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And you seem to be falling into the trap of believing that Canadian cities are diverse merely for larger proportions of Asians or more recent immigrant groups.
If that doesn't apply for Canada, wouldn't that just mean it's less diverse? Because it has two less ethno-racial groups than the US does, generally? While the US has plenty of comparable diversity within it's European and Asian populations, and typically has a higher mixed black/white/hispanic/asian population?
Oklahoma City has a large share of Hispanic, African, White, and Asian populations (a pretty sizable Vietnamese population), as well as a relatively heavy outlying Native American presence. It has all of the various white American ethnic groups you describe, so I don't know why you would claim it doesn't. The US has more Greeks proportionally than Canada does, so...
The point is, you're still talking about a largely assimilated mix of white ethnicities in both Ottawa and Oklahoma City, and mainly just a larger Asian minority proportion in Ottawa. In the US, the broad ethno-racial makeup of the city is split 4/5 ways instead of just two.
And it's not true that cities of 1-1.5 million in the US don't have anything like that. What on earth? The white population in the US is less broadly English and French to begin with.
I tend to not weight proportions as much, because in a small society like Canada, you only need a comparatively small amount of people to make a dent in the Canadian population.
Accounting for the differences in categorization between the American and Canadian census', both Ottawa and Oklahoma City are roughly comparable in terms of how diverse they are:
Oklahoma City:
White: 62.7% (56.7% Non-Hispanic White)
Black or African American: 15.1%
Native American: 3.5%
Asian: 4.0% (1.7% Vietnamese, 0.7% Indian)
Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander: 0.1%
Some other race: 9.4%
Two or more races: 5.2%
Hispanic or Latino (of any race): 17.2% (14.2% Mexican, 0.7% Guatemalan)[62]
Again, I tend to favor the typical 4 way ethno-racial split in much of America as more diverse than the typical "European White/Asian with a few scattered ethnic groups on the side" makeup that you see in Canada.
Ottawa has one third of its metro that operates in a language other than English. I am talking city council, garbagemen, cops, firemen, K-12 schools, colleges and universities, transit systems, movie theatres, shopping malls, road repair crews, media, McDonald's and Home Depot.
Ottawa has one third of its metro that operates in a language other than English. I am talking city council, garbagemen, cops, firemen, K-12 schools, colleges and universities, transit systems, movie theatres, shopping malls, road repair crews, media, McDonald's and Home Depot.
I understand your point, A. But I'll bet DC easily has one quarter to one third of its population that that operates in another language other than English. Perhaps not in colleges and universities, but, on an unofficial basis (as there is no official language in the US), certainly in K-12 schools, city council, cops, firefighters, movie theaters, shopping malls, road repair crews, media, and Home Depot.
Heck, there are parts of Nashville in which the community operates in a language other than English in all the above categories.
Last edited by newdixiegirl; 05-28-2020 at 09:43 AM..
I understand your point, A. But I'll bet DC easily has one quarter to one third of its population that that operates in another language other than English. Perhaps not in colleges and universities, but, on an unofficial basis (as there is no official language in the US), certainly in K-12 schools, city council, cops, firefighters, movie theaters, shopping malls, road repair crews, media, and Home Depot.
Heck, there are parts of Nashville in which the community operates in a language other than English in all the above categories.
I get that, but French in Quebec is on a whole other level. And so you work a Home Depot in French (including internal processes, etc.) and then you get the guy who comes in to service the sprinkler system does everything in French including paperwork, etc. Then the alarm goes off and the cops come by and it's all in French again. Then the city issues a boil water advistory - that is in French too. Then your kids' school calls about something and that's also in French. You go home later and file your tax return - in French too.
It's basically an entire modern middle class existence without really bumping into Englishs at all except maybe hearing a song by Lady Gaga playing on the radio.
You don't really have this level of integration with, say, Spanish, anywhere in the U.S. Even in places where 90% or more are Hispanic, English has quite a bit more penetration.
