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Toronto is now the only big city in Canada, so the fact that it is more highrise and dense in nature than other CAD cities and even most of the cities in the U.S is ok. There are plenty of cities in Canada that Canadians can move to if they don't like that - its a massive country. Most big cities in the world are quite dense so no problem there for Canada to have one city that follows the density patterns of other large cities in the world.
I've written many times in these vs forums regarding Toronto that the metro doesn't have much in the opportunity to sprawl as much as it used to due to protected greenspace surrounding it. Couple that with pretty heavy immigration growth and you have key ingredients that support a city that needs to be more dense in nature than your typical Canadian/U.S city. Toronto is now over 50 percent foreign born and many of these people are more used to living in places with higher density anyway so their expectation or dream isn't necessarily rooted in living in a 2500 sq ft house with a large backyard and multiple car garage. Of course, this comes with its own set of challenges because you need to mate infrastructure development with this relatively compact but high growth. This will be the key challenge for Toronto in the coming decades.
Actually when I was in Toronto I stayed at an Airbnb in a pretty suburban area of the city off of the 2 line. It left an impression on me that Toronto was really suburban but I later learned (from citydata) that Toronto recently annexed a bunch of suburbs into its city limits and that's why there's so many suburban neighborhoods. It makes a lot of sense because they weren't built to be part of Toronto. So I think that makes it different from all those US cities.
They were annexed pretty recently right? I think it's actually really interesting. What are the attitudes of the people that live in the former suburbs? Do they like being part of the city now or not? Is the city working on making them more "city-like" or does it look like they're just going to stay basically suburbs in the city limits?
Also: limited space is a good thing as far as building up density. Just look at Manhattan and SF. The geographical restrictions force these cities to grow a certain way. But it can be bad for cost of living though if demand to live there is high enough.
Last edited by That_One_Guy; 12-22-2016 at 09:09 PM..
Actually when I was in Toronto I stayed at an Airbnb in a pretty suburban area of the city off of the 2 line. It left an impression on me that Toronto was really suburban but I later learned (from citydata) that Toronto recently annexed a bunch of suburbs into its city limits and that's why there's so many suburban neighborhoods. It makes a lot of sense because they weren't built to be part of Toronto. So I think that makes it different from all those US cities.
They were annexed pretty recently right? I think it's actually really interesting. What are the attitudes of the people that live in the former suburbs? Do they like being part of the city now or not? Is the city working on making them more "city-like" or does it look like they're just going to stay basically suburbs in the city limits?
Also: limited space is a good thing as far as building up density. Just look at Manhattan and SF. The geographical restrictions force these cities to grow a certain way. But it can be bad for cost of living though if demand to live there is high enough.
The Old City of Toronto amalgamated with other surrounding boroughs (North York, York, East York, Scarberia and North York) back in 1998. As for the attitude of those in the former cities I don't care - j/k - i'm not really sure. Its a mixed bag but I suspect increasingly that for a lot of people the 'new' amalgamated Toronto is really the only Toronto they know. As for the city making them more city like, I think it depends on what that means but I will say that more dense mid-highrise development isn't just occurring in the core of Toronto - its happening all over and not just the city of Toronto itself, but the Greater Toronto area as a whole ie Mississauga, Brampton, Vaughan blah blah blah...I think this increased density across the board will fuel increased transit development and as such will provide greater connectivity and a more natural and city like fusion between the various ex-boroughs and the Old city.
As an aside, any future visit to Toronto at an AirBnb should at a very minimum be in Old Toronto https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Toronto
where did you stay btw? Some parts of the surrounding boroughs are more city like than others!
I saw Toronto, Chicago, and Washington D.C. on the same trip in previous months of this year. The latter two I've lived in before. Last saw San Francisco in 2015.
Some pictures that I've taken the last time I was in Toronto:
I'll upload my Chicago and Washington D.C. pictures later to share. However, since I've already posted my San Francisco Bay Area pictures before on this forum, they're already uploaded.
