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North Florida is quite Southern. No other way to describe places like Jacksonville and Tallahassee.
Texas has its Southern pockets also, mostly in the eastern part of the state. But first and foremost, Texas is just Texas. I've read that a lot of Texans readily identify themselves as Texans and not really as Southerners, but if you ask many of them if they are Southerners, they'll say they are.
North Florida is quite Southern. No other way to describe places like Jacksonville and Tallahassee.
Texas has its Southern pockets also, mostly in the eastern part of the state. But first and foremost, Texas is just Texas. I've read that a lot of Texans readily identify themselves as Texans and not really as Southerners, but if you ask many of them if they are Southerners, they'll say they are.
That's true but I'm talking about the overall state. A percentage of both states may be southern but it's not like the other states in the region.
That's true but I'm talking about the overall state. A percentage of both states may be southern but it's not like the other states in the region.
Very few states are like "any other" in the region. Many have independent characteristics...including Deep South states like Louisiana and South Carolina. The South is not, nor has ever really been, a monolithic region. It is one more bonded by history and culture and other traits -- self-identification perhaps most important -- that easily distinguish it from other regions.
Very few states are like "any other" in the region. Many have independent characteristics...including Deep South states like Louisiana and South Carolina. The South is not, nor has ever really been, a monolithic region. It is one more bonded by history and culture and other traits -- self-identification perhaps most important -- that easily distinguish it from other regions.
With all due respect, your case is weak...
Regions are just states with similar a culture, history, and geographical location lumped together for the purpose generalization. None of the states in the South are exactly the same just like none the states in the Pacific West are the same and none of the states in the Midwest or the Northeast are the same. Anyone who believes otherwise is ignorant and shouldn't be taken seriously.
Texas is BOTH Southern AND Southwestern. If Houston is considered a Southern city, BUT El Paso is considered a SOUTHWESTERN city, THEN TX is in BOTH regions, instead of one. Therefore Texas is considered BOTH. It wouldn't be LOGICAL if Texas was considered to be in just ONE of the regions. It's way to big, so wouldn't make sense. And Fort Worth's city slogan is, "where the west begins".
LOL We have this discussion before, Polo...and what is being talked about is the overall regional affiliation. Other than the trans-pecos (which has always been a bit different from the rest of the state) the primary identity is South, not Southwest (as in New Mexico and Arizona "southwest"). Even in West Texas cities like Midland and Lubbock, there is a tremendous history and pattern of Southern character not at all present in the true SW.
The Fort Worth slogan? It has been taken totally out of original context. It didn't even originate with Fort Worth, for one thing (it sprang from an 1911 poem that had nothing to do with Texas). Many locales made claim to being "where the West begins." But it didn't mean it took on a whole different regional affiliation. For instance, St. Louis with its arch and "Gateway to the West". It didn't translate into that one was leaving the Midwest...just entering into a certain new "post-bellum frontier" part of the country.
Likewise, in the case of Ft. Worth, it meant entering into a "new South". A "Western South" if you will, where Southern ways were blended with frontier western aspects. Different from the "Old South" of cotton being undisputed king (although it is important to note that cotton, not cattle, remained the "staple" of Texas agriculture).
This is evidenced quite a bit by the fact Dallas responded by calling themselves "Where the East Ends". Note it didn't say where the South ends, but where the "east" ends.
Oh well, like I say, we have done this before and, really, we are not necessarily in total disagreement. Just a matter of many degrees! LOL
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