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Old 04-06-2018, 05:42 PM
 
Location: North Caroline
467 posts, read 426,993 times
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I know a 5-city comparison might be overwhelming, but I want to know your thoughts on these 5 major Southern cities in terms of how they compare and contrast in regard to unique features and cultural attributes. I am looking less for traditional stats-based comparisons involving "objective" questions such as "most populated", "most projected growth", "least crime", etc., and more in terms of subjective opinions on what makes each city special/what each has to offer in terms of (Southern) culture. I've done my fair share of research but I want to hear more about them from locals/natives.

Topics of interest might include things like architectural makeup of each city and their most prominent neighborhoods/suburbs, natural environment/landscape and how this contributes to how you feel about a city, local food culture, etc. Tell me interesting things about your city/the city that shed an informative light on your experiences.

And please, while these cities have all experienced varying levels of new growth and transplants moving in, try to focus on the topic of the local culture of each city instead of just making generalizations and saying things such as "too many NY transplants", "not Southern enough", because while these cities may have experienced large influxes of people moving, they are nonetheless all culturally and historically Southern at their core and that will not change. Thanks!
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Old 04-09-2018, 09:24 PM
 
193 posts, read 204,221 times
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I've lived in Atlanta and Richmond and have visited the other cities on numerous occasions--although I've not been to any of them for several years now. Thus my opinion of each is probably somewhat out-of-date. I'll list them by alphabetical order and offer my opinion of each.

ATLANTA

Atlanta is easily the hub of the entire southeast. "The city too busy to hate" as the saying went. Too auto-oriented for my taste with massive freeways and interchanges that mar the urban landscape. Surface parking lots everywhere. Atlanta desperately needs a regional commuter rail system like Philly has in SEPTA. On the plus side, Atlanta has some great attractions: The Cyclorama (my favorite), the aquarium, the World of Coca Cola, CNN Headquarters, the Fox Theater, and the Capitol come to mind. Also some of the most beautiful residential areas in the U.S. especially the Paces Ferry Road area. Then of course there is "Gone With the Wind"....

BIRMINGHAM

Birmingham has come a long way since the days of "Bombingham" and Bull Conner. The city seems to be making a real effort to better itself and is to be commended for that. Birmingham tried seriously to attract the 2016 Democratic National Convention--I hope they try again in 2020. I was very impressed with the Birmingham Museum of Art, and the view of the city from Vulcan Park is amazing. Of course there is the annual Alabama-Auburn football game (do they still play that game in Legion Field?). Overall, Birmingham is impressive especially considering what a new city it is (founded 1871) and that it is somewhat in Atlanta's shadow.

CHARLOTTE

If there is one southeastern city that could de-throne Atlanta as the capital of the "New South" its Charlotte. I have photos I took of downtown Charlotte back in the '70s. A few tall buildings strung along Trade and Tryon Streets and it seemed nothing but surface parking lots everywhere else. Boy has Charlotte changed since then! Very tall skyscrapers abound along with a huge football stadium for the Carolina Panthers and a light rail system to boot. Other than being the last Capital of the Confederacy, there is really nothing about Charlotte that strikes me as particularly "Southern". Instead I see it as a progressive, forward looking AMERICAN city that has a tremendous future.

RALEIGH

When I think of Raleigh I think of a small southern capital city of 65,000 souls (1950 census). It's hard to believe that today Raleigh spreads out over 145 square miles; is home to 460,000 people and is in one of the fastest growing metro areas in the country. Raleigh shares the spotlight in its region with Durham and it didn't look or feel to me like a big city. However, it is one of the 20 finalists Amazon chose for it 2nd headquarters. The reason I think it was selected (and Charlotte wasn't) is the nearby location of three great universities (N.C. State, UNC, and Duke). That plus the Research Triangle Park. Like Charlotte, Raleigh doesn't strike me as especially southern--other than its location in North Carolina.

RICHMOND

Of all the cities in question, Richmond strikes me as the most "Southern". Unlike Atlanta, Charlotte, and Raleigh, it is not a boomtown but it does have growth that is steady and solid. Richmond will forever be tied to its history--especially the Civil War era when it was capital of the Confederacy. Everywhere you look there a monuments to that past--it's the city's glory and its curse. Although its natives speak with a gentle southern drawl, Richmond has a very different vibe than the other cities. First off--its natural setting is dramatic--on seven hills overlooking the falls of the James River. Also there are many square miles of dense Victorian-era row house neighborhoods.

Of all these cities, Richmond is by far my favorite. I loved it when I lived there, and I love it still.
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Old 04-10-2018, 07:22 AM
 
37,875 posts, read 41,904,687 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTinPhilly View Post
ATLANTA

Surface parking lots everywhere.
That's changing, especially in Midtown. Those lots are biting the dust at a rapid pace.[/quote]

Quote:
CHARLOTTE

Other than being the last Capital of the Confederacy, there is really nothing about Charlotte that strikes me as particularly "Southern".
Charlotte was never a capital of the Confederacy. https://www.civilwar.org/learn/artic...es-confederacy

Also Charlotte is certainly Southern but in a "New South"-type of way, and you don't have to stray far from the city proper to get a more genuine Southern vibe.
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Old 04-10-2018, 08:55 PM
 
193 posts, read 204,221 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
That's changing, especially in Midtown. Those lots are biting the dust at a rapid pace.