My pictures of the San Francisco Bay Area (and surrounding environs; i.e. Big Sur):
Spectacular city, I really like it (scratch that, I love it) and it is one of the 18 cities in America that I really like. A lot. Enough to definitely live in if I was presented with that opportunity. The nightlife is all night long (no last call). There is abundant food options all night, 4 AM, 5 AM, whenever. Lots of live music options everywhere, in venues, on the street, at parks (especially on Frenchman Street). You can walk around with alcohol and drink it anywhere in the city (open container - if the alcohol is in a plastic bottle). Everything about it from food, to culture, to vibe, to architecture, to history, to urban form is first class.
I recommend everyone see it at least once. Great city. It stays active ALL night, even on weekdays, makes you wonder how a place with 1.5 million people even has that many people to be out that late.
Legit city. Along with Miami Beach, the best nightlife experience I've had in the United States (followed by Las Vegas and New York). All four (Miami, New Orleans, New York, and Las Vegas) are really fun cities, I could live in them all. Lots of fun. I have the same view of Las Vegas you do, it is a difficult place to like outside of the Strip, but on the Strip, it is a world onto itself.
Quit worrying about Canada. 2017 will be Canada's 150th birthday, and so far, it's done quite well for itself. It's the second largest country in the world with nearly unlimited resources - I don't see why it cannot provide a good life for merely 37 million of its citizens.
You've been fixated on the preeminent demise of Canada for a while now, judging by your continuous flow of "Canada will crash" posts. Not exactly sure what have the good people of Canada ever done to you to warrant this level of hate. Loosen your corset girl, it's Christmas, go have a drink, and maybe fix your own house first under America's new Il Duce before telling the neighbors how to run their own houses.
Most of that land is of low value. The upper 2/5ths is overwhelmingly worthless tundra and permafrost. Another 1/5th is inaccessible forests. Either way, not sure why you're gloating about your country having more ice.
Also, Canada's arable land would actually rank it #7. It has 415,573km2 of arable land versus the U.S.A.'s 1,650,062km2, which largely explains why the U.S. developed to be a superpower of 325 million people while Canada is still a pygmy at 36 million.
And not to rain on your showboating, but resource use extends 200 miles outside of a nation's border. It's part of the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea. So countries have exclusive rights to these waters for fishing, oil, mineral extraction, rare earths, research, etc.
These are the official "resource monopolies" countries have by size:
#1: Russia (24,664,915 km2)
#2: USA (21,814,306 km2)
#3: Australia (16,197,464 km2)
#4: Canada (15,607,077 km2)
#5: France (12,366,417 km2) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exclusive_economic_zone
You should find the time to read more and expand your horizons. It must hard being arrogant about Canada when the country is doing so crappy at the moment. Just read this today: http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2016/12..._13787940.html. But please, tell us again about how perfect Canada is. lol! Canada is a one-trick pony. Half the economy is digging up fossilized dinosaur parts. The other half is selling overpriced fixer-uppers to Chinese money launderers. No innovation, no jobs, no future.
Last edited by manitopiaaa; 12-23-2016 at 12:02 AM..
Canada seems like a really great place to live now, ever since last month. I don't want to leave NYC though.
I would be down for Canada to annex New York State.
New York is close to having nearly 2x the GDP per capita of Canada. I think New York can do a better job on its own frankly.
Canada: $43,413 (2015 IMF nominal per capita)
New York: $72,965 (2015 Bureau of Economic Analysis, DOC)
Canada GDP w/36 million people: $1.532 trillion
New York GDP w/20 million people: $1.456 trillion
In fact, 31 million people in the Tri-State Area produce nearly $800 billion more than Canada, with 5 million fewer people!
Tri-State (New York, New Jersey, Connecticut) GDP w/31 million people: $2.297 trillion
Canada GDP w/36 million people: $1.532 trillion
Last edited by CaseyB; 12-24-2016 at 03:51 AM..
Reason: flaming
To be completely fair, my personal issues with America are not tied to its politics. While I'm no fan of Donald or Hillary and if I still lived in America, I would have just stayed home this election and not have voted at all. However, personally speaking though, they aren't my biggest gripe with the country. At the end of the day, I can live with the results.
America is one of my favorite countries for a number of reasons but my beef with the country is that I loathe its collection of cities and some of them I loathe quite a lot.
