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The homes on the 400 block of S. Serrano Avenue are there for a reason. They are all from the early 20th century and are all on the National Register Of Historic Places. So no matter how dense and how many apartments are around, those beautiful homes will remain.
Considering the entire LA metro area only has around 1 million black people out of 18+ million people, I strongly doubt around 70% of the black people in the entire LA metro area live in only 50 sq. miles. That would be insane segregation.
He gave a decent estimate that was slightly off, realistically, which I'm addressing below...
Quote:
Originally Posted by BostonBornMassMade
None of that sounds even kind of accurate. Can you post a map?
I'm gonna be honest- I just went to a map with 2015-2019 data. I crunched the numbers myself...
Within the area you named there are 16 census tracts that are 70% or more black. Those 16 tracts account for 66,842 people.
Then lets add in the View Park/Windsor hills tracts that are over 70% black. Theres 4 of them. They total 19,008.
So in all of the LA CSA, you have 20 census tracts that are 70% or more black and they number 85,850.
So out of 18 milion people in Greater LA about .047% live in an area thats 70% or more black.
Out of the ~1,2000,000 black people in the LA CSA about 65,000 are black people who live in a 70%+ black census tract. About 5.4% of all black people live in an area like that in LA.
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'700,000+ 70% black + LA' doesnt not compute
Finally, I should add only 12 of these census tracts are contiguous. the population of the largest pockets of 70% contiguous tracts is about 55,000 people.
LA has less peak blackness intensity than even some smaller New England metros. It has no census tracts that are 90%+ black.
I actually think this probably serves to make LA feels blacker or bigger for black people as the population is super spread out and visible. This leads to higher comfortability and normalcy throughout the Los Angeles region.
Regardless, LA is a large suburban area and not all that urban as a city. Thats part of the appeal.
The online infatuation with Black Angelenos, and the influence and impact Black LA has overall on the city of Los Angeles, is only paralleled by the online infatuation with calling Los Angeles a "suburban" city...
Neither reflect reality or the general conversations people have every day about LA, but I digress...
This same topic came up on another board about nine months ago, as its come up on here at least once a year for a decade, so I took the liberty to map out the "heart" of Black Los Angeles. Centered on Crenshaw Blvd, there's a radius that is slightly geographically larger than Syracuse, NY (~27 mi²) and with a larger population (~336,000) than many popular, major core cities like St Louis, Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, that LA maintains exactly 50.2% black population...
This geographic 27 mi² area isn't a perfect circle but includes nearly all of the South LA portions west of Vermont, to all of North Inglewood even extending slightly beyond Downtown Inglewood, to northern and eastern sections of Gardena and Hawthorne, reaching into Ladera and brushing Culver...
This was mapped via 2019 population estimates. This is a small area compared to the cities with the largest black populations, but still "blacker" than most cities, as again, this is a population of over 50% black in a comparable size to StL, Cincy, Pgh (which none of these cities are over 50% black), on smaller land than all, which means a higher density of black folk than all but the biggest cities, and the motivation in mapping this out was to illustrate that no one from anywhere can spend any measurable time in the heart of Black LA and feel like there's a muted black presence in LA...
There are plenty of majority black neighborhoods in this 27 mi² bubble right now, in 2021, "majority" being defined as over 50% population, "neighborhoods" being defined as official neighborhoods recognized by the city of Los Angeles, not some arbitrary made up stuff you want or some random barometer of who is 70% black or not. Just some of the neighborhoods in this radius of Black LA are North Inglewood (52.2% black), Morningside (79.6% black), the Inglewood Bottoms (60.7% black), Gramercy Park (72.8% black), West Athens (53.3% black), Ladera Heights (70% black), Manchester Square (68.3% black), Hyde Park (53.9% black), View Park-Windsor Hills (79.2% black), Baldwin Hills-Crenshaw (52.8% black), Leimert Park (66.3% black), and a plethora of neighborhoods that are contiguous with the majority black neighborhoods, that have either a plurality black population or a black population exceeding 30%...
This is using 2019 numbers, so while you scoff at the Mapping LA feature that hasn't been updated since '09, it isnt terribly difficult to map these areas out today...