Charlotte was never a capital of the Confederacy. https://www.civilwar.org/learn/artic...es-confederacy





The Confederate Congress disbanded on March 18, 1865. At the time of Richmond's fall on April 3, 1865 the Confederate government (such as it was) consisted of Jefferson Davis and his cabinet. He and his cabinet escaped to Danville, Virginia where they set up shop from April 3 to April 10. After Lee's defeat at Appomattox, the government fled further south and reassembled on April 11 in Greensboro, North Carolina.

Later that week the government continued south to Charlotte and set up regular headquarters at the Charlotte branch of the Bank of North Carolina. On April 20, 1865 Davis held his last meeting with his entire cabinet. This meeting was held in Charlotte.

Each city where Davis and his cabinet met (Danville, Greensboro, and Charlotte) likes to claim that it was the "Last Confederate Capital". Since Charlotte was the last place where the entire "government" held its final meeting, I think that Charlotte has the best claim to the title of "Last Capital of the Confederacy".
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Old 04-11-2018, 08:11 AM
 
37,875 posts, read 41,904,687 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTinPhilly View Post
Charlotte was never a capital of the Confederacy. https://www.civilwar.org/learn/artic...es-confederacy





The Confederate Congress disbanded on March 18, 1865. At the time of Richmond's fall on April 3, 1865 the Confederate government (such as it was) consisted of Jefferson Davis and his cabinet. He and his cabinet escaped to Danville, Virginia where they set up shop from April 3 to April 10. After Lee's defeat at Appomattox, the government fled further south and reassembled on April 11 in Greensboro, North Carolina.

Later that week the government continued south to Charlotte and set up regular headquarters at the Charlotte branch of the Bank of North Carolina. On April 20, 1865 Davis held his last meeting with his entire cabinet. This meeting was held in Charlotte.

Each city where Davis and his cabinet met (Danville, Greensboro, and Charlotte) likes to claim that it was the "Last Confederate Capital". Since Charlotte was the last place where the entire "government" held its final meeting, I think that Charlotte has the best claim to the title of "Last Capital of the Confederacy".
Charlotte has never claimed that, at least not in any real public way. All I could find that indicates that meeting was held in Charlotte is this: http://docsouth.unc.edu/commland/monument/533/ And even if Charlotte did claim this in some real, public way, how would such a final ad hoc meeting give Charlotte some kind of Southern feel? Charlotte isn't like Richmond where you can find several statues, monuments, and historic sites relating to the Civil War/Confederacy in different places across the city.

Last edited by Mutiny77; 04-11-2018 at 08:26 AM..
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Old 04-11-2018, 09:41 AM
 
Location: Taipei
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I know Atlanta pretty well, Richmond/Bham/Raleigh not well, Charlotte barely any experience at all.

So just very general impressions...I think I would be fine living in ATL. Charlotte and Richmond are borderline. Bham and Raleigh probably not, although I wouldn't say never. I like big cities. Mainly walkability, vibrancy and diversity.

Atlanta manages to meet my requirements just enough and I have no doubt that given its trajectory it will be more than sufficient in the coming decade. It's primary knock is that many of the diversity options are far from and not well-connected transit-wise to the vibrant/walkable areas.

Richmond I have only visited a few times but it seems to have decent walkability/vibrancy in its core and I like the vibe. Very gritty, artsy, a bit counter-culture. I'm going on a limb thinking I could live here cause it's a bit small on paper, but there's something unique about it that attracts me.

Charlotte like I said I don't have much experience with. Only visited once (not counting the airport) and didn't see much of the city. But it is a decent size and has some walkability/vibrancy. Diversity is a concern.

Bham I've visited 3 times, including once for work that was over a week long. I've always enjoyed being there. It has positive momentum in its urban areas, though not an outrageous amount. Ultimately it's just too small for me though.

I spent 2 weeks in Chapel Hill, and have also visited the triangle 4 or 5 other times. Honestly have not spent a ton of time in Raleigh itself. I do think the area has a ton of potential, but probably not gonna change soon enough to draw my attention. If all the various parts like Chapel Hill/Carrboro, Durham, RTP, Raleigh/Cary were squeezed tight together or had very efficient transit connections, then suddenly I might find it extremely appealing. But it just seems so spread out.
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Old 04-11-2018, 09:52 AM
 
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I've lived in Atlanta and I currently live in Raleigh. Have visited all the others except Birmingham, mainly because it's in Alabama and I don't see a reason why I'd ever want/have to go there.

