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I guess it depends on who you talk to. Some consider A2 a part of Detroit, but don't tell Ann Arborites that; many feel A2 stands on its own as a major destination, tourist or otherwise, apart (and above) Detroit.
Nevertheless that the western suburbs are closer to Ann Arbor than downtown Detroit is yet another sign of sprawl and, yes, Detroit screams for quality rail transit.
Ann Arbor is very much a part of the Detroit area, it's just at its periphery. They watch news from Detroit tv stations and read Detroit newspapers.
And many of the people who visit AA are actually from Metro Detroit, it's like driving to Pontiac from DT Detroit, an easy, quick drive.
And the western Detroit suburbs being closer to AA than DT Detroit is actually a sign of a very large, populated metro, not just sprawl, as you say.
I don't know what the debate here is. Detroit is clearly above the other three cities, who are more comparable yo each other than either is to Detroit. Detroit was a more important and impactful city at its peak than either of these other cities were in theirs, respectfully...
Not sure how to perfectly quantify "world-class", but I think it has to be clear that Detroit is much closer to that designation than these other cities. Not really close...
Agreed. Numerous other forum members (myself included, Post#8,#33) have hammered away at this realization. What's clearly debatable is whether Detroit should be recognized as a world-class city at all or if so, how so. Meanwhile, the other debates should be relegated elsewhere.
As both a regional Midwestern and all American city, Detroit's a bear, but also realize that within many a compilation of global cities, it's barely a blip on the radar. For example, peer up and down the metropolitan areas linked below and locate Detroit (#82). Next, just as a simple exercise, tabulate the number of Chinese metros which supersede Detroit in population (twenty one). Lastly, from that grouping, focus solely on one of Detroit's "sister-cities, Chongqing. Like many other interior Chinese megacities, Chongqing is virtually unknown by the vast majority of Americans; yet, in so many measurements of great cities, it blows Detroit right out of the water.
Previously in this thread (Post#20), in reference to Cincinnati, Cleveland and St. Louis, one forum member quipped that: "most of those metro's barely have more people than Detroit's 2 core suburban counties.". Then, in due turn and all fairness, can it also be asked if ever Detroit's MSA was dropped into that of Chongqing, would it qualify as anything more than one of that megacity's larger suburbs? I have no vested interest in objecting to Detroit's preeminence over this thread's three other cities; nor do I care how Detroit ranks amongst other global cities. Again, see below and decide such matters for yourselves:
Ann Arbor is very much a part of the Detroit area, it's just at its periphery. They watch news from Detroit tv stations and read Detroit newspapers.
And many of the people who visit AA are actually from Metro Detroit, it's like driving to Pontiac from DT Detroit, an easy, quick drive.
And the western Detroit suburbs being closer to AA than DT Detroit is actually a sign of a very large, populated metro, not just sprawl, as you say.
The only thing that "separates" metro Ann Arbor from metro Detroit are the statistical intra county commuting patterns that the OEM uses to determine metro areas. If not for the economic engine of the university creating major job clusters in Washtenaw County, it would very much be a suburban satellite to Metro Detroit, as the urban areas blend.
Must be true then. Forbes is pretty much the front edge trendsetting publication for the masses. And as every other city since 1948 knows, a sports championship immediately fixes your cities problems and makes, like everyone want to just be there! 2 of them will probably rocket Cleveland into the Paris/London rank of relevance! Especially after people find out about the orchestra! Do you guys know about the orchestra?!?!?!
Must be true then. Forbes is pretty much the front edge trendsetting publication for the masses. And as every other city since 1948 knows, a sports championship immediately fixes your cities problems and makes, like everyone want to just be there! 2 of them will probably rocket Cleveland into the Paris/London rank of relevance! Especially after people find out about the orchestra! Do you guys know about the orchestra?!?!?!
Well, Forbes is the magazine that appeals to the lowest common denominator in terms of its target business audience, and they do so by being very simplistic and pro-status quo when it comes to following urban affairs. They always list the obvious boom cities in their various rankings, such as Dallas or Nashville, and never really pay attention to future trends. So I think the fact that they mention Cleveland in the same publication that always ass-kisses the sun belt is actually pretty significant.
Cincinnati is the fastest growing of the three. Detroit is obviously much more of a global city then St. Louis, Cleveland, and Cincinnati are. I still argue St. Louis and Cleveland are among the two most comparable cities in the country...practically identical in size, both cities of the Rust Belt, both very Catholic cities, both have similar architecture (with the exception of housing), etc.
Cincinnati is the fastest growing of the three. Detroit is obviously much more of a global city then St. Louis, Cleveland, and Cincinnati are. I still argue St. Louis and Cleveland are among the two most comparable cities in the country...practically identical in size, both cities of the Rust Belt, both very Catholic cities, both have similar architecture (with the exception of housing), etc.
I still strongly disagree. Cleveland has much more Eastern European influence than St. Louis does, particularly from Slavs (yes, I know we have Bosnians). And no, our architecture isn't really alike at all, especially residential-which is a pretty big exception to make btw. Lafayette Square/Soulard looks absolutely nothing like Ohio City, for example. The culture is also quite different; Clevelanders seem more "east-coast" ish than St. Louisians. As I've said before, Cleveland's grit is a different breed from St. Louis'; StL's is more faded, like an antique, whereas Cleveland's is more rusted and industrial, like an old factory. St. Louis is a grandma, Cleveland is a grandpa.
Well, Forbes is the magazine that appeals to the lowest common denominator in terms of its target business audience, and they do so by being very simplistic and pro-status quo when it comes to following urban affairs. They always list the obvious boom cities in their various rankings, such as Dallas or Nashville, and never really pay attention to future trends. So I think the fact that they mention Cleveland in the same publication that always ass-kisses the sun belt is actually pretty significant.
There is no reason to believe Cleveland will ever grow more than Dallas, which has grown through both the Great Recession and the current Oil Crisis. Yeah, it might grow more in the future than now, but it likely isn't going to be enough to catch enough attention from actual booming cities.
I still strongly disagree. Cleveland has much more Eastern European influence than St. Louis does, particularly from Slavs (yes, I know we have Bosnians). And no, our architecture isn't really alike at all, especially residential-which is a pretty big exception to make btw. Lafayette Square/Soulard looks absolutely nothing like Ohio City, for example. The culture is also quite different; Clevelanders seem more "east-coast" ish than St. Louisians. As I've said before, Cleveland's grit is a different breed from St. Louis'; StL's is more faded, like an antique, whereas Cleveland's is more rusted and industrial, like an old factory. St. Louis is a grandma, Cleveland is a grandpa.
St. Louis is rusted and industrial like Cleveland, I'm sorry. Clevelanders are not east coast at all. Cleveland may have more Eastern European influence, I agree. As far as architecture, it is quite similar outside of housing. You are exaggerating the differences greatly. There is no difference in culture.
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