Lost in all of this is that being from Boston, and having a reputation of decrying those on here as minimizing Boston's scope of blackness, is that its unbecoming of you to do that to LA which you detest done of Boston. Furthermore, to your point on continually minimizing LA as a "real" urban city, Boston's tiny geography means the development and density of Boston certainly is matched and exceeded in LA, even if the built form you guys orgasm over and transit infrastructure is different; other hallmarks of what contributes to urbanity exist aplenty...
My impression when I went to Boston, was that it was a slightly less developed San Francisco, with more nodes of quietness and inactivity than a pro-East Coast board such as this would lead to believe, and certainly stands in stark contrast to Los Angeles and San Francisco, which is packed with more going on in most measurable parallel comparables between the two...
And you live in Baltimore, which certainly isn't the most enthralling urban experience. As I said earlier, you're entitled to your opinions, but you can relax this crusade against LA because the fact is its clearly amongst the five most urban major cities when people eliminate bias and conjecture and weigh all these places objectively...
He gave a decent estimate that was slightly off, realistically, which I'm addressing below...
The online infatuation with Black Angelenos, and the influence and impact Black LA has overall on the city of Los Angeles, is only paralleled by the online infatuation with calling Los Angeles a "suburban" city...
Neither reflect reality or the general conversations people have every day about LA, but I digress...
This same topic came up on another board about nine months ago, as its come up on here at least once a year for a decade, so I took the liberty to map out the "heart" of Black Los Angeles. Centered on Crenshaw Blvd, there's a radius that is slightly geographically larger than Syracuse, NY (~27 mi²) and with a larger population (~336,000) than many popular, major core cities like St Louis, Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, that LA maintains exactly 50.2% black population...
This geographic 27 mi² area isn't a perfect circle but includes nearly all of the South LA portions west of Vermont, to all of North Inglewood even extending slightly beyond Downtown Inglewood, to northern and eastern sections of Gardena and Hawthorne, reaching into Ladera and brushing Culver...
This was mapped via 2019 population estimates. This is a small area compared to the cities with the largest black populations, but still "blacker" than most cities, as again, this is a population of over 50% black in a comparable size to StL, Cincy, Pgh (which none of these cities are over 50% black), on smaller land than all, which means a higher density of black folk than all but the biggest cities, and the motivation in mapping this out was to illustrate that no one from anywhere can spend any measurable time in the heart of Black LA and feel like there's a muted black presence in LA...
There are plenty of majority black neighborhoods in this 27 mi² bubble right now, in 2021, "majority" being defined as over 50% population, "neighborhoods" being defined as official neighborhoods recognized by the city of Los Angeles, not some arbitrary made up stuff you want or some random barometer of who is 70% black or not. Just some of the neighborhoods in this radius of Black LA are North Inglewood (52.2% black), Morningside (79.6% black), the Inglewood Bottoms (60.7% black), Gramercy Park (72.8% black), West Athens (53.3% black), Ladera Heights (70% black), Manchester Square (68.3% black), Hyde Park (53.9% black), View Park-Windsor Hills (79.2% black), Baldwin Hills-Crenshaw (52.8% black), Leimert Park (66.3% black), and a plethora of neighborhoods that are contiguous with the majority black neighborhoods, that have either a plurality black population or a black population exceeding 30%...
This is using 2019 numbers, so while you scoff at the Mapping LA feature that hasn't been updated since '09, it isnt terribly difficult to map these areas out today...
Lost in all of this is that being from Boston, and having a reputation of decrying those on here as minimizing Boston's scope of blackness, is that its unbecoming of you to do that to LA which you detest done of Boston. Furthermore, to your point on continually minimizing LA as a "real" urban city, Boston's tiny geography means the development and density of Boston certainly is matched and exceeded in LA, even if the built form you guys orgasm over and transit infrastructure is different; other hallmarks of what contributes to urbanity exist aplenty...
My impression when I went to Boston, was that it was a slightly less developed San Francisco, with more nodes of quietness and inactivity than a pro-East Coast board such as this would lead to believe, and certainly stands in stark contrast to Los Angeles and San Francisco, which is packed with more going on in most measurable parallel comparables between the two...
