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Location: That star on your map in the middle of the East Coast, DMV
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent_Adultman
It depends on what we're talking about. In terms of character, architecture and classical urbanism, then yes Vancouver is not comparable to the Northeast cities or SF. However, as Jesse said, Vancouver's urban planning style creates one of the most urban feelings on the street you could ask for, regardless of traditional street walls or not. Instead of short mixed-use with retail ground floor and apartments above, Vancouver has walls of retail at 1-2 stories with tower podiums above. It provides at least the same density, if not higher density and on the ground it has the same feeling of hustle and bustle that the NE cities and SF have. You still have a consistent streetwall of storefronts throughout downtown and for miles along many of the corridors outside of downtown.
It's absolutely nothing like Miami at street level and more closely resembles NE cities (although really it's its own thing).
It depends on what we're talking about. In terms of character, architecture and classical urbanism, then yes Vancouver is not up there with the Northeast cities or SF. However, in terms of functional, pedestrian-oriented urbanity, it's right there with them. As Jesse said, Vancouver's urban planning style creates one of the most urban feelings on the street you could ask for, regardless of traditional street walls or not. Instead of short mixed-use with retail ground floor and apartments above, Vancouver has walls of retail at 1-2 stories with tower podiums above. It provides at least the same density, if not higher density and on the ground it has the same feeling of hustle and bustle that the NE cities and SF have. You still have a consistent streetwall of storefronts throughout downtown and for miles along many of the corridors outside of downtown.
It's absolutely nothing like Miami at street level and more closely resembles NE cities (although really it's its own thing).
Nice pictures, though I think that's a very selective list mostly from downtown Vancouver (the peninsula) and not really showing what a common Vancouver neighborhoood actually looks like. I went to school in an area of the city (border between Vancouver east and west), which is roughly 2 miles from downtown via the bus / skytrain. Aside from major intersections, the streetscape is incredibily suburban and spread out for a city that purportedly experiences severe housing/land shortages (this is most likely the cause...). Also, I think we can all agree that the architecture leaves much to be desired compared with NE cities like Montreal, Boston, or even Toronto:
Coming from a former Vancouver resident: this is more of the norm than exception within the city of Vancouver (all within 2 mile radius of downtown):
The Gastown and downtown street views you posted are really beautiful and urban and I wish Vancouver had more of that - but that's an incredibly confined and touristic part of the city.
Nice pictures, though I think that's a very selective list mostly from downtown Vancouver (the peninsula) and not really showing what a common Vancouver neighborhoood actually looks like. I went to school in an area of the city (border between Vancouver east and west), which is roughly 2 miles from downtown via the bus / skytrain. Aside from major intersections, the streetscape is incredibily suburban and spread out for a city that purportedly experiences severe housing/land shortages (this is most likely the cause...). Also, I think we can all agree that the architecture leaves much to be desired compared with NE cities like Montreal, Boston, or even Toronto:
Coming from a former Vancouver resident: this is more of the norm than exception within the city of Vancouver (all within 2 mile radius of downtown):
The Gastown and downtown street views you posted are really beautiful and urban and I wish Vancouver had more of that - but that's an incredibly confined and touristic part of the city.
Vancouver is what's classified as a medium size medium density city. Within that classification it's very urban, on a level far beyond other comparable medium density medium sized cities in North America and its a big part of why it's so livable.
Its biggest weaknesses are architecture, lack of diversity of neighbourhoods (visually/culturally), and lack of landmarks. But as a city overall I think it's in the "goldilocks" zone. I don't think you'll find a more comfortable major city.
Last edited by Differential; 03-31-2020 at 12:25 PM..
Nice pictures, though I think that's a very selective list mostly from downtown Vancouver (the peninsula) and not really showing what a common Vancouver neighborhoood actually looks like. I went to school in an area of the city (border between Vancouver east and west), which is roughly 2 miles from downtown via the bus / skytrain. Aside from major intersections, the streetscape is incredibily suburban and spread out for a city that purportedly experiences severe housing/land shortages (this is most likely the cause...). Also, I think we can all agree that the architecture leaves much to be desired compared with NE cities like Montreal, Boston, or even Toronto:
Coming from a former Vancouver resident: this is more of the norm than exception within the city of Vancouver (all within 2 mile radius of downtown):
The Gastown and downtown street views you posted are really beautiful and urban and I wish Vancouver had more of that - but that's an incredibly confined and touristic part of the city.
