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Hey all, I am a single 29m. I have been in tech for 3 years and currently looking to move. After doing a ton of research and narrowing things down I kept coming back to Denver and I've been heavily applying for 2-3 weeks. I've visited several times and enjoyed the city.
Im outdoorsy. mostly biking and hiking. I havent done much winter sports, but that is a lot due to the fact I grew up in FL and now live in Durham, NC.
While I am applying to Denver I keep thinking about Sacramento as a possible extra city to apply to, but I havent because I just have never been and I am not going to be able to right away. Im trying to land something asap really since its the first quarter. I am finding Denver's job market very competitive, but I've had a couple phone screenings and one interview.
I dont know how the CoL compares. I know Sacramento is good for CA, but that doesnt mean its cheaper then Denver. Since I am single, I hope to move somewhere with good young professional culture for making friends and dating.
What draws me to Sacramento is the scenary. Its more green and the forests nearby are lush. Denver is right next to the Rockies which is fantastic. I love the mountain scene from Denver.
Maybe if I opened up my job search to Sacramento, Id also apply to Reno.
But overall if I am making about $60k with plans to make more in the future. Im wondering if Sacramento is doable. Also if the crime/homlessness if worse. I saw a video of someone biking through a bunch of tents in Sac.
Sacramento Ive heard is sunnier, but more rain. Denver has more snow. Both have great access to the outdoors. However monday-friday probably more intown biking and food/drinks scene will matter a lot.
Any thoughts?
The one thing about Sacramento I have noticed is that is more married and family-oriented than the typical large city.
I remember being in Midtown Sacramento which has some nice restaurants and coffee houses is that almost everyone goes to coffee, dinner or enjoying the nightlife with their husband/wife, friends or family.
Denver seems much more transient in my opinion.
Neither Denver or Sacramento are cities that I would enjoy, but personally I would prefer Sacramento.
Sacramento rents are quite a bit lower than Denver and your usage of utilities will likely be much less because of the moderate climate in Sacramento
Sacramento rents on average are about 14% lower than in Denver for the average 1 bedroom apartment.
Utility usage will be lower in Sacramento because the morning lows are much warmer in the winter than in Denver and the summers are fairly similar.
Sacramento is much, much, much lusher city than Denver. Sacramento has tremendous variety in trees and the trees are extremely dense in many cities.
Denver planted alot of trees in many of the older neighborhoods but a majority of the area can look extremely dry. About 1/2 of the Denver just looks like miles, miles and miles of hay with a few elms, cottonwoods and poplars if they have one of their legendary dry periods.
Denver has better access to foothills, but Sacramento is easier to get to big mountains.
When I was in Sacramento it seemed like the homeless population is much, much older on average than Denver.
In regards to crime rates, Sacramento is about average. Denver has major crime issues and it seems to ignore crime much more than Sacramento.
Sacramento is also an extremely, extremely clean city. In my opinion, Sacramento is by far the cleanest city in Sacramento overall.
Sorry. didn't mean to slight Sacramento. OP has been talking about Denver for quite a bit and I think it's a mountain (pun intended) he needs to climb. It's where he wants to be.
Lol, no worries.
BTW, folks, a great train trip, I think the most scenic Amtrak trip in the nation is Sacramento to Denver, best part is through the California Sierras and through the Colorado Rockies.
I lived in CA for many years, and while I would never move back, I will admit that people in most of CA are cheerful, friendly and positive, which makes it rather easy to strike up conservation with other people while out and about. People in CA are sociable, too, which means that you will probably receive more invitations to events and outings (as a new resident) in CA than in most other places. Sacramento has the added bonus of being rather conservative, patriotic and religious (as far as large cities in CA are concerned), which I personally enjoyed. In fact, I would argue that people in much of inland CA are more outwardly religious than people in the Raleigh-Durham area.
I have never lived in Denver (or anywhere else in CO, for that matter), but from my interactions with people who do, I am under the impression that people in Denver are not particularly outgoing or sociable, which is a common issue in cities with lots of upper-middle-class transplants. Also, CO seems to attract transplants from other “rootless†areas of the country (e.g., FL, the Pacific NW, northern New England, the DMV area, etc.). As a result, people seem to live in Denver for a few years and then move on to some other transient paradise (e.g., Austin, Phoenix, Portland, etc.). I suspect that you will be required to make new friends every few years, if you relocate to Denver and live there for many years, which is less than ideal, in my opinion.
