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I should add one important observation to my comment in post 30.
Foreigners who invest in U.S. assets, whether real estate, corporations, stocks, even Treasury obligations, potentially always will take the associated income out of our economy.
E.g., the Chinese actually have been reducing their massive holdings of U.S. Treasuries.
This means that the tens of billions of interest income earned on these obligations are being repatriated to China, if not invested in other U.S. assets. It's unlikely that the Chinese government, which holds much of this debt as foreign reserves, are reinvesting their income in the U.S. economy.
Just these interest payments are a massive drain on the U.S. economy. Imagine if $20 billion was instead invested in U.S. infrastructure. Economists will tell you that such expenditures have a large "multiplier effect." In a general economy, it can be 3 times or more. E.g., each job created to improve infrastructure will create 2-3 other jobs.
Rather than spend money on infrastructure and domestic investment, since the beginning of WWII, the U.S. has spent massive amounts of money on policing the world. This is a decisive change in American history, and a great departure from the norm where military spending was minimal and domestic investment was preeminent.
Note that in the three decades following the American Civil War, the federal government massively reduced its debt even as the economy expanded even more massively.
Compare this with the history after WWII, and especially beginning in 1980, when the Reagan administration and the Republicans in practice abandoned their historical fiscal prudence and slashed tax rates and increased borrowing, largely to support increased military spending.
Meanwhile, with the "opening" of China, U.S. corporations invested immense amounts of capital in the Chinese economy.
The bottom line is that the U.S. went from the world's greatest creditor nation in 1980 to its current status as the world's greatest debtor nation in history.
The U.S. government and society in the last 7 plus decades, and especially since 1980, not only has squandered much of the nation's inherited wealth, but has spent or encumbered much of the wealth of future generations.
This is why Cleveland and its suburbs are in decline. Our great industries have been eviscerated by poor federal policies, which have enriched the relative few and increasingly impoverished most Americans.
I don't exclude Democrats from responsibility for this state of affairs. They also are extremely culpable. It's just that when the Republicans went over to the dark side fiscally, and when its historic isolationist wing was crushed, much hope was lost. Think George W. Bush as the epitome of contemporary Republican political philosophy. I don't see much difference between George W. and most of the current Republican Presidential candidates, who seem anxious to borrow money to increase our military posture while cutting taxes further.
It's likely only a matter of time before the U.S. loses its ever-declining status as a reserve currency, at which time the American public for the first time will learn the true horrors of the political Kool-Aid they've been fed by our politicians and media for the last 3 plus decades. Think Greece or Argentina writ large, as the U.S. no longer will be able to borrow in U.S. dollars. At which point, and better yet, NOW, the American people had better say, "NO MORE," just more emphatically.
Is there a solution? What are you doing to protect yourself and your family?
I'm not talking 40-50 yeas ago per say, I'm talking mid 80's vs now. If comparing Willoughby to Eastlake, aging, outmoded housing stock lack of well-paying industrial jobs applies to both areas, so why is Willoughby in better shape than Eastlake? One is lead to believe that Wal-mart is a contributing factor in that particular location. Granted there are many wal-marts in many locations which were constructed in the 80's and that location is still doing great to this day. What I'm saying is that for Eastlake in particular, the construction of that Wal-mart on Vine St. was a bad idea for the overall wellness of that particular community. Thankfully, Eastlake has a marina and homes that are on lake front property.
Mentor is an interesting little trinket all on its own. At one time, Mentor used to have 2 Cinemas at the Mentor mall, now everyone goes to the Cinema in Willoughby and has been for the last 10+ years or so. Mentor mall use to also be much more thriving, now it's a ghost town in comparison to what it was 10+ years ago. Yet despite all of this, Mentor is still a very stable area, much better than Euclid or Eastlake. Those business on Tyler Blvd aren't going anywhere.