All of your links are of the main roads in those neighbourhoods and IMO don't really give a feel for that neighbourhood. Most people live off of those main roads, so I though I would move off your links locations by a block or two, to show what the neighbourhood is like.
Your first link is of Cambie Boulevard. One of the widest streets in the city. Just one block away.
The next link on King Edward, like 16th Ave is an east/west road. As you know, east/west directions in Vancouver is the marker of wealthy and not so wealthy neighbourhoods. This again just one block off will show people how this part off King Edward has homes more tightly together.
Your 5th link of Kingsway, does a good job at showing, what I consider to be one of the ugliest roads in Vancouver. I never liked the streetscape, and always found the angle of the road frustrating when driving in neighbourhoods around it. I lose all sense of direction LOL. I've often said that if you put palm trees on Kingsway, it would fit right at home in LA. However...just one block off.
Next link is of 1st Ave and Victoria Drive. As you know 1st ave is one of THE major streets used to get downtown from the freeway. Just a few blocks away though, this is how people live in that area.
Your last link is of Broadway. Again one of the major roads that traverse Vancouver east/west and varies considerably depending what neighbourhood you are in. One block off.
I hope you don't mind me doing this, but I did it to show just how suburban Vancouver can be outside of downtown ( pockets by Skytrain Stations aside, like Marine Drive and the soon to be upgraded Commercial Street Station).
What all these neighbourhoods have in common are a main shopping street, lots of parks and access to transit. No matter if you are on the wealthier side or not.
Nice pictures, though I think that's a very selective list mostly from downtown Vancouver (the peninsula) and not really showing what a common Vancouver neighborhoood actually looks like. I went to school in an area of the city (border between Vancouver east and west), which is roughly 2 miles from downtown via the bus / skytrain. Aside from major intersections, the streetscape is incredibily suburban and spread out for a city that purportedly experiences severe housing/land shortages (this is most likely the cause...). Also, I think we can all agree that the architecture leaves much to be desired compared with NE cities like Montreal, Boston, or even Toronto:
Coming from a former Vancouver resident: this is more of the norm than exception within the city of Vancouver (all within 2 mile radius of downtown):
The Gastown and downtown street views you posted are really beautiful and urban and I wish Vancouver had more of that - but that's an incredibly confined and touristic part of the city.
Pictures like that cement the notion Vancouver simply doesn't have the urban bones to compete with metro's like Montreal/Philly/DC/Boston. Hell, you could also make legit arguments for both Seattle and Baltimore also having more urban cores than Vancouver as well.
Those cities are simply too built up, over too large of areas at a consistent level.
I agree with the above statement of Vancouver being in the "goldilocks" zone... It's urban enough to genuinely feel like a big city, but not urban enough that its urbanity starts becoming a hinderance to the day to day life of its population.
Vancouver reminds me of a 2/3 scale Seattle. Great downtown and then the overall urbanism/density falls off a cliff until you hit their satellite burbs
Vancouver is simply doesn't have the urban bones/architecture to compete with metro's like Montreal/Philly/DC/Boston which are historically built differently and more densely
You could also make legit arguments for both Seattle and Baltimore also having more urban cores than Vancouver as well.
Right, and while Vancouver is becoming increasingly urban, it doesn't seem to have a strong argument for a placement for top among the top 7 most urban cores of North America.
Right, and while Vancouver is becoming increasingly urban, it doesn't seem to have a strong argument for a placement for top among the top 7 most urban cores of North America.
It's definitely top 20 if we are including the big Mexican/Canadian/Caribbean cities
It's definitely top 20 if we are including the big Mexican/Canadian/Caribbean cities
I can definitely believe top 20--I just don't see top 7 being in the cards. I think the inclusion of all North American cities really throws the whole discussion in for a loop. Another poster and I were talking about what is almost certainly going to be the top and almost inarguable position which would be Manhattan and then taking the area of that, especially given that it's a discernible "unit" with a lot of compiled stats, and then trying to compile a similar area (~22-23 square miles) with existing fairly common divisions for other cities. Thus far, we've got NYC, Mexico City, and Havana and these are pretty hard to beat given their population densities and even a loose correlation with other urban features that go with such. Those three are pretty much shoe-ins on that criteria as are Santo Domingo and Chicago. I haven't run the stats on those two, though I think I have a workable list of divisions for Chicago. That's five right there and leaves only two more slots with one of those two almost certainly being Toronto.
Sorry but every city has suburban areas, not sure why posting pictures of Vancouver's suddenly discredits its urban development?
Shall I post some similar areas in DC? Seattle? Boston?
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