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I didn't say Denver is ahead of MSP. I said they are peers. There are just too many variables -- some favor MSP, others Denver.
You still haven't presented any evidence for why MSP is so clearly ahead of Denver other than the fairly marginal (in the grand scheme of things) population gap.
It's a peer in the sense that they are in a relatively similar tier, but MSP is unquestionably more important than Denver.
I'm still struggling to get an answer to why everyone thinks Denver is so important. You're leaning heavily on an airport and sports teams for Denver's importance outside of Colorado...
It's a peer in the sense that they are in a relatively similar tier, but MSP is unquestionably more important than Denver.
I'm still struggling to get an answer to why everyone thinks Denver is so important. You're leaning heavily on an airport and sports teams for Denver's importance outside of Colorado...
People have already answered what Denver brings to the table in this thread. You're the one who keeps limiting Denver to just a regional city that offers nothing but Sports and an airport.
It's a peer in the sense that they are in a relatively similar tier, but MSP is unquestionably more important than Denver.
I'm still struggling to get an answer to why everyone thinks Denver is so important. You're leaning heavily on an airport and sports teams for Denver's importance outside of Colorado...
I haven't said a word about sports teams. I have explained my reasoning upthread if you care to read it.
Now that you mention it, tbough, they do both have 5 major pro sports teams -- further lending support to the notion that these are peer cities.
Also, FWIW, I know at least 4 people from both personal and professional circles that have moved to Denver and most of my friends have been to Denver at least once. I dont know a single person who has ever been to MSP. Does that mean that Denver is more, or as, important? Of course not, but it does show that Denver is much more well entrenched in the national consciousness, which is somewhat relevant in the overall picture.
Adding Concord, Gastonia, Rock Hill is definitely a more accurate representation of Charlottes population, they are no more detached than Bell Air is to Baltimore.
Baltimore has 2.27 million in 717 sq. miles
Bell Air has 223k in 131 sq. miles Total UA: 2.50 million in 848 sq. miles.
Charlotte's has 1.49 million in 747 sq. miles
Rock Hill has 117k in 95 sq. miles
Gastonia has 185k in 138 sq. miles
Concord has 228k in 183 sq. miles Total UA: 2.02 million in 1,163 sq. miles
Oh trust me, I'm not arguing that Clt has passed Bmore yet. This is the same thing as the Det/MSP argument, the way I view it----->Clt and Bmore are absolutely peer cities at this point. But Baltimore is the incumbent with the legacy and historical importance and isn't exactly beyond repair; Charlotte would have to prove across a variety of factors that it has supplanted Baltimore...
Charlotte has more or less caught up to Baltimore, but it'll probably be another decade at least before it leaps Baltimore. They are in the same tier of cities but the burden of proof is on Charlotte to show it has built the ecosystem to jump ahead of Baltimore...
Oh trust me, I'm not arguing that Clt has passed Bmore yet. This is the same thing as the Det/MSP argument, the way I view it----->Clt and Bmore are absolutely peer cities at this point. But Baltimore is the incumbent with the legacy and historical importance and isn't exactly beyond repair; Charlotte would have to prove across a variety of factors that it has supplanted Baltimore...
Charlotte has more or less caught up to Baltimore, but it'll probably be another decade at least before it leaps Baltimore. They are in the same tier of cities but the burden of proof is on Charlotte to show it has built the ecosystem to jump ahead of Baltimore...
People have already answered what Denver brings to the table in this thread. You're the one who keeps limiting Denver to just a regional city that offers nothing but Sports and an airport.
I just reviewed all posts related to what Denver brings to the table (#25, 30, and 87 are the substantial ones, and a few others with a sentence thrown in) I'm still completely unconvinced.
It's the same arguments again and again...and they are either weak (airport, sports, lack of competition/middle of nowhere) or completely overstated (corporate hub, prominent in certain industries). Really unconvincing compared to MSP or San Diego.
Adding Concord, Gastonia, Rock Hill is definitely a more accurate representation of Charlottes population, they are no more detached than Bell Air is to Baltimore.
Baltimore has 2.27 million in 717 sq. miles
Bell Air has 223k in 131 sq. miles Total UA: 2.50 million in 848 sq. miles.
Charlotte's has 1.49 million in 747 sq. miles
Rock Hill has 117k in 95 sq. miles
Gastonia has 185k in 138 sq. miles
Concord has 228k in 183 sq. miles Total UA: 2.02 million in 1,163 sq. miles
I would agree. The Aberdeen/Bel Air UA is about as connected to Baltimore's as Huntersville/Mooresville/Statesville's is to the rest of Charlotte.
I just reviewed all posts related to what Denver brings to the table (#25, 30, and 87 are the substantial ones, and a few others with a sentence thrown in) I'm still completely unconvinced.
It's the same arguments again and again...and they are either weak (airport, sports, lack of competition/middle of nowhere) or completely overstated (corporate hub, prominent in certain industries). Really unconvincing compared to MSP or San Diego.
I'm not arguing that Denver is ahead of either the Twin Cities or San Diego but I would also say they are in the same general tier. I'd say Denver having such a large geographic regional sphere of influence as the largest city of quite an isolated urban corridor, and being well within the interior of the continent and not very prone to natural disasters are notable factors that are components of its importance. This is why it that corridor has a pretty solid presence across a wide variety of sectors like transportation/logistics, telecommunications, finance, tech, aerospace, energy, defense, etc. and it also has the largest concentration of federal government agencies outside of DC.
I'm not arguing that Denver is ahead of either the Twin Cities or San Diego but I would also say they are in the same general tier. I'd say Denver having such a large geographic regional sphere of influence as the largest city of quite an isolated urban corridor, and being well within the interior of the continent and not very prone to natural disasters are notable factors that are components of its importance. This is why it that corridor has a pretty solid presence across a wide variety of sectors like transportation/logistics, telecommunications, finance, tech, aerospace, energy, defense, etc. and it also has the largest concentration of federal government agencies outside of DC.
One other thing to note on Denver vs Phoenix/SD is that it's been a large city for much longer. Denver crossed 100k in the 1890 census (same as Minneapolis). SD did in 1930 and Phoenix only in 1950.
And as to federal agencies, Denver is the seat of both a Federal Circuit Court of Appeals and a regional branch of the Federal Reserve Bank. Phoenix and SD host neither.
More reasons why I find Denver and MSP neck in neck, with Phoenix/SD a small step behind.
Last edited by Fitzrovian; 05-12-2020 at 06:12 AM..
Interesting catch, in this poll SD has now passed Phx and was running more neck and neck, but in the 11-15 poll Phx had more votes than SD in a runaway...
I do think people's perception can be changed in threads like these, when you eliminate the top competition (which in 11-15 was chiefly Mia and Sea, followed by Det and MSP). Not the case in every situation but clearly that had an effect on how people view Phx and SD when other cities are eliminated from consideration...
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