I lived in CA for many years, and while I would never move back, I will admit that people in most of CA are cheerful, friendly and positive, which makes it rather easy to strike up conservation with other people while out and about. People in CA are sociable, too, which means that you will probably receive more invitations to events and outings (as a new resident) in CA than in most other places. Sacramento has the added bonus of being rather conservative, patriotic and religious (as far as large cities in CA are concerned), which I personally enjoyed. In fact, I would argue that people in much of inland CA are more outwardly religious than people in the Raleigh-Durham area.
I have never lived in Denver (or anywhere else in CO, for that matter), but from my interactions with people who do, I am under the impression that people in Denver are not particularly outgoing or sociable, which is a common issue in cities with lots of upper-middle-class transplants. Also, CO seems to attract transplants from other “rootless†areas of the country (e.g., FL, the Pacific NW, northern New England, the DMV area, etc.). As a result, people seem to live in Denver for a few years and then move on to some other transient paradise (e.g., Austin, Phoenix, Portland, etc.). I suspect that you will be required to make new friends every few years, if you relocate to Denver and live there for many years, which is less than ideal, in my opinion.
Interesting to see Phoenix, Austin and Portland grouped in with Denver with a transient paradise title. I agree with Austin and the data seems to support a high % of movers, Denver is 14th similar to Boston (which has a high college population), Portland is around 22nd which is lower than Sacramento, and Phoenix is all the way down at 31st ranking similar to Baltimore, Cleveland and Milwaukee.
There are some great spots in Sac (Hot Boys for fried chicken sandwichs, the bakery in Landpark, the name is escaping me, Zeldas for deepdish pizza) The bar/club scene is quite lively on weekends as well.
You can also see the mountains from parts of Denver. This isn't true for Sac.
OK sorry gonna put on my Sac homer hat here (love Denver btw):
Freeport Bakery, lots of Sacramentans have eaten their cakes for special occasions over the years and have deep nostalgia for them. And close to Marie's too which is a fantastic donut place.
Quibble about seeing the mountains: except for the eastern suburbs, Sacramento is in a flat valley so it's hard to see through our tree cover to the mountains. But on a clear winter day if you're more than a couple stories up you can see hundreds of miles of the snow capped Sierra, it's really gorgeous.
I know Denver has the bigger population but I enjoy Sacramento's core more. Yes, less tall office buildings but it's much more pleasant - very walkable, tons of trees and cafes etc scattered everywhere. More DC, Paris, Boston instead of Manhattan, SF's downtown, Houston's downtown, etc.
For access to nature, Denver is truly world class but so is Sac: in 90 mins or less I can be skiing at one of a dozen Tahoe resorts, climbing multipitch granite, whitewater paddling, at the beach in Bodega or Point Reyes. And in town Sac has world class dedicated bike trails running along the American River Parkway, with hundreds of acres of parks up and down the stretch through the metro. Oh and lakes Natoma and Folsom for sailing/kayaking/boarding. My friend drives 15 mins from his house in the city and is catching salmon on the American.
What else? Sac has by far a better food scene - more diverse and super fresh fish, fruit, veggies make a huge difference. Being in zone 9a allows for beautiful gardens and diverse plants all around town, and long veggie growing seasons. And it's been discussed to death but having the Bay Area so close is a huge asset.
It's hard for me not to evangelize Sac I love it so, but at the same time I always hesitate at doing posts like this because I'm wary of the crazy growth some of the other hype cities have gotten and us Sacramentans are generally a modest bunch, all kinda lowkey committed to keeping it under the radar. Average home price in Denver: 550K, average in Sac: 450K. No contest imo.
For OP, one of the main things to tilt you to Denver will probably be getting back to family in the east. SMF is a great airport but obviously doesn't compare to Denver, and if you're regularly flying back those long flights with a connection do suck. That said, there are directs to all the major east coast cities and tons of directs to hubs like DEN, ORD, ATL.
Again for OP: for the Sacramento job market look for some government jobs. CA State/Sac County/Sac City. Sometimes you have to come in via a role 'beneath you' but if you're good you can move up quickly. Entry level IT salaries will be at least 55K and you could probably get much closer to 100K within a few years. The subreddit CAstateworkers also has good info and a helpful community.