The general housing stock in Willoughby on average is better than in Eastlake, e.g., where the apartment complexes off Vine St. aren't very upscale, and even as reflected in home values. The charm of Willoughby's downtown area also surpasses anything in Eastlake, and upscale condos have been built in downtown Willoughby as a result. Having the Lake West Medical Center also has been a major boon for Willoughby.
My hunch is that most persons in Eastlake would laugh at your claim that the Walmart Supercenter is a key factor in the relative decline of Eastlake. A more informed analysis certainly might mention the Classic Park financial boondoggle and its negative impact on the city's services and finances. By contrast, that Eastlake Walmart is the draw that makes what's left of Eastlake's Vine St. commercial district viable.
Your representations about Mentor movie theaters and Mentor also are perplexing, kindly said.
Atlas Cinema adjacent to Great Lakes Mall has stadium seating and it competes very effectively with the theater complex in Willoughby. I've never heard anybody say that they would drive further to Willoughby to avoid that Mentor complex. I've been to both complexes and I wouldn't drive to Willoughby if I lived closer to the Mentor complex if the movie of interest was being shown at both theater complexes.
The Diamond Center 16 complex off Heisley Road near Route 2 also seems to do very well. How many cities of Mentor's size have two large and viable theater complexes these days?
Mentor is the sixth largest retail center in Ohio and seems to remain a major store location destination for retailers. That's pretty amazing for a city of 50,000.
Most enclosed malls in the U.S. have flawed business models early in the 21st century with the increase in internet shopping and big box retailers. The Great Lakes Mall additionally must deal with the large increase in retail capacity just in Mentor in the last two decades.
Candidly, your arguments remind me of your ridiculousness in the past about the decline of Beachwood Mall.
You can keep piling it on, but most informed persons won't find the smell appealing.
Is there a solution? What are you doing to protect yourself and your family?
One solution is to become more politically involved and knowledgeable. Personally, I think we need a massive tax reform with a value-added tax being substituted for other taxes and a massive reduction on our world policing commitment, all with an emphasis on restoring our manufacturing competitiveness.
I'm not a financial adviser, so I don't want to offer financial strategies here, and it would be off topic. I'm certain there are forums, perhaps even on city-data.com, where such discussions take place. There are many books on the topic. I will tell you it's a minefield IMO.
The general housing stock in Willoughby on average is better than in Eastlake, e.g., where the apartment complexes off Vine St. aren't very upscale, and even as reflected in home values.
Good point. I mean just look at Tamarac and Stone Pointe apartments in Willoughby and compare them to what's on Vine St. It's not even a comparison. Willoughby certainly has done better for itself over the years.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative
My hunch is that most persons in Eastlake would laugh at your claim that the Walmart Supercenter is a key factor in the relative decline of Eastlake. A more informed analysis certainly might mention the Classic Park financial boondoggle and its negative impact on the city's services and finances. By contrast, that Eastlake Walmart is the draw that makes what's left of Eastlake's Vine St. commercial district viable.
I know several people that live off Vine st. that when asked what is the cause of the decline, they point to Wal-mart. Such is the reason for why I mentioned it. First hand testimonies. I mean, the fact that at this juncture Wal-mart of all places is what causes the draw to Vine St. kind of reinforces my point. That's what it's come to. This would never have happened under Morris Becker.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative
Your representations about Mentor movie theaters and Mentor also are perplexing, kindly said.
Atlas Cinema adjacent to Great Lakes Mall has stadium seating and it competes very effectively with the theater complex in Willoughby. I've never heard anybody say that they would drive further to Willoughby to avoid that Mentor complex. I've been to both complexes and I wouldn't drive to Willoughby if I lived closer to the Mentor complex if the movie of interest was being shown at both theater complexes.
The Diamond Center 16 complex off Heisley Road near Route 2 also seems to do very well. How many cities of Mentor's size have two large and viable theater complexes these days?
Mentor is the sixth largest retail center in Ohio and seems to remain a major store location destination for retailers. That's pretty amazing for a city of 50,000.
