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Urbanity: Denver is more urban and walkable in it's core than Tampa most likely. However. Denver is very, very isolated from even any other mid sized cities, and certainly major ones. OTOH, in Tampa, you have Tampa and Saint Petersburg sort of like twin cities, plus Orlando, Jacksonville, Miami within a few hours, and you are generally closer to the East Coast which is just less spread out in general (ie, you can drive to NYC or Chicago in a single day from Florida)
Nature: Depends on what you like, mountain vistas/hiking and geology, or palm trees and beaches/water recreation.
Location: Already touched on this. Denver's strength is it's proximity to fantastic natural opportunities and scenery, but it's weakness is being so removed from everything else. Florida is kind of in a corner of the country as well, but still less isolated overall.
Livability: Denver likely has the better transit system, and seems to have wealthier average residents. Higher COL though by a good margin. Not sure how traffic compares, or other things that contribute to livability. If it matters to you, Denver is probably slightly more diverse in regard to foreign born pop. (based on stats), but Tampa is likely more ethnically diverse.
Sports: Right around Denver is probably better as they have P5, and MLB, NBA, NFL, NHL, MLS all in the Metro, as opposed to GO5 (USF) and MLB, NFL, NHL for Tampa. However, Tampa is not far removed from Orlando, or Miami for other market games.
Climate: Depends on what you like. Based upon the standard I use (likely not alone on this), of picking the place where the daytime temperature is closest to 72 (I have a cold bias, but this is widely considered air conditioning temperature and thus default optimal, so I'm accounting for that to eliminate warm or cold bias), Denver is better from May to October, and Tampa is better from November to April.
I have a feeling that this one is very much shaped by the type of person you are and interests you have, and because of that, it's impossible to say that one is truly "better" than the other.
All very good points cavsfan137!
I think if I have enough outdoor activities to do, an easy way to get to the activities, free time and good, fun, non-arrogant people to do them with, decent weather, sunshine, and a good job, I should be OK.
The things I NEED to do in my life several nights a week are volleyball (indoor/outdoor), kickball, mountain biking, disc golf, and bar games (though I'm not a heavy drinker). I also really like kayaking. Fishing and snowboarding are bonuses.
The whole time I was in Tampa I ended up with itchy welts/bumps/hives on my arms, hands, and ankles. It happened last time I was there too. I'm not sure if it was the heat, from allergies to bug bites, or something else, but I sure hope it wasn't the heat/humidity or I'd be in some trouble there.
@N610DL
How'd you end up going about finding people out there? In Tampa people just end up talking to each other so you find out if you have a common interest pretty quick. I think I'm going to see what the offer looks like with this company in Denver and how much travel is involved. I came back from Tampa both times this year with some sort of ongoing itchy bumps all over me.
One other major problem just for me is that I only liked those awesome old homes in the area south of downtown (Washington Park, Cherry Creek) which are HUGE $$$$$ now unfortunately. One more market crash and you could lose everything in one of those. I have a couple guy friends in the mountains, and one near Denver already, but I like having a group of people like me. I have this great group what I live now - late 20's to early to mid 40's people that all love to be outside, play sports (but aren't super good), and do fun things together. I met a group in Tampa like that too. I tried to find that same thing in Denver, but I struck out. I was thinking maybe I'd start a Meetup if I moved there.
It sounds bad, but I actually met most of my guy friends through the local bar scene. The meet up groups I just don't care about - it seems so forced. I joined one ultimate frisbee league and it was the most bizarre slash stupid experiences I've ever done in my life. The coach was a fat, frat guy that was chugging beers constantly at 10am and making me run up and down the field. I didn't show up again.
I'm in one of those neighborhoods with those old homes you describe. They are actually all over the city, not just Wash Park or Cap Hill. You can actually find some in the Highlands for under 500K, but that's still pathetic compared to what you can get in Florida.
Denver is a great city no doubt, but it's probably better for me as a place to visit and not to live if it doesn't shape up in the short term. There something that also bothers me about being landlocked slash in the middle of the country, per say.