A breakdown of the process and browse through open state jobs here:
Also check out medical systems and school systems. True for Denver also, but for Sac look at Sutter Health, Kaiser, VSP, UC Davis, and CSUS. And our local electric utility SMUD. All solid jobs with benefits, and you can use the stability and skills you learn through these jobs to act as a platform to work into some of the more lucrative 'high tech' jobs that are all over the Bay.
Forbes ranked Sacramento has the #1 best city to live in California.
Wall Street Journal named Sacramento's Airport has the best medium sized airport in the nation.
It may be the best in California. Nationally, US News puts Sacramento as number 122 of the 150 best metro areas in the US for '22-'23, Denver comes in at 55.
OK sorry gonna put on my Sac homer hat here (love Denver btw):
Freeport Bakery, lots of Sacramentans have eaten their cakes for special occasions over the years and have deep nostalgia for them. And close to Marie's too which is a fantastic donut place.
Quibble about seeing the mountains: except for the eastern suburbs, Sacramento is in a flat valley so it's hard to see through our tree cover to the mountains. But on a clear winter day if you're more than a couple stories up you can see hundreds of miles of the snow capped Sierra, it's really gorgeous.
I know Denver has the bigger population but I enjoy Sacramento's core more. Yes, less tall office buildings but it's much more pleasant - very walkable, tons of trees and cafes etc scattered everywhere. More DC, Paris, Boston instead of Manhattan, SF's downtown, Houston's downtown, etc.
For access to nature, Denver is truly world class but so is Sac: in 90 mins or less I can be skiing at one of a dozen Tahoe resorts, climbing multipitch granite, whitewater paddling, at the beach in Bodega or Point Reyes. And in town Sac has world class dedicated bike trails running along the American River Parkway, with hundreds of acres of parks up and down the stretch through the metro. Oh and lakes Natoma and Folsom for sailing/kayaking/boarding. My friend drives 15 mins from his house in the city and is catching salmon on the American.
What else? Sac has by far a better food scene - more diverse and super fresh fish, fruit, veggies make a huge difference. Being in zone 9a allows for beautiful gardens and diverse plants all around town, and long veggie growing seasons. And it's been discussed to death but having the Bay Area so close is a huge asset.
It's hard for me not to evangelize Sac I love it so, but at the same time I always hesitate at doing posts like this because I'm wary of the crazy growth some of the other hype cities have gotten and us Sacramentans are generally a modest bunch, all kinda lowkey committed to keeping it under the radar. Average home price in Denver: 550K, average in Sac: 450K. No contest imo.
For OP, one of the main things to tilt you to Denver will probably be getting back to family in the east. SMF is a great airport but obviously doesn't compare to Denver, and if you're regularly flying back those long flights with a connection do suck. That said, there are directs to all the major east coast cities and tons of directs to hubs like DEN, ORD, ATL.
Again for OP: for the Sacramento job market look for some government jobs. CA State/Sac County/Sac City. Sometimes you have to come in via a role 'beneath you' but if you're good you can move up quickly. Entry level IT salaries will be at least 55K and you could probably get much closer to 100K within a few years. The subreddit CAstateworkers also has good info and a helpful community.
A breakdown of the process and browse through open state jobs here:
Also check out medical systems and school systems. True for Denver also, but for Sac look at Sutter Health, Kaiser, VSP, UC Davis, and CSUS. And our local electric utility SMUD. All solid jobs with benefits, and you can use the stability and skills you learn through these jobs to act as a platform to work into some of the more lucrative 'high tech' jobs that are all over the Bay.
Denver is safe for a major city? The homicide rates and violent crime have surged in Denver.
Denver is a high-crime city and additionally Denver has lots of high-crime suburbs like Lakewood, Aurora, Commerce City, Federal Heights and the list goes on and on.
Sacramento is a moderate crime city but a majority of it's suburbs have extremely low crime rates.
Rancho Cordova which is likely the "roughest suburb" is far, far, far safer than Aurora in Colorado overall.
Sacramento has much less violent crime than Denver.
I also think Sacramento is an extremely clean city if one is not on the trails along the river.
Sacramento is a moderate crime city, if one would were compare the large cities then Sacramento would be in the middle.
Denver had 100 homicides in 2021 and Colorado in the auto theft capital of America
Sacramento had 57 homicides in 2021 and Sacramento has much lower rates of auto theft.
Sacramento has extremely easy access to the mountains via Interstate 80 and there are other roads like US-50 that go to South Lake Tahoe also.
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