Most enclosed malls in the U.S. have flawed business models early in the 21st century with the increase in internet shopping and big box retailers. The Great Lakes Mall additionally must deal with the large increase in retail capacity just in Mentor in the last two decades.
I didn't think Atlas Cinema was doing as well since the theatre construction in Willoughby. Every time I would visit when I lived out of state, family suggested going to Willoughby because it was better. I knew that Diamond Center was certainly not being effected by Willoughby, but didn't think Atlas was doing as well. Guess that's not the case. While all malls are dealing with their flawed business models, Mentor mall is a shell of what it once was. Although I don't ever recall anything like this ever happening there, in contrast to Beachwood:
Candidly, your arguments remind me of your ridiculousness in the past about the decline of Beachwood Mall.
You can keep piling it on, but most informed persons won't find the smell appealing.
No need for any of that. Much like the Beachwood Mall, the comments made on these Lake County areas were based on actual personal experience, of which you obviously had a different personal experience. Happens all the time. Good to hear that you are holding in down in Mentor though. I'm in that neck of the woods from time to time.
I know several people that live off Vine st. that when asked what is the cause of the decline, they point to Wal-mart. Such is the reason for why I mentioned it. First hand testimonies. I mean, the fact that at this juncture Wal-mart of all places is what causes the draw to Vine St. kind of reinforces my point. That's what it's come to.
"Walmart of all places???" Walmart is one of the most desirable anchor tenants in the U.S., and yet you continue to belittle it as if it were some second-rate dollar store.
As always, several people you know are the source of your expertise, even when they make nonsensical claims.
Understandably, however, Eastlake officials were grateful to land a Walmart Supercenter.
Vine St. would be a much more marginal shopping district without that Walmart Supercenter, and that generally is acknowledged in Eastlake.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmodder
While all malls are dealing with their flawed business models, Mentor mall is a shell of what it once was. Although I don't ever recall anything like this ever happening there, in contrast to Beachwood
Stating that Great Lakes Mall is a "shell of what it once was" is a gross exaggeration of reality. While traffic isn't as robust as late in the 20th century, it remains a very viable regional mall. E.g., it has a double Dillard's store, perhaps the largest department store in Greater Cleveland with four combined floors of goods.
Beachwood Mall remains the premier upscale shopping mall in northeast Ohio and yet you argued, based on isolated incidents, that it was going to go the way of the now defunct Randall Park Mall. The fact that its owners are trying to expand Beachwood Mall was irrelevant to you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmodder
Much like the Beachwood Mall, the comments made on these Lake County areas were based on actual personal experience, of which you obviously had a different personal experience.
Your statements, when challenged, often are based on "personal experience" or on comments by friends, acquaintances and family members.
The problem is that these statements, whether based on your experience or second-hand information, often are divorced from factual reality.
E.g., in your post 40, your wrote: "Mentor used to have 2 Cinemas at the Mentor mall, now everyone goes to the Cinema in Willoughby and has been for the last 10+ years or so."
That certainly implies that currently there are no theater complexes in Mentor. Yet in your post 44, you write as if you were totally familiar with the fact that there are two large theater complexes in Mentor, and you admit that you knew that NOT everyone goes to the Cinema in Willoughby. Who would blame anyone for believing that you just are throwing into posts claims on matters with which you have little or no knowledge, and then, when challenged, offer contradictory and convoluted explanations for your misstatements of fact?
This isn't new. and it gets very, very old and aggravating.
Actually the what is now Atlas location on 7850 Mentor Ave closed in 2004 and it reopened in 2007.
The other theatre right by the mall, Erie Commons closed in 1998, located at 8057 W. Plaza Boulevard
So from 2004-2007, there was NO theatre at Mentor mall.
It slipped my mind that the location did open back up in 07, but that doesn't change the fact that from that 04-07 time period, people who use to go to Mentor mall area to watch movies were instead going Willoughby, or at least a good portion of them.