And you live in Baltimore, which certainly isn't the most enthralling urban experience. As I said earlier, you're entitled to your opinions, but you can relax this crusade against LA because the fact is its clearly amongst the five most urban major cities when people eliminate bias and conjecture and weigh all these places objectively...
This is all nice and interesting. 27 square miles at 50% black isn't 50 square miles at 70% black. Ultimately, it is a relative drop in the bucket (which is why it is more comparable to Boston than DC) of the 4 million in LA and the 18 million people and the vastness of the area. That's the entire point. Everything else is people extrapolating and talking about other stuff that's mostly related to feelings of the LA black community being slighted. I already stated my position on this in an earlier post.
This is about urbanity and the urban experience/feel, not demography.
So in regards to Boston's urbanity, it's pretty much full of commercial corridors throughout. But because there's no outdoor dining, happy hour, or late-night stuff it's a different type of vibrancy that is more daytime based and practical rather than nightlife/social. There is lots of social life and nightlife but it's in specific areas and indoors, it's more of a collection of in-group scenes. The heavy snow/cold also cools the vibe.
As a city, Boston is more vertical, denser, and more multi-used than LA as a city-which is mostly just boring and residential. The LA Metro is much much more urban than the Boston one. But Boston as a city and maybe even if you include the nearby/adjacent urban cities is more urban than all of what constitutes Los Angeles. When someone tells me they grew up in Boston I know they grew up in a traditionally urban environment.
Boston is not very like San Francisco outside of size IMO.
Last edited by BostonBornMassMade; 01-16-2021 at 09:55 AM..
So in regards to Boston's urbanity, it's pretty much full of commercial corridors throughout. But because there's no outdoor dining, happy hour, or late-night stuff it's a different type of vibrancy that is more daytime based and practical rather than nightlife/social. There is lots of social life and nightlife but it's in specific areas and indoors, it's more of a collection of in-group scenes. The heavy snow/cold also cools the vibe.
As a city, Boston is more vertical, denser, and more multi-used than LA as a city-which is mostly just boring and residential.
I disagree with this. Boston is very nodal in layout, it is largely organized into "Squares" and have usually narrow strips of commercial activity surrounded by residential areas. Take JP for instance, much of the commercial activity is centered on Centre St surrounded by sleepy residential areas. And this is one of the more trendy neighborhoods in the city with subway access.
This is not significantly different compared to Seattle's outer neighborhoods like Alaska Junction along California Ave. In fact, JP is considerably less dense in commercial activity:
I disagree with this. Boston is very nodal in layout, it is largely organized into "Squares" and have usually narrow strips of commercial activity surrounded by residential areas. Take JP for instance, much of the commercial activity is centered on Centre St surrounded by sleepy residential areas. And this is one of the more trendy neighborhoods in the city with subway access.
This is not significantly different compared to Seattle's outer neighborhoods like Alaska Junction along California Ave. In fact, JP is considerably less dense in commercial activity:
Interesting. I wonder what the LA and DC equivalents would be to those? They don't look too dissimilar from Silver Lake or Los Feliz in LA, but I don't think that's quite it.
I disagree with this. Boston is very nodal in layout, it is largely organized into "Squares" and have usually narrow strips of commercial activity surrounded by residential areas. Take JP for instance, much of the commercial activity is centered on Centre St surrounded by sleepy residential areas. And this is one of the more trendy neighborhoods in the city with subway access.
This is not significantly different compared to Seattle's outer neighborhoods like Alaska Junction along California Ave. In fact, JP is considerably less dense in commercial activity:
You’re talking about high activity nodes though. There at least 1, if not 3, in every single neighborhood and there’s 21 neighborhoods. That’s what I meant by throughout And many more win central areas.. what more do you want? The city is dotted with squares
Anyways how can you seriously show that picture of Jamaica Plain like that’s what most of Jamaica Plain is like?
You’re talking about high activity nodes though. There at least 1, if not 3, in every single neighborhood and there’s 21 neighborhoods. That’s what I meant by throughout And many more win central areas.. what more do you want? The city is dotted with squares
Anyways how can you seriously show that picture of Jamaica Plain like that’s what most of Jamaica Plain is like?
