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I wouldn't say that they are behind, I would say that Houston is building them over a lot more corridors at once so it will take longer to be as noticeable.
Westheimer, Richmond, Kirby, Fulton, Montrose, different areas of Midtown and the Museum District, east downtown, Sheppard... even more car-centric areas of Richmond/Westheimer on the SW side is getting rid of the garden style apartments for taller street facing apartments with some even having retail. It's like Houston having a dozen Peachtree/ Preston streets. It works be more noticeable if Houston mainly focused on Main street.
I don't think the other two has as many clusters as Houston. Midtown Houston for example has about a dozen. If they were to ever connect then game over.
I for one would rather see that area developed as midrises with ground floor retail, such as mid main or the Pearl Whole Foods than with hirises.
The Buffalo Bayou park/ Allen Parkway area is a different story. That area is going to be lined with hirises and fancy stores from Sheppard to Downtown
That's why as much as I love Dallas and Atlanta beautiful cities Houston is an entirely different beast when it comes to potential because of the different neighborhoods we have.
That's why as much as I love Dallas and Atlanta beautiful cities Houston is an entirely different beast when it comes to potential because of the different neighborhoods we have.
I have walked from UHD to the Pierce area before.
I have walked from the Pierce area to Wheeler area before
I have walked from Wheeler to Hermann Park before.
What I have never done is walked from UHD to Hermann Park. Google says it's 5.8M from UHD to TMC transit center. (Longer than the distance from the French Quarter New Orleans to Metairie). And apart from Hermann park it is city block after city block the entire way. Granted there isn't anything on a few of them NOW, but your key word was potential.
There is already a rail all the way through. I'm not sure if the ridership is bouncing back from the pandemic yet, but it was rather busy before then. Fannin south Station to Wheeler was like standing room only during rush hour and similar between the downtown transit center and UHD. Wheeler to Downtown was where there would have more breathing room. They would definitely have done capacity issues if the Midtown portion was as busy as the other two.
In Atlanta Atlantic Station to the zoo is about 5.1 miles according to Google. But it's not one straight shot where you walk just one street and there are city blocks the entirw way through. It's more of a hop scotch pattern.
Atlantic Station is a stone's throw from Midtown but I would take public transportation because I wouldn't feel comfortable walking between the two.
Midtown all the way through downtown are pretty much connected all the way through and arguably has the best walking experience of the 3 cities, but it is a series of grids so it is basically same structure with the other two city cores but with more to see.
Not sure why I included the zoo area because it too is disjointed but I didn't want people to say I was short changing Atlanta.
Anyway point is there is continuous city block after city block from UHD/ Buffalo Bayou all the way to TMC transit center/ Brays Bayou almost 6 miles of straight city block you can walk along. You really can't do that in the other two.
But where Houston really murderizes the other two is that you can do the same east to west as you can from UHD to TMC.
Houston so far hasn't settled on a McKinney or a Peachtree. It has dozens of potential corridors so it has the best potential for building density.
Without a steady grid the only way you build density is to go up. That drives price up. Inner loop Houston has decades of infill in the midrise range before prices get crazy. Houston has the bones of LA but without the desirability. It can develop density similar to LA's without LA prices.
Anyway, it's nice that all 3 are finally paying attention to the core. They all provide top notch suburbs but it's nice to cater to all lifestyles so urban development is essential too.
Atlantic Station is a stone's throw from Midtown but I would take public transportation because I wouldn't feel comfortable walking between the two.
Midtown all the way through downtown are pretty much connected all the way through and arguably has the best walking experience of the 3 cities, but it is a series of grids so it is basically same structure with the other two city cores but with more to see.
Anyway, it's nice that all 3 are finally paying attention to the core. They all provide top notch suburbs but it's nice to cater to all lifestyles so urban development is essential too.
The walk really isn't that bad. I've done it during my stays in Midtown, and actually walked from Downtown, to Midtown, to Atlantic Station during my last visit a few weeks ago. There are wide sidewalks on both sides, no crazy intersections, no ramps... It's well done.
And finally, I too am happy to see all three cities embracing their urban cores more aggressively than a lot of other places. A solid portion of the population -- especially the professional working force -- embraces urban lifestyles. Even if one doesn't live directly in it, if one works in an office, being in a suburban office park in no way matches being in an urban center, where you can grab a coffee and a muffin in the morning, walk to the office, walk out to lunch, go for a walk to the park, and perhaps enjoy happy hour after work with clients and/or coworkers without having to get in your car.
And? Completely irrelevant to the post to which I was responding.
And really, if you NEED retail, there's America's mart (7 stories+ of boutiques/galleries), Underground is getting renovated, and is still functional...
Or hop on a 5-10 minute train ride and go to Atlantic Station.
The retail is there. Just not on that particular block.
1) America's mart is closed off to the public just like the Dallas Market Center
2) Underground... needs to be bulldozed and re-built
3) The walk from MARTA's Arts Center Station to Atlantic Station would not be worth the trip.