And yes, despite all this, Great Lakes Mall is indeed no where close to the amount of traffic it use to have 10 some years ago. Is it as bad as Richmond mall, no, but time will tell.
As for wal-mart, you praise it being one of the desirable anchor tenants in the U.S. and yet there are websites like peopleofwalmart.com and the like to belittle it. Walmart is not the bargin you might think it is. I'd love to hear Eastlake officials response to this article:
Now before anyone accuses me of using this as proof that the eastern suburbs are in decline, which it's not, I do have to say that this is some freaky crime. These have got to be some truly professional thieves taking advantage of naive college freshmen studying in a university in a quiet secluded suburb and a major upscale shopping mall off a major interstate highway. The police have got to catch these felons and the communities involved had better set up crime watches if they haven't already. One has to be vigilant even among the trees and trimmed grass nowadays.
The criminals probably were no stranger to the theft that runs rampant at Beachwood place (as indicated by the police reports) and deduced that the security at that mall is rather lacking. They then put together a plan to steal a vehicle from a kid at the nearby college to use as the getaway car which could not be linked back to them.
Now for someone that has no interest in potentially being ran over while shopping at Saks, they may be inclined to simply not shop at such a location as Beachwood Place.
And for the locals that think that these types of incidents aren't going to continue to happen, I think it's time to wake up. These incidents DO happen and they will CONTINUE to happen, no matter how much someone tries to sugarcoat it and sweep the facts under the rug for fear of the truth being exposed. Let's take a look at a sample of some police reports surrounding beachwood place.
Quote:
Shoplifting, Cedar Road: A police report shows a woman was arrested on a theft charge around 5:40 p.m. Jan. 14 at Beachwood Place Mall. Police said the woman tried to steal $100 worth of merchandise from Sephora.
Shoplifting, Cedar Road: A police report shows two juveniles were arrested on a theft charge around 2:05 p.m. Jan. 15 at Beachwood Place Mall. Police said the juveniles tried to steal $870 worth of merchandise from Sephora. The police report shows the juveniles are also facing a criminal damage charge.
Shoplifting, Cedar Road: A police report shows a woman was arrested on theft and receiving stolen property charges around 3:15 p.m. Jan. 16 at Beachwood Place Mall. Police said the woman is suspected of stealing $40 in merchandise from Claire's and of receiving stolen merchandise from Forever 21 worth about $30.
Grand theft, Cedar Road: A police report shows a woman was arrested on a grand theft charge around 1:55 p.m. Jan. 17 at Beachwood Place Mall. Police said the woman is suspected of concealing two leather jackets and leaving Nordstrom without paying for the merchandise worth $1,256.65. The police report states the woman appear to have been in violation of a Shaker Heights Municipal Court order that banned her from entering Beachwood Place.
Theft from vehicle, Cedar Road: A police report shows a woman told police around 7:50 p.m. Jan. 17 that her purse containing a zipper wallet, Social Security card and school identification card had been stolen from an unsecured vehicle at Beachwood Place Mall. The report shows the incident occurred between 6:40 and 6:55 p.m.
Theft, Cedar Road: A Jan. 18 police report shows an employee of Sunglass Hut in Beachwood Place Mall told police around 12:20 p.m. that a pair of Coach sunglasses worth $148 were stolen from the store.
So that's 6 incidents in the same week. Not sure how many there are for all of 2015 but you get the picture. But don't take my word for it, just type "beachwood place thefts" in google.
It would be interesting to know how many reports like that occur at malls everywhere on a weekly basis. Malls are a nexus of crime, especially for shoplifting.
Well there's malls that have crime, and then there's malls with Christmas brawls that make youtube, and now there's malls with jeeps flying through department stores.
On 7/23/14, a group of men stole $60,000 worth of Louis Vuitton merchandise at Saks Fifth Avenue at Beachwood
On 11/20/14, four men barged into that very same Saks and took $19,000 worth of Chanel handbags!
What's next?
Last edited by maxmodder; 09-21-2015 at 07:34 PM..
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