Yea I've actually met a lot of really great guy friends (and female friend only types) in the bar scene here in upstate NY. I really don't drink a lot having stomach issues, but nobody cares that much. I like the bar games and sometime stupid conversations. Denver/Boulder are big drinking towns, so I'm wondering if not drinking much is going to lead to no social scene. I work in the technical field but still like switching to stupid conversations after work hours sometimes. I've had a few crazy experiences with Meetups too - just like you ran into. It was a lot of super strange people that I really had nothing in common with. On the other hand in Tampa, I did a Meetup there on vacation and everyone happened to be super cool, all have good jobs and stable lives, and I made a few awesome and permanent friends.
I was thinking in Denver I could start my own Meetup for multiple activities - and not just one activity. (I run into so many people that are obsessed and focused on just one or two activities in life.)
Anyhow you're super lucky to live in one of those old homes. Would you have any recommendations for other safe areas besides the Washington Park area/Highlands to find one of those old homes that's close to transportation? It was on CL trying to find someone renting a room in one of those and it seemed impossible. I wish I had bought in back in 2009 when I was thinking of moving then!
Just an observation on your Denver list but you seem to be rolling Denver attributes and Colorado attributes all together. Not sure if you are doing the same with you Tampa list. The diversity of terrain in Colorado means you can find widely divergent aspects of the plains compared to the mountains and the south-western deserts. So I can't say if that matters or not, but you likely won't be living in mountains and will be living in the city. Perhaps weighting the attributes between weekday and weekend activities could help you clarify things a bit better.
Interesting you find it important to notate the ability to record psychopaths as in important feature. I have never seen that on any lists I've read ever on CD.com.
Also interesting how you note that thinner air effects your brain. I suppose a climber on 14ers on a regular basis, its worth noting, but in Denver, meh. The US Olympic Committee probably doesn't worry about this since they have a training facility in Colorado Springs, specifically for the benefits of training at altitude, which sits a bit higher than Denver. Since Colorado contains something like 30% of the land over 10,000' in the entire nation, altitude is a fact of life here. But, maybe the thin air causes the prevailing attitude some are mentioning here lately. Lots of research going on about altitude and suicide. Live here at your own risk.
No mention of the radical difference in population density between FL and CO. Outside the metro areas of Colorado's Front Range, population rates drops extremely fast. Unlike FL where people are everywhere. Good/bad, you decide. If you are younger and dating, density maybe where its at. Of course, that many people means your psycho concerns maybe more valid since it seems that nearly every weird, almost unbelievable story in the news comes from FL.
CO weather can change radically in short time spans and is nearly unpredictable for any season. Snow for Halloween, flip flops for Christmas, a 4' deep blizzard in January, more flip flop weather in February followed by every other week snow storms through April is a typical winter. Blazing sun, scorching heat, cloudy with days of rain with brutal hail, lightening storms and an occasional tornado can all occur during the summer. This year has been fairly moist and things are pretty green. Drought years can leave us months without rain and the brown and yellows so many complain about. Sweat shirts, parkas, t-shirts, cargo shorts, and flannel lined pants can be a year round wardrobe. If you want a simple single season mode of dress, it isn't happening in CO.
Yea I've actually met a lot of really great guy friends (and female friend only types) in the bar scene here in upstate NY. I really don't drink a lot having stomach issues, but nobody cares that much. I like the bar games and sometime stupid conversations. Denver/Boulder are big drinking towns, so I'm wondering if not drinking much is going to lead to no social scene. I work in the technical field but still like switching to stupid conversations after work hours sometimes. I've had a few crazy experiences with Meetups too - just like you ran into. It was a lot of super strange people that I really had nothing in common with. On the other hand in Tampa, I did a Meetup there on vacation and everyone happened to be super cool, all have good jobs and stable lives, and I made a few awesome and permanent friends.
I was thinking in Denver I could start my own Meetup for multiple activities - and not just one activity. (I run into so many people that are obsessed and focused on just one or two activities in life.)
Anyhow you're super lucky to live in one of those old homes. Would you have any recommendations for other safe areas besides the Washington Park area/Highlands to find one of those old homes that's close to transportation? It was on CL trying to find someone renting a room in one of those and it seemed impossible. I wish I had bought in back in 2009 when I was thinking of moving then!
Honestly, I haven't seen nearly as much adult alcohol consumption since college since I've been in DEN. People have a beer in their hands at all times, hard liquor consumption is quite common. If you can drink light beer, I think you'll be fine. I hear Tampa is quite the drinking town too though. Boulder isn't as bad because it's like a big college town with trust fund granola hippies.
