds of streets similar to this in the old city, I live on one!

Even Toronto's neighbourhoods with fully detached homes don't really look similar to those in the cities you listed above.