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I read a website with DTD having 19,000 plus and DTH having 16,000 plus so those numbers are a bit outdated. Still that's obviously very low and needs improvement.
I agree 100%. But we’re heading in the right direction. A few new residential towers are on the way (including a 47 story tower that’s about to start later this year) and obsolete office space is being converted into residential. Dallas is about to see a lot of new construction with all the vacant buildings repurposed.
I agree 100%. But we’re heading in the right direction. A few new residential towers are on the way (including a 47 story tower that’s about to start later this year) and obsolete office space is being converted into residential. Dallas is about to see a lot of new construction with all the vacant buildings repurposed.
both DTH and DTD are repurposing and building them up but they still need some road diets in theri respective downtowns.
While not listed in this particular tool, I actually did a search for Rochester’s downtown population last night after your comment about Rochester lacking a Wegmans downtown/the figure of 20,000 residents that you heard retailers like to target.
Downtown Rochester appears to have 8,500 permanent residents (up from ~6,000 in 2013), surprisingly larger than some cities with seemingly more vibrant downtowns such as Buffalo, Columbus, Tampa, Raleigh and Salt Lake City. Although the workforce population has dropped slightly from 50,000 to 48,000, the amount of projects in the pipeline suggest the center city area should surpass 10k before mid-decade.
This is all per the Rochester Downtown Development Corporation, however I cross referenced their figures with 2020 Census data by tract and it’s pretty accurate. So the question remains - why such a lack of retail?
It's a great topic, but I'd suggest radius population or something more standardized.
As the source says, his data is apples to oranges. Some are tiny areas and some are gigantic. He doesn't provide maps or square mileage, so it's hard to even guess what the numbers represent.
I tried to pick a relatively central point downtown in each city. Cleveland and Buffalo includes large areas of open water on Lake Erie. I don't know the pedigree of the population numbers, but likely not 2020 or later. It does give a good comparison among cities, however.
While not listed in this particular tool, I actually did a search for Rochester’s downtown population last night after your comment about Rochester lacking a Wegmans downtown/the figure of 20,000 residents that you heard retailers like to target.
Downtown Rochester appears to have 8,500 permanent residents (up from ~6,000 in 2013), surprisingly larger than some cities with seemingly more vibrant downtowns such as Buffalo, Columbus, Tampa, Raleigh and Salt Lake City. Although the workforce population has dropped slightly from 50,000 to 48,000, the amount of projects in the pipeline suggest the center city area should surpass 10k before mid-decade.
This is all per the Rochester Downtown Development Corporation, however I cross referenced their figures with 2020 Census data by tract and it’s pretty accurate. So the question remains - why such a lack of retail?
Generally, the wealth of the surrounding communities isn't considered high enough by site locators to support major retail, as compared to wealth surrounding other regional shopping areas. Also, downtown retail is considered by some shoppers to be less desirable than big box and big mall car centric places.
*Orlando was a surprise for me! Wow, amazing residential numbers downtown.
I've been preaching this for quite a while. When I lived in the area, it became clear to me how populated the downtown core is. Easy to miss if just passing through on a visit though.
agreed. for my city (Birmingham), just using the 2020 Census Demographic Data Map Viewer to select certain census tracts, i get at least 7,000 residents (and possibly 10,000 depending how generous you want to be with the definition of "downtown".
(using the same method, Memphis is more in the 10-12,000 range as opposed to 24,000).
Shocking to me how low density most midwestern cities are. New Bedford MA has as many 15,000+ PPSM tracts than St Louis (2), Cleveland (1), Detroit (1) and Cincinnati (6)combined.
Albany has 5, Lowell Mass has 11, Portland Maine has 4, 3 above 20,000.
Last edited by btownboss4; 07-06-2022 at 03:55 PM..
Generally, the wealth of the surrounding communities isn't considered high enough by site locators to support major retail, as compared to wealth surrounding other regional shopping areas. Also, downtown retail is considered by some shoppers to be less desirable than big box and big mall car centric places.
This is so true. DT St. Louis has been looking for a Target, Nordstrom Rack or a Burlington. Too much blight to the north, poverty to the east and spotty poverty to the immediate south. City Target chose the south end of Midtown for their first urban location in the area.
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