Atlanta is the urban capital of the Southeast with all the typical urban amenities. Raleigh is where you live if you want to raise an intelligent family. Richmond's my least favorite city on this list; feels too southern for my liking. Charlotte's basically a mini Atlanta and feels more spread out/less urban. The downtown's not too bad though.

Raleigh is also more tech-focused than the other cities so I like that aspect as well. Reminds me a little of Austin, TX.
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Old 04-11-2018, 09:54 AM
 
Location: North Raleigh x North Sacramento
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Lolololol...what a narrow definition of "southern": "capital of the Confederacy, monuments of the Civil War"...

If the definer allows for any depth or context to the word "southern", there's no way anybody could call Richmond more southern than any of these cities, not one. It's not really possible, but to each their own, I guess...

I've been to all of these cities multiple times over, and have lived in or near each of these cities besides Birmingham. I'm pretty familiar with this entire group of cities. I'll respond to the OP's inquiry of specifically "what each has to offer in terms of southern culture", though I think it's pretty telling that the OP had to qualify his inquiries with "let's not debate about who's not southern enough"; clearly this guy knows he's asking a loaded question and that at least one of these cities is very culturally different, in terms of southern atmosphere, from the rest. This is a humorous thread...

Richmond is the most southern of the five if your interest is specifically learning about the South in the Civil War/Confederacy period. As people point out, repeatedly, there is more appraisal of that period in Richmond than most cities, if not all, so take that however you like...

Personally, as a Richmonder, you are numb to that era. It's not trumpeted about in the manner people online would habe you believe, and it's pretty much never spoken of unless there's a controversy or you're an individual that rotates in that group of people who are into that period. Sure, there are a bunch of signs and monuments that lead one to historical learning of that era, bit you don't see them anymore, as a Richmonder. It's a period that holds a semblance of significance but was a 5-year period in the history of a 300-year old city...

People are entitled to their opinions, but nobody from Richmond, or anybody who has lived in Richmond since the 50s (that's you VTPhilly, you left Richmond a long, lonh, time ago), nobody is going to say that era holds much weight in the modern times. And honestly, some if the proof is evident in the "Richmond is sooo southern" respondents, because year after year, the ONLY qualifier that you really hear repeated into the fricking dirt, is "oh, Richmond was the Capital of the Confederacy. It has monuments to the Civil War". There is nothing else anyone can say to claim Richmond is more southern than any other city in the South...

Most of you who read this aren't familiar with the city, so again I stress that there is an online perception of Richmond's "southern-ness" that is exaggerated and isn't an accurate reflection of what the city is actually like today, much like the litany of other misperceptions, exaggerations, or outright lies spoken of other cities across this board. Richmond is southern, but it does not not compare in level of southern countenance to any of these cities, unless again, you ascribe to the narrow definition of its monuments and status as capital of a rebellion that it didn't volunteer for, 153 years ended, in a 4-year window of a city with an illustrious history dating far beyond the Civil War...

Raleigh is New South, in terms of industry, growth, and design, but is old South in its social and cultural structure. A bunch of transplants to thar area, and most are from the Northeast or the easternmost Midwest (Ohio, Indiana), but that's to be expected of a region that's added something like over a million people in just over a quarter-century. Those persons have diversified the overall culture and atmosphere of the city, but it's very much exaggerated often that it's really diluted the southern culture there. Natives are unquestionably southern; the transplants assimilate into the local southern flavor...

Charlotte is really the same as Raleigh, the same descriptives apply...

Atlanta is very southern, I've heard it mentioned (only on here though, never in real life, and I recently lived just 40 minutes from the city and have been in and around the city many times) that it has a Northeastern or Midwestern flavor. Maybe lightly I guess, but it can't be mistaken for anything else...

Birmingham is the smallest of these cities and has the least outside influence of any of them. I guess if you want the city with the deepest southern culture, the most free of outside influence, you'd probably like Birmingham most...
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Old 04-11-2018, 09:58 AM
 
Location: North Raleigh x North Sacramento
5,819 posts, read 5,620,852 times
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Originally Posted by MrJones17 View Post
Richmond feels too southern for my liking.
Can you explain what you mean by this, compared to the other cities on this topic? I think I know what you mean but I'll choose not to assume...
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Old 04-11-2018, 11:10 AM
 
37,875 posts, read 41,904,687 times
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Originally Posted by murksiderock View Post
Raleigh is New South, in terms of industry, growth, and design, but is old South in its social and cultural structure.
When I think about cities that are "old South" in their "social and cultural structure," I think of aristocratic Southern cities whose wealth was largely tied to the slave trade. Those cities tended to have the most stratified social climates that essentially amounted to a caste system of sorts. Raleigh was not among those cities, nor were most of NC's cities actually (one reason why NC was historically called "a vale of humility between two mountains of conceit"). Wilmington is probably as "old South" as it gets in NC.

But no doubt, Raleigh is Southern although some of social hallmarks of Southern culture aren't present to the same extent in Raleigh as in other Southern cities (e.g., high levels of enthusiasm for college football),
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