If you go through the list, lets say we approach this as hardliners and put a cut off of sorts at the 5 million people or more mark. This means we're looking specifically at the first 12 metropolises on the list (everything from New York, which is #1 on down to Detroit, which is #12). Of those 12 places above 5 million, I only happen to like 2 of them enough to ever consider living in (Miami and New York) and consider going back to for a visit on leisure again and again (Miami and New York). If we use the "approval rating" process, then that means I only can stomach 16.6% of America's top 12 largest metropolises (2 out of 12). Meaning I either am neutral of and by neutral meaning I don't hate them but I don't go out of my way to like them either (Atlanta, Dallas, Houston, Washington), don't care for (Detroit), or completely despise (all the rest) the other 10 (the other 83.4% of the top 12).
When you expand the list to metropolises over 1 million people, then there are 60 of them, lets also round up Honolulu as well (because by 2016 its likely already crossed 1 million), so 61 places in America over 1 million people. Out of 61, I only happen like 18 of them enough to consider living in and have a desire to go back to for leisure. So I approve and accept 29.5% of America's 61 largest metropolises, and completely disavow and want absolutely nothing to do with the other 70.5% completely. I'll be perfectly happy if I never have to see those 43 out of 61 places again in my life.
Just speaking for myself, I'm no fan at all of that country's cities. I only like a minority number of them. I like a lot of things about America and overall it is one of my top 5 favorite countries in the world but it didn't get into the top 5 because of its collection of cities, it got in for other reasons (location, variation in topography and climate, economics, cost of living, ethnic diversity, variation in ethnic foods, my family and friends living there, so on). This is where some of the other countries have the edge with me, countries like Australia or Israel or Canada or Germany or Japan or New Zealand or Thailand or the United Kingdom or Spain or some Northern European countries. I happen to like a majority number of their cities, the complete opposite of my personal take on America, where I only like a minority number of them.
So you visit the U.S. and go out of your way to visit every city possible (as you've previously stated) just so you can later complain about how terrible they are? Why don't you just visit Toronto every day if their cookie cutters are so special to you?
And you "completely despise" Boston, Chicago and San Francisco and yet still pretend you're neutral here? Whatever helps you sleep at night I suppose.
New York is close to having nearly 2x the GDP per capita of Canada. I think New York can do a better job on its own frankly.
Canada: $43,413 (2015 IMF nominal per capita)
New York: $72,965 (2015 Bureau of Economic Analysis, DOC)
Canada GDP w/36 million people: $1.532 trillion
New York GDP w/20 million people: $1.456 trillion
In fact, 31 million people in the Tri-State Area produce nearly $800 billion more than Canada, with 5 million fewer people!
Tri-State (New York, New Jersey, Connecticut) GDP w/31 million people: $2.297 trillion
Canada GDP w/36 million people: $1.532 trillion
You throw around GDP per capita a lot but what I notice in your posts is that you omit any sort of discussion on how wealth is distributed. If all the wealth was distributed evenly than sure, every person in the States you cite would obviously be wealthier than every Canadian. That said, if the wealth in said States is more unevenly distributed and concentrated among a smaller percentage of the population (elites) than in Canada, these figures tell us nothing about how the average person is doing in either place.
Besides, I think as you mature in life you'll find that there is more to life than simply dollar bills.. There are other aspects of living beyond a never ending desire to become increasingly wealthy, so that you can increasingly buy things you don't need and lose sight of what is really important in your life.
As for the whole arable land argument and all that nonsense about ice and tundra (see links below btw), Canada only has to provide for 1/9th the population of the U.S so the fact is for its small population relative to the U.S, it has more than enough resource wealth to take care of its population. Which is what BK was really getting before you decided to go nuke on him as you seemingly always do by default. I know you work in D.C - I really hope you're not involved in any diplomatic decision making for your country.
So you visit the U.S. and go out of your way to visit every city possible (as you've previously stated) just so you can later complain about how terrible they are? Why don't you just visit Toronto every day if their cookie cutters are so special to you?
And you "completely despise" Boston, Chicago and San Francisco and yet still pretend you're neutral here? Whatever helps you sleep at night I suppose.
Now you're attacking poster Facts Kill Rhetoric? He has done nothing to deserve your toxic vitriol and was simply sharing his opinions about how he felt about certain places. He has also spoken glowingly of several cities in the U.S. and the U.S in general. He's entitled to his opinion and wasn't being nasty like you're being at all. You're truly a piece of work!
Last edited by fusion2; 12-23-2016 at 12:39 AM..
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