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No you're paying for being within short commuting distance of all the tech giants. You can get a much better deal with the same weather and distance from SF in the Bay Area.
Exactly. The issue is simply supply and demand in those areas. You have a lot of very high paid jobs concentrated in one area, with a relatively suburban housing mix that does not come anywhere close to meeting demand for number of units. As a result, those willing to pay the most for a short commute so they can see their families bid up the price of housing. The farther from the job centers you get, the cheaper housing gets, until at some point 2-3 hours away in Stockton housing is similar in price to the Midwest.
The natural response of the market would be to either develop undeveloped adjacent areas or build denser housing. In the case of Silicon Valley, the area within a 1 hr commute is pretty much built out with the exception of parkland and nature reserves, so there isn't really available undeveloped land to build on. As far as redeveloping suburban areas in a more dense pattern, the people that live in those areas like them as they are, and also benefit from the low supply in the form of appreciating house prices, so no elected official is going to vote to change the zoning, since elected officials answer to current residents and not to all the people who want to move to the area.
So is Charlotte, Nashville, Phoenix and Houston; even Austin. Yet they are all on the list.
Again I am speaking relatively. And with all the cooperations headquartered in Dallas and Atlanta I was assuming they would be listed higher. Add to that the popularity of Atlanta in terms of reality stars and musicians I was expecting Atlanta to be on the list.
Put it this way, why do you think nearby areas of Nashville and Charlotte have a higher percentage than Atlanta other than Atlanta being more populous. No shade to Nashville and Charlotte, this may be a learning experience.
A learning experience? Nashville has long had one of the wealthiest counties in the country in its MSA. Williamson County has been in the nations wealthiest counties for at least 10 years, and I believe it is currently 7th on the list. And two of the cities in Davidson County are also constantly listed as some of the wealthiest in the nation, Belle Meade (listed 8th by Forbes last year) and Forest Hills (top 30).
Million dollar homes aren’t a new phenomenon to Nashville. The difference between Nashville and some of the other cities listed are that there are almost no reasonably priced houses in the other cities. Nashville has both reasonably priced houses and million dollar homes.
Last edited by JMT; 09-06-2018 at 05:21 AM..
Reason: corrected spelling of Forest Hills
Exactly. The issue is simply supply and demand in those areas. You have a lot of very high paid jobs concentrated in one area, with a relatively suburban housing mix that does not come anywhere close to meeting demand for number of units. As a result, those willing to pay the most for a short commute so they can see their families bid up the price of housing. The farther from the job centers you get, the cheaper housing gets, until at some point 2-3 hours away in Stockton housing is similar in price to the Midwest.
The natural response of the market would be to either develop undeveloped adjacent areas or build denser housing. In the case of Silicon Valley, the area within a 1 hr commute is pretty much built out with the exception of parkland and nature reserves, so there isn't really available undeveloped land to build on. As far as redeveloping suburban areas in a more dense pattern, the people that live in those areas like them as they are, and also benefit from the low supply in the form of appreciating house prices, so no elected official is going to vote to change the zoning, since elected officials answer to current residents and not to all the people who want to move to the area.
Stockton is still roughly $150K above the average in the Midwest
Originally Posted by Facts Kill Rhetoric;53005494[B
]Inside the city itself is quite expensive and some of the most expensive real-estate on the planet (especially Manhattan and inner areas of Brooklyn and Queens) [/b]but if you expand the view to the entirety of the New York MSA and/or CSA, then New York is a great value given what you get versus what you pay for. You have arguably the best city in the world and as a metropolitan area the median housing price is less than several lesser cities both in the United States and across the world. Every metropolitan area ranked ahead of New York with respect to median housing value is at a minimum a full one tier below it as a place on an overall basis, several of them are a few tiers below it.
Chicago, Dallas/Fort Worth, Houston, and Atlanta are in the same price bracket range from a median high of $275,100 (Chicago) to a median low of $228,800 (Atlanta), with Dallas/Fort Worth ($268,200) and Houston ($244,400) in the range in between those two. The four likely represent the best cost of living attributes for areas of their respective sizes, especially once factoring in the average income levels in each respective area. Well, for now at least. All four have varying levels of median home price appreciation levels, so in 10 years we'll see if that point still stands.
