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Old 03-25-2010, 11:11 AM
 
Location: Washington, DC area
11,108 posts, read 23,693,095 times
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From my short time in the DC area, I think the MSA of Baltimore is exaggerated while the MSA of DC is shortchanged.

Most people that commute from the suburbs in Anne Arundel and Howard Counties commute to metro DC, not Balt.
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Old 03-25-2010, 11:41 AM
 
Location: Northridge, Los Angeles, CA
2,684 posts, read 7,349,385 times
Reputation: 2409
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainrock View Post
Thats unfortunate. I'm sorry you feel this way.
It's not like I've not been to the East Coast to see Philadelphia. After all, I lived a year in Staten Island, NY. I personally always thought that Mercer County was the dividing line between NYC metro and Phily metro, based on radio stations alone (after all, its easy to see the distance of an FM transmitter rather than the waves of a TV satellite).

However, its not like the CSA is without merit. Most people in this thread (and on CD) have agreed that San Jose-San Francisco should have been designated as one metro.

MTC -- Maps and Data -- County-to-County Commute Patterns
According to the MTC, 11.773% of commuters from Santa Clara county work OUTSIDE of Santa Clara County (in 2000). This is an increase of 2.6% from 1990, when only 9.2% of Santa Clara County commuters worked outside Santa Clara County.

However, 18.8% of total commuters that commute to Santa Clara County on a daily basis live in counties outside of Santa Clara. This doesn't deviate that much from the nor//www.city-data.com/forum/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=13445051m. I got this number by adding up all the number of people who commute from other Bay Area counties to Santa Clara County, then divided it by the amount of Bay Area commuters to Santa Clara county in total.

Here's a nice little report detailing the trends of commuting to Silicon Valley
http://www.mtc.ca.gov/maps_and_data/...iconvalley.pdf

It's pretty clear that the East Bay and Peninsula are sending more people to Santa Clara County than San Francisco, but somehow they're considered two different metro areas?

When the BART opens to Santa Clara County, how many more commuters do you think Santa Clara County contributes to the rest of the Bay Area? Why is it strictly seen as a downtown SF-downtown SJ sort of thing? How about Fremont to San Jose? Fremont to SJ (15 miles) is way closer than Fremont to SF (40 miles).

It's funny though because before I came to this site, I never thought SF-SJ were in different metro areas. My friends from San Jose were way more defensive about the Bay Area than the people who were from San Francisco.

Quote:
30 seconds of TV ad-space could buy you 300 minutes of radio ad-space. Radio is becoming a neglected medium in the age of technology/ mass communication.

That being said. Keep in mind that Philly actually has 7 radio markets within what could be construed as a "CMSA", you know those endless geographical expanses that people like to brag they are part of?

Radio markets in the Philly region.
Philadelphia
Trenton
Wimington
Atlantic City
Reading
Lacaster
Allentown
First, they aren't all 'endless geographical expanses' because the Bay Area CSA is in fact smaller than most other cities MSA. San Francisco and San Jose metro APART are way smaller than most other cities MSA by themselves! Let's do a comparison

San Francisco Bay Area - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Bay Area CSA: 8,757 sq. mi
San Francisco MSA: 3,241 sq. mi (Marin, Contra Costa, Alameda, San Francisco, and San Mateo Counties)
San Jose MSA: 2,695 sq. mi (of which, 1391 sq. mil are San Benito County, most of which is impossible to build on)

New York MSA: 6,720 sq. mi (source: New York metropolitan area - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)
Los Angeles MSA: 4,850 sq. mi (Greater Los Angeles Area - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)
Chicago MSA: 9,581 sq. mi (source: Chicago metropolitan area - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)
Dallas MSA: 9.286 sq. mi (source: Dallas – Fort Worth metroplex - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)
Houston MSA: 10,062 sq. mi (source: Greater Houston - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)
Philadelphia MSA: 5,118 sq. mi (source: Delaware Valley - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)


I think I got my point across. San Francisco's MSA is way smaller than the mean for how big government MSA's, but apparently the CSA is too big even though its in fact smaller than Chicago, Dallas, and Houston's MSA. That makes a LOT of sense.

Most of San Francisco's CSA is either underwater (San Francisco Bay) or too mountainous to build on (or unwilling to build on).

However, most Bay Area residents and posters here know the truth and that's what matters the most.

Second of all, if your theory on radio is correct, then how come there are more listeners of radio than TV watchers in ALL markets? After all, we are just dealing with FM waves, as opposed to what could be endless TV satellite range?
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Old 03-26-2010, 01:59 AM
 
2,330 posts, read 4,381,702 times
Reputation: 375
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcmo View Post
From my short time in the DC area, I think the MSA of Baltimore is exaggerated while the MSA of DC is shortchanged.

Most people that commute from the suburbs in Anne Arundel and Howard Counties commute to metro DC, not Balt.
That trend is going to change within the next 10 years.......
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Old 04-08-2010, 07:32 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX/Chicago, IL/Houston, TX/Washington, DC
10,138 posts, read 15,928,719 times
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Wow, Miami is really gaining a lot of people.
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Old 04-08-2010, 08:22 PM
 
515 posts, read 981,105 times
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Anyone who thinks that San Francisco and San Jose are separate, independent functioning metropolitan areas is seriously delusional (and probably never visited the Bay Area).