If you're going to take transit to shopping outside of Downtown... there's direct trolley and subway access to West Village, direct light rail access to Deep Ellum or Victory Park and streetcar access to Bishop Arts.
The walk really isn't that bad. I've done it during my stays in Midtown, and actually walked from Downtown, to Midtown, to Atlantic Station during my last visit a few weeks ago. There are wide sidewalks on both sides, no crazy intersections, no ramps... It's well done.
And finally, I too am happy to see all three cities embracing their urban cores more aggressively than a lot of other places. A solid portion of the population -- especially the professional working force -- embraces urban lifestyles. Even if one doesn't live directly in it, if one works in an office, being in a suburban office park in no way matches being in an urban center, where you can grab a coffee and a muffin in the morning, walk to the office, walk out to lunch, go for a walk to the park, and perhaps enjoy happy hour after work with clients and/or coworkers without having to get in your car.
I agree with you there. I don't mind living in a suburban setting, but working in an office park is heresy. The best part of work is lunch and no way I'm going to get used to the monotony of a food court or hopping on the highway to a restaurant. I just can't do it.
I love walking. In Houston I seem to get further without realizing how far I have gone. I used to walk from the French Quarter to City Park and if I didn't look it up I would have said that was much much further than down main in Houston. I think it's because of the consistent development in New Orleans gives the impression that you are covering more area because there is so much more to see.
I am also weird in that I'm fascinated by urban decay I am not a fan of bright shiny office buildings. But a decrepit abandoned hospital building will definitely make me wanna explore that way. Midtown Houston used to have interesting abandoned looking midrises but they are quickly quickly disappearing.
That area was no man's land, but it's changing. I just wish they would do more preservation and start with more moderate size buildings.also, a couple of those blocks are slated for low income housing and at least one of them slated for homeless housing. I'm not sure how that will affect the area's development
Wow, you’re right. A lot of changes going on in Houston too. Just goes to show how fast development happens in the Southern US (Sunbelt). 801 Cleveland St kinda looks like a mini State-Thomas with continuous blocks of low rise urban apartments/townhomes.
This is the official boundaries of Uptown. 58.1 acres being green space (cemeteries/parks). 0.834 sq mi (533.7 acres) being developable. Wikipedia stats - area: 0.925 sq mi / Pop: 19,979 / Density: 21,598.91/sq mi
Uptown may not have the height like most urban districts, but it shows that it doesn’t need to be to have a significant amount of density. As a skyscraper enthusiast, I would love for Uptown to be packed wall to wall with skyscrapers/high-rises. But that type of development doesn’t always equate to true urbanity.
The high-rise clusters we have in Uptown tend to focus more on the street. With wider sidewalks and plenty of trees.
There’s about 5 (including the new hotel site) strip shopping centers in Uptown. They aren’t very big and I expect them to be replaced overtime with infill development.
The development I’ve been wanting to see start is the Central Market development on the site of the former Albertsons/Minyard’s. It’s right next to the West Village. The project will be 1.7 million square feet and estimated to cost $295 million (probably went up since inflation). It will feature a 25-story tower with three levels of office and 23 levels of multifamily. There will also be a 5-level type IIA multifamily high rise. A total of 800 units with a flagship Central Market store on the bottom level. They’re taking their sweet time with this one though.
1) America's mart is closed off to the public just like the Dallas Market Center
2) Underground... needs to be bulldozed and re-built
3) The walk from MARTA's Arts Center Station to Atlantic Station would not be worth the trip.
1) Eh... Just call the store you need to go to and tell them you're coming, and you'll get a pass. I just did that while shopping for a specific cologne. Didn't take much effort, and I then had access to the entire place.
2) It's in progress.
3) Why not? It's a 15 minute walk through urban blocks. When you get there, you have everything you need. And Atlantic Station is still "Central Atlanta."
Retail could be better in ALL sunbelt "downtowns."
That being said, I've always thought Dallas was underrated here in terms of urban form. Reason I'm a bit defensive on Atlanta is due to the opinion here that it's some suburban mess with a thin linear strip of urbanity, when it's really not the case. It has a big city feel in its core that I don't think is matched by Houston and Dallas. It just FEELS big, and busy, despite the twisty, windy roads.
1) Eh... Just call the store you need to go to and tell them you're coming, and you'll get a pass. I just did that while shopping for a specific cologne. Didn't take much effort, and I then had access to the entire place.
2) It's in progress.
3) Why not? It's a 15 minute walk through urban blocks. When you get there, you have everything you need. And Atlantic Station is still "Central Atlanta."
Retail could be better in ALL sunbelt "downtowns."
That being said, I've always thought Dallas was underrated here in terms of urban form. Reason I'm a bit defensive on Atlanta is due to the opinion here that it's some suburban mess with a thin linear strip of urbanity, when it's really not the case. It has a big city feel in its core that I don't think is matched by Houston and Dallas. It just FEELS big, and busy, despite the twisty, windy roads.
You got to take some of these posts about Atlanta with a grain of salt. Many of those posters are fans of stagnant northeastern cities past their time and they never have anything positive to say about Atlanta.
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