I actually live in an apartment complex with a pool - just surrounded by those old houses with character. They remind me of California Bungalows except with brick on the exterior instead. The South Cap Hill / Wash Park area is a bit of a blackout zone for the RTD so you'd have to at least drive to a station or bike to one to use it.
TCHP - Searching about Denver facts, I read those studies about suicide and the thin air, as well as how it affects animal behavior. There's crazy stories out of all cities. There was the Ft. Lauderdale airport shooting, Aurora movie theater shooting, Columbine. There was also the homeless guy that threatened to cut the couple standing next to me waiting for the train at the 16th St. Mall in Denver.
It sounds like the weather keeps things from getting too boring in the Denver area. I wonder how accurate the forecasts are. I know in Tampa it was hard to get details when the weather showed a thundershower. One day it rained on and off like 8 times in between periods of intense sunshine. The next day there was a "tropical storm" which was nothing compared to a few inches of snow in the northeast.
N610DL - Sounds accurate regarding what I saw with Alcohol in both Tampa and more so, Denver. I'll stick to my Coors Light (since Blue isn't an option outside of border states), and if I'm lucky, some light craft brews which are rare but do exist. I am a coconut fan and had an amazing craft coconut brew near St. Pete in FL. Maybe I'll find the same in DEN.
I was looking at apartment complexes similar to what you speak of. I hope I don't have a problem finding a 2 bedroom place with a reasonable sized garage and a nice green lawn with trees.
So, at this point I think with either Denver or Tampa, I'll be doing better than the northeast. I did feel pretty damn good in Tampa though even with all that heat and humidity, but I'm not quite sure how I would handle that non-stop. I get pretty angry being in a warm office or home, but everything there seemed to be chilled to 68 or below, and there was usually a breeze outside, and lots of trees to hide under. One big thing I need to escape is the cabin fever in the northeast. I need to be able to get outside without piling on 10 pounds of clothes 6 months out of the year, and escape the constant gray days.
How is the wind out in Denver during the winters btw? One evil thing about upstate NY is not just the cold, but the constant whipping wind that sends chills through your body.
I know all big cities have crime issues. What I'm saying is weird things occurs in FL. Like assault with a burrito in Tampa, arrests for riding manatees in St Pete, Python hunting contests throughout the state, roach eating contest in Deerfield Beach, alligators for hire at parties from a Madeira Beach company, an Orlando man who was arrested from trying to force his fiance' to swallow her engagement ring after she threatened to leave him, a Vero beach man assaulting a pizza delivery guy because he forgot his garlic knots, lets not forget the whole hanging chad incident from a not so long ago election, not too mention all the various types of smuggling going on in the country from drugs to exotic animals to people. The shootings at the Pulse night club and Ft Lauderdale airport, or the previous century's crimes targeting of rental cars, are all violent crimes that are no different than nearly any other state. But truly bizarre stories seem to consistently come from FL.
Denver gets wind in the winter. It is not constantly blowing hard through the winter. There are many sunny and warm days throughout the season, but when we do get blizzards, the wind is relentless and will pile snow up many many feet deep. Full on blizzards like this are not a regular occurrence though and tend to be the exception and not the norm. The lack of humidity means when we do get wind, it is not the piercing cold you are familiar with. I'd also point out that while we have the opportunity for snow over a much larger calendar period than what you have in NY, our snowfall, within the Denver area, and most of the Front Range, is much more variable and it is not like we have snow on the ground non-stop from October to April. We have periods of times, during the winter, that are more fall like than winter like. But non of that applies to the high country where snow can stick around until July or August.
One more con for your list...your car insurance will likely go up along with your registration. The amalgamation of drivers here means there is no consistent driving pattern and the numerous fender benders, all out multi-car accidents and consistent hail damage means rates are going to be higher than you are used to.
How is the wind out in Denver during the winters btw? One evil thing about upstate NY is not just the cold, but the constant whipping wind that sends chills through your body.
Not bad. The dry coldness makes it actually feel warmer than what the temperature actually is. A sunny morning starting off at 34 feels significantly warmer than what that 34 would feel like in the Northeast.
Wind isn't too bad. Some windy days, but not a lot of consistently if you're in the city. If you live closer to Boulder near the Flatirons, then it can get crazy windy but not so much in my area of Denver. I used to live in Hoboken, NJ - now that place was windy pretty much all the time. I want to say like triple the amount of cold / windy days that Denver gets.
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