Woodland Avenue (in the linked map below), is the boundary between San Mateo County (and the San Francisco MSA) and Santa Clara County (and the San Jose MSA). As you can see, it slices through an established - albeit wealthy - neighborhood.

Your web browser and the Maps site are incompatible

And here is the boundary between Contra Costa County (and the San Francisco MSA) and Santa Clara County (the San Jose MSA) - the property line of the houses between Buskirk Street and Pagosa Way.

Your web browser and the Maps site are incompatible

Its clear that the boundaries cut through relatively dense suburban neighborhoods, arbitrarily spitting them between two supposed metropolitan areas. This really doesn't exist in many other places in the country.
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Old 04-08-2010, 08:35 PM
 
26 posts, read 23,502 times
Reputation: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackout View Post
here are the latest estimates for csas of over 2 million.

01. New york-newark-bridgeport, ny-nj-ct-pa 22,232,494
02. Los angeles-long beach-riverside, ca 17,820,893
03. Chicago-naperville-michigan city, il-in-wi 9,804,845
04. Washington-baltimore-nova, dc-md-va-wv 8,440,617
05. Boston-worcester-manchester, ma-ri-nh 7,609,358
06. San jose-san francisco-oakland, ca 7,427,757
07. Dallas-fort worth, tx 6,805,275
08. Philadelphia-camden-vineland, pa-nj-de-md 6,533,122
09. Houston-baytown-huntsville, tx 5,968,586
10. Atlanta-sandy springs-gainesville, ga-al 5,831,778
11. Miami-fort lauderdale-pompano beach, fl 5,547,051
12. Detroit-warren-flint, mi 5,327,764
13. Phoenix-mesa-scottsdale, az 4,364,094
14. Seattle-tacoma-olympia, wa 4,158,293
15. Minneapolis-st. Paul-st. Cloud, mn-wi 3,604,460
16. Denver-aurora-boulder, co 3,110,436
17. San diego-carlsbad-san marcos, ca 3,053,793
18. St. Louis-st. Charles-farmington, mo-il 2,892,874
19. Cleveland-akron-elyria, oh 2,891,988
20. Orlando-deltona-daytona beach, fl 2,747,614
21. Tampa-st. Petersburg-clearwater, fl 2,747,272
22. Pittsburgh-new castle, pa 2,445,117
23. Sacramento--arden-arcade--yuba city, ca-nv 2,436,109
24. Charlotte-gastonia-salisbury, nc-sc 2,389,763
25. Portland-vancouver-beaverton, or-wa 2,241,841
26. Cincinnati-middletown-wilmington, oh-ky-in 2,214,954
27. Kansas city-overland park-kansas city, mo-ks 2,136,653
28. San antonio, tx 2,072,128
29. Indianapolis-anderson-columbus, in 2,064,870
30. Columbus-marion-chillicothe, oh 2,031,229
dc boston dallas and bay area over philly?

Are you kidding me? Its like putting scranton over new york metro (btw goooooooooo poconoes!!)
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Old 04-08-2010, 09:38 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX/Chicago, IL/Houston, TX/Washington, DC
10,138 posts, read 15,928,719 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFdeliveryguy View Post
dc boston dallas and bay area over philly?

Are you kidding me? Its like putting scranton over new york metro (btw goooooooooo poconoes!!)
Yeah, I didn't see DC coming.
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Old 04-08-2010, 09:45 PM
 
Location: Rockville, MD
3,546 posts, read 8,528,950 times
Reputation: 1389
Quote:
Originally Posted by SFdeliveryguy View Post
dc boston dallas and bay area over philly?

Are you kidding me? Its like putting scranton over new york metro (btw goooooooooo poconoes!!)
Yes, comparing DC, Boston, Dallas or SF to Philadelphia is exactly like comparing Scranton to NYC. Perfect comp there.
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Old 04-08-2010, 11:22 PM
 
Location: The City
22,379 posts, read 38,665,395 times
Reputation: 7974
Just out of curiousity is there any 2009 urban core numbers; I think MSA covers too much land area let alone CSA; and honestly on the Philly topic; Reading always seemed like Reading and AC is AC - yes these areas are somewhat regionally attached but still very different. Population and Density will be debated perpetually on here (Yes the core of Philly and NYC would fit well inside the MSA of Houston but who cares); so that being said I feel the urban core is the truest measure of cities but again that is my opinion; around here KOP is the burbs and not really city living so why would it be considered part of the city. City life is different, some people like it some people don't
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Old 04-08-2010, 11:27 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX/Chicago, IL/Houston, TX/Washington, DC
10,138 posts, read 15,928,719 times
Reputation: 4047
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidphilly View Post
Just out of curiousity is there any 2009 urban core numbers; I think MSA covers too much land area let alone CSA; and honestly on the Philly topic; Reading always seemed like Reading and AC is AC - yes these areas are somewhat regionally attached but still very different. Population and Density will be debated perpetually on here (Yes the core of Philly and NYC would fit well inside the MSA of Houston but who cares); so that being said I feel the urban core is the truest measure of cities but again that is my opinion; around here KOP is the burbs and not really city living so why would it be considered part of the city. City life is different, some people like it some people don't
I wonder the same thing.
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