Agreed. You have prices exceeding $3000-$4000 per sqft, you don't see that anywhere in San Fran, maybe a specific residence here or there, but in Manhattan, that is normally for a residence to command $2k+ per sqft of space.
For that last part, Philadelphia is in that mix too. A case for Atlanta and Philadelphia is that housing prices vary greatly from county to county. Suburban Philadelphia counties are generally in the $300-$350k median range, while Philadelphia County is at only 150k, Atlanta is similar. There is a bit more uniformity in metro DC, NYC, San Fran.
The economic and real estate setup in Atlanta, Philadelphia, even Chicago is a bit different than other major cities.
The first is that Charlotte barely just got in. The cut-off line for the assessment was 1% or higher and Charlotte got in with an entry number of 1.02%, so just barely making the cut and likely got there just this year.
It doesn't matter if you made it to Noah's Ark last; what matters is that you made it while many others didn't.
Charlotte should not be made to seem lesser than just because it barely made it to the list while many other cities did not make it at all. It would be another matter if there were only 22 cities in the US, but it's not. Charlotte is on the list while peer cities such as Orlando, Tampa, Minneapolis-Saint Paul, San Antonio, and more prominent cities such as Philadelphia, Atlanta did not.
Last edited by atadytic19; 09-06-2018 at 09:27 AM..
Inside the city itself is quite expensive and some of the most expensive real-estate on the planet (especially Manhattan and inner areas of Brooklyn and Queens) but if you expand the view to the entirety of the New York MSA and/or CSA, then New York is a great value given what you get versus what you pay for. You have arguably the best city in the world and as a metropolitan area the median housing price is less than several lesser cities both in the United States and across the world. Every metropolitan area ranked ahead of New York with respect to median housing value is at a minimum a full one tier below it as a place on an overall basis, several of them are a few tiers below it.
Median home price by the National Association of Realtors by MSAs for Q2 2018 (most up to date available):
01. San Jose MSA: $1,405,000
02. San Francisco/Oakland MSA: $1,070,000
03. Honolulu MSA: $795,200
04. San Diego MSA: $645,000
05. Los Angeles MSA: $557,200
06. Seattle MSA: $530,300
07. Boston MSA: $495,900
08. Denver MSA: $462,900
09. Washington, D.C. MSA: $443,100
10. New York MSA: $410,500
11. Portland MSA: $407,100
12. Sacramento MSA: $374,000
13. Riverside/San Bernardino MSA: $360,000
14. Miami/Fort Lauderdale MSA: $353,000
15. Salt Lake City MSA: $331,600
16. Austin MSA: $330,200
17. Baltimore MSA: $297,200
18. Providence MSA: $294,700
19. Las Vegas MSA: $291,400
20. Raleigh MSA: $290,600
What I find funny is that San Jose MSA already has the highest median housing price in the United States and having now surpassed Vancouver ($1.3 million USD median) for most expensive in all of the North American continent. Despite all of that, San Jose MSA's median housing price year-over-year led the entire United States among major metropolitan areas with an + 18.70% increase in a 1 year time period.
Chicago, Dallas/Fort Worth, Houston, and Atlanta are in the same price bracket range from a median high of $275,100 (Chicago) to a median low of $228,800 (Atlanta), with Dallas/Fort Worth ($268,200) and Houston ($244,400) in the range in between those two. The four likely represent the best cost of living attributes for areas of their respective sizes, especially once factoring in the average income levels in each respective area. Well, for now at least. All four have varying levels of median home price appreciation levels, so in 10 years we'll see if that point still stands.
Good stats and agree with the analysis.
Let me detail out why I said a million dollars gets you something better in NYC than in SF. It's true that many parts of Manhattan are very costly per square foot especially if you're going on the higher floors of a newer luxury building--it's some of the most expensive real estate in the world as is the DUMBO neighborhood in Brooklyn, and to a lesser extent, Brooklyn Heights. In those areas, you're going to get about equivalent or less housing for your price for a commuting time equivalent in San Francisco. However, if you go outside of those parts of NYC and into commuting time equivalents for places like Richmond or Sunset, you're going to find yourself with a lot more and a lot less expensive options and in neighborhoods that can range from a bit more to much, much more vibrant/walkable neighborhoods.
Interesting list. You do have to account for property taxes though, which are much lower in CA than in TX, IL, or much of the NYC metro.
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