Obviously some people in the U.S. live without English. But there is a price to be paid for that.
I get that, but French in Quebec is on a whole other level. And so you work a Home Depot in French (including internal processes, etc.) and then you get the guy who comes in to service the sprinkler system does everything in French including paperwork, etc. Then the alarm goes off and the cops come by and it's all in French again. Then the city issues a boil water advistory - that is in French too. Then your kids' school calls about something and that's also in French. You go home later and file your tax return - in French too.
It's basically an entire modern middle class existence without really bumping into Englishs at all except maybe hearing a song by Lady Gaga playing on the radio.
You don't really have this level of integration with, say, Spanish, anywhere in the U.S. Even in places where 90% or more are Hispanic, English has quite a bit more penetration.
Obviously some people in the U.S. live without English. But there is a price to be paid for that.
I think you'd be surprised.
I teach ESL part-time, and I know that even in a city like Nashville, let alone DC, there are communities in which residents live full lives for decades, with active occupations/professions and middle-class existences, barely speaking English.
You can drive through blocks and blocks of neighborhoods, go into the local businesses, where English isn't seen or heard, and where employees are unable to communicate in English. Bilingualism (English/Spanish) is a preferred, if not required, qualification for more jobs than you'd expect, and the trend seems to be growing. This isn't DC (or Miami, NYC, LA, Chicago, or El Paso, TX). It's Nashville, TN.
Last edited by newdixiegirl; 05-28-2020 at 10:41 PM..
I teach ESL part-time, and I know that even in a city like Nashville, let alone DC, there are communities in which residents live full lives for decades, with active occupations/professions and middle-class existences, barely speaking English.
You can drive through blocks and blocks of neighborhoods, go into the local businesses, where English isn't seen or heard, and where employees are unable to communicate in English. Bilingualism (English/Spanish) is a preferred, if not required, qualification for more jobs than you'd expect, and the trend seems to be growing. This isn't DC (or Miami, NYC, LA, Chicago, or El Paso, TX). It's Nashville, TN.
What kinds of middle class occupations or professions would allow one to not bump into the English language on a daily basis in some way (written or spoken) though? I am curious to know.
I get that maybe a shopkeeper in a wholly Hispanic neighbourhood (selling mostly to that clientele) who works super-hard might be able to eke out a pretty good living without speaking much English at all. They'd need some help for certain administrative things though: tax filing, permits, dealings with suppliers and utilities and such.
Aside from that? Most middle class jobs would be bank teller, schoolteacher, nursing, etc. positions. You need English for all those even if your clientele or specialty is related to the Hispanic community.
I'd say your typical Spanish-only occupation in the U.S. (and this includes in places that are heavily Hispanic) is lower end or working class. Cleaning ladies, cooks, manual labourers, etc. Stuff where don't need to deal with words much in any form, and even in many cases interactions with people outside your immediate work crew is limited.
Even if you work at the U.S. headquarters of Banco Popular de Santa Banana in Miami, while you might speak Spanish much of the day, you still need to know English.
This is not a fair comparison... DC is the size of Paris and Ottawa is the size of Helsinki. Despite the highly touted diversity I found Ottawa to be rather insipid and the climate bad compared to American cities of similar size.
Ottawa has one third of its metro that operates in a language other than English. I am talking city council, garbagemen, cops, firemen, K-12 schools, colleges and universities, transit systems, movie theatres, shopping malls, road repair crews, media, McDonald's and Home Depot.
That doesn't make it "more diverse", not ethnically or racially. Not really even culturally - the predominance of two language blocks notwithstanding.
That doesn't make it "more diverse", not ethnically or racially. Not really even culturally - the predominance of two language blocks notwithstanding.
Oh, it most definitely makes a difference culturally and even ethnically.
I am not one to say people don't know what they are talking about, but my sense is you don't fully grasp the way things are here.
Though I don't think I actually said that that necessarily makes the Ottawa area "more diverse". Diversity can be measured in a variety of ways.
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