Dude you just linked a Streetview of project housing in JP. It doesn’t actually show anything about density of commercial area in JP, which is mostly along Centre St as I said earlier.
I didn't show any picture or Streetview, I just showed a Google map of JP along Centre St and let the readers here explore themselves. That picture you see is just what Google comes up with when you search for JP.
My point is a lot of cities have neighborhood commercial strips and nodes. It’s not a unique phenomenon of Boston or what makes Boston more urban. Even less dense and more car centric cities like Seattle have oodles of them and one in every neighborhood.
Dude you just linked a Streetview of project housing in JP. It doesn’t actually show anything about density of commercial area in JP, which is mostly along Centre St as I said earlier.
I didn't show any picture or Streetview, I just showed a Google map of JP along Centre St and let the readers here explore themselves. My point is a lot of cities have neighborhood commercial strips and nodes. It’s not a unique phenomenon of Boston or what makes Boston more urban. Even less dense and more car centric cities like Seattle have oodles of them and one in every neighborhood.
I went back and added a few more pics in but see how ridiculous it is when you add on me extreme picture? The street view I was suggested was Jamaica Pond.
Boston is unique in that if the 3rd most densely populated major city, so if “everyone else has it”, it’s not producing the same results.
I went back and added a few more pics in but see how ridiculous it is when you add on me extreme picture? The street view I was suggested was Jamaica Pond.
Boston is unique in that if the 3rd most densely populated major city, so if “everyone else has it”, it’s not producing the same results.
I didn't show any picture or Streetview in my earlier post, I literally just linked a Google *map* of JP along Centre St and let the readers here explore themselves. That picture you see is just what Google comes up with when you search for JP.
The homes on the 400 block of S. Serrano Avenue are there for a reason. They are all from the early 20th century and are all on the National Register Of Historic Places. So no matter how dense and how many apartments are around, those beautiful homes will remain.
Yep, and go one block in any direction from there and you're hitting much denser, multi-unit structures that are the predominant form of the neighborhood. Even if one were to live in one of the historic SFHs on that block, you're still living in a denser, more urban neighborhood with more restaurants, bars, retail, etc. available within a 15 minute walk or 10 minute walk or even 5 minute walk than the vast majority of DC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BostonBornMassMade
This is all nice and interesting. 27 square miles at 50% black isn't 50 square miles at 70% black. Ultimately, it is a relative drop in the bucket (which is why it is more comparable to Boston than DC) of the 4 million in LA and the 18 million people and the vastness of the area. That's the entire point. Everything else is people extrapolating and talking about other stuff that's mostly related to feelings of the LA black community being slighted. I already stated my position on this in an earlier post.
This is about urbanity and the urban experience/feel, not demography.
So in regards to Boston's urbanity, it's pretty much full of commercial corridors throughout. But because there's no outdoor dining, happy hour, or late-night stuff it's a different type of vibrancy that is more daytime based and practical rather than nightlife/social. There is lots of social life and nightlife but it's in specific areas and indoors, it's more of a collection of in-group scenes. The heavy snow/cold also cools the vibe.
As a city, Boston is more vertical, denser, and more multi-used than LA as a city-which is mostly just boring and residential. The LA Metro is much much more urban than the Boston one. But Boston as a city and maybe even if you include the nearby/adjacent urban cities is more urban than all of what constitutes Los Angeles. When someone tells me they grew up in Boston I know they grew up in a traditionally urban environment.
Boston is not very like San Francisco outside of size IMO.
Good point about Boston where you know someone who is from Boston proper lived in an urban setting wheres that may not be true for LA or even DC, Chicago or NYC though more so for LA where the legal boundaries include a lot of parts that are very suburban. However, I think more interesting is to talk about the expanse of area that is urban even if outside of a city's official boundaries. I would think that a discussion of how urban Boston is would be incomplete without also including the very urban and contiguously so parts of Cambridge, Somerville, or Brookline. Conversely, taking just an average of LA's city proper doesn't tell you that much since how suburban Bel Air in Los Angeles doesn't have much bearing on the large and contiguous urban core that LA has which also reaches into other municipalities like West Hollywood (which is technically a different city).
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