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Location: That star on your map in the middle of the East Coast, DMV
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77
If I misinterpreted your post, then I apologize but it seemed like you were accusing me of trying to shift the focus of the central argument. All I'm saying is that most of Arlington doesn't look like the Rosslyn-Ballston Corridor and is actually SFR but I also acknowledged the several commercial districts in the area, which are pretty high profile and hard to miss.
At the end of the day, it's hard to argue with the fact that suburban DC is a denser/more mixed use version of Sunbelt suburbia and suburban Boston adheres to more a more classical urban form. Both are simply products of the time in which they have matured. When it comes to making car-dependent suburbia more urban and walkable overall, the DC area is a good model to follow.
Fair enough, and I agree that this is hard to dispute.
Fair enough, and I agree that this is hard to dispute.
DC is fortunate to be in a region where they aren’t surrounded by incorporated cities and towns. It’s easier to get buy-in from a couple county governments than 20 small cities. Small town nimby-ism really stifles development.
Last edited by gladhands; 10-24-2017 at 02:53 PM..
Location: That star on your map in the middle of the East Coast, DMV
8,128 posts, read 7,552,695 times
Reputation: 5785
Quote:
Originally Posted by gladhands
DC is fortunate to be in a region where they aren’t surrounded by incorporated cities and towns. It’s easier to get buy-in from a couple county governments than 20 small cities. Small town nimby-ism really stifles development.
Yes that is fortunate and a big impact on the region's suburbs. I get it though, many suburbs of Boston, Philly etc have more of their own urban (big little town) feel that is more distinct and less cookie cutter than parts of Arlington or Bethesda. I think that is a part of the disconnect in this discussion, it's like where are the apples, and where are the oranges. There are some interesting towns on the outer fringes of DC though (Frederick, Leesburg, Harpers Ferry, Fredericksburg, heck even Annapolis, MD) is in range of a suburban commute, so people don't have to go that far to get a taste of that experience.
I'm really questioning whether you've been to any of these Boston area towns. It isn't just population density, it's the fact that almost every neighborhood is walkable and has amenities. That's more indicative of urbanity than an intense TOD downtown that trails off into typical suburbia.
Cause population density is all you've been yapping about. You never posted any qualities of those Boston suburbs so population density was obviously their biggest selling point.
...And FYI the only place that's an incorporated on your list is the city is Alexandria. Arlington is a county and Bethesda and Silver Spring are unincorporated and all the areas having a Silver Spring mailing address would be 40 sq/mi or more compared to Somerville with only 4.2 sq/mi BUT there are defined boundaries for CBD zones hence the name downtown Silver Spring urban district. In short an apples and oranges comparison once again.
I've been to Boston/Cambridge more times than I wanted to and know people that live/lived in Brookline and Somerville. Somerville doesnt even have rail stations close to its core, it's almost like the T lines purposely avoid going through the city, hmmmmm... looks like the case of Georgetown.
Wow has this thread gone off the rails. The original question was urban neighborhoods brookline, Cambridge, Sommerville vs Bethesda Arlington silver spring. I agree the Boston's are basically extensions of the city itself and they may have been annexed if the influence of Cambridge and Brookline weren't so influential a century ago. Overall they are double the density and are way more walkable. There is extensive public transit and variety of architecture from row homes in Brookline to triple decker in Sommerville. There are a ton of central squares or nodes of higher vibrancy (Harvard sq, central, Davis, Inman, Kendall, Coolidge corner, Washington square. Union square, Sullivan square etc). If you want to argue superior urban neighborhoods change the thread to Boston outer ring neighborhoods Newton etc. the way the op asked the question is not close. I don't care about office space. Phoenix has plenty of office space too. These D.C. area Neighborhoods have urban nodes. They are not as urban as the Boston ones listed. We can close this omit Boston area inner urban neighborhoods and then resume your arguments about mix use and office space
That’s not true. Cambridge and Somerville have a lot of office space, particularly in Tech and Biotech. I will grant that Brookline has less in the way of office space.
I havent been able to find any separate stats for office market in Somerville, this usually due to the fact that it isnt significant but Id be curious to see.
That's still a heck of a lot more of this "type" of urbanity than Somerville.
Exactly, same could be said about any city, the high-rise urbanity usually doesnt continue forever in all directions, even Somerville has commercial core but it's no where near the level of Silver Spring and Arlington. And they act like everything is so special and historic in Boston and their way is the best way yet Maryland companies from the DC area are the ones building their shiny new district Assembly Row, not only approved by Somerville government but was the primary site in Somerville's Amazon HQ2 bid.
You're welcome says Montgomery County/Bethesda/Silver Spring/ Rockville, Maryland et al.
As was mentioned upthread, the primary reason DC has these types of satellite CBDs is because the DC height limits stopped an extremely dense core CBD from forming within city limits. With less stringent zoning Boston-area inner suburbs would likely become significantly denser, but given you can build additional commercial office buildings on the giant parking lots in the South Boston Waterfront, it probably wouldn't be feasible to build out something like Rosslyn or Ballston.
Interesting theory, it may be indicative of the taller buildings outside DC proper but the amount of office space inside DC proper which alone is +/- 150 million square feet and that's not even including the government space means that the outside areas having their own business districts of such size is even more impressive.
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