Why Cleveland home sell so cheap? (Cincinnati, Akron: apartment, rentals, mortgage)
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I think one good measure would be how many kids growing up in the Boston area are leaving the region to find work? That's still very common in the rust belt.
BTW, my husband's friends and siblings all have kids who are young adults. One of them graduated UMass a few years ago and is now working in the computer field with a major corporation.
My buddy lives in Ipswich with his own business that he started years ago. He does very well and I do not think he has more than a BA.
Attitude, hard work, creativity are beginning to earn jobs more than ever before. IMO
I've never said it doesn't. But also, the reality is, MANY 20 somethings have advanced degrees from elite institutions and they are applying for the same jobs you are applying for. It is not 1990 anymore. I applied to countless jobs before I got my current one. I worked 4 jobs at the same time once, 7 days a week for 2 years. I'm responding to the one poster saying that things are given to people here. It's not true at all.
BJ- I reread my post and can't find where I tried to "tell" you anything. I apologize if it seemed that way. I was just stating an opinion about trade work, or attitude and skill vs. a degree.
BJ- I reread my post and can't find where I tried to "tell" you anything. I apologize if it seemed that way. I was just stating an opinion about trade work, or attitude and skill vs. a degree.
I think we agree, I was just trying to make sure my original point wasn't getting lost.
QCongress:
You ask what fields my husband and I are in: I'd rather not go into too much detail about what we do online, but I can tell you that we are both in technical occupations: He has a background in math and works with computers, I'm an engineer.
I agree that the people on the coasts have been handed things and completely take it all for granted.
It's sad that the "reputation and perception" of the Midwest isn't so great, because I think the quality of life is a lot higher in Midwestern cities than on the coasts. So I guess Midwesterners take some things for granted, too.
I feel sad reading this forum because Clevelanders seem to have such a defensive attitude about their city. I'm glad I've spent so many years on the East Coast if only because it's taught me to appreciate the quality of life in the Midwest. If I do end up retiring in Cleveland (my current plan), I'll have no regrets.
A lot of the reasons why the Midwest's reputation isn't great is because of a certain group of Midwest expats and current residents, media and society at large. Seems like the media is the Coasts' best friend and the Midwest's worst enemy.
Plus, Clevelanders get defensive about their city because it's been the butt of many jokes for 50+ years. I'm sure you heard the jokes on the East Coast. It seems like Cleveland has been this country's whipping boy. Maybe you didn't notce or hear it because you and your husband might've traveled in different circles in your respective cities that you lived in.
So, Clevelanders feel that they have no friends or allies like the Coasts, New Jersey has NYC, brooklyn, The Bronx. As it was said in the movie "New Jack City": "We all we got." Clevelanders feel all we have is each other because we're the outsiders and outcasts to the US and the whole world because some Clevelanders have felt abandoned and deserted even by their own fellow Clevelanders. Just my. 02.
Just curious, why do feel that quality of life is better in the Midwest than the Coasts? What's the difference between them? Also, what do you feel people in both regions take for granted and why?
Plus, Clevelanders get defensive about their city because it's been the butt of many jokes for 50+ years. I'm sure you heard the jokes on the East Coast.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. I've been on the East Coast for nearly 30 years now, and have spent extensive time in the Boston area, NY, and D.C. I have NEVER heard a single person make a Cleveland joke. Cleveland simply is not on people's radar screens. When I do mention Cleveland to people, they just draw a complete blank. They admit they know absolutely NOTHING about it whatsoever.
I do sometimes hear negative comments about the Midwest, but not specifically directed at Cleveland. They think the Midwest is ALL flat, there are no beaches (which is particular amusing to me, since I grew up in a resort town on the coast of Lake Michigan), the people are all dumb and ignorant, there is no culture, and there is too much snow. But, again, nothing about Cleveland in particular.
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Just curious, why do feel that quality of life is better in the Midwest than the Coasts? What's the difference between them? Also, what do you feel people in both regions take for granted and why?
I think I've addressed this one as well, but I'll try again.
Things that make the quality of life better in the Midwest:
1. People are less obsessed with their careers. People move to the coasts because they want to be movers and shakers: academia or research in Boston, finance in NY, politics in D.C., high-tech innovation in Silicon Valley, entertainment in L.A., etc. The Midwestern cities just aren't where the action is, professionally speaking. You might be able to get a good job, but that's not the same as working on Wall St., being a law professor at Harvard, consulting to the Pentagon, producing a major movie, etc. On the negative side, there are a lot of very ambitious, competitive people on the coasts, and it can get tiring after a while (although I found it exciting when I was younger). The bottom line is that people on the coasts simply have different priorities than people in the Midwest do.
Obviously, this is a generalization, and I have met many individuals on the coasts who are every bit as friendly and down-to-earth as Midwesterners. Not everybody is super competitive or totally into their careers. But even the nice people are simply too frazzled and stressed out to focus very much on their social lives.
2. The cost of living is more affordable in the Midwest. Even people who are very successful at their careers on the coasts struggle to make ends meet. I have a cousin who lives in San Francisco and both she and her husband are phDs with high-power jobs in research. They are constantly worrying about money. Professionals in the Midwest have a lot more disposable income compared to professionals on the coasts, and they don't live in tiny, cramped condos and apartments.
3. With the exception of Chicago, the cities in the Midwest are not huge Megalopolises, and the lower cost of living makes it easier to live closer to the downtown, where all the action is. Even if you live out in the suburbs, the time to get downtown is nowhere near as long as it would be if you lived in a city on the coasts. You don't have to drive an hour to do things. People have shorter commutes, and that frees up a lot of time and energy. If you join a club or organization, chances are you will meet people who live reasonably close to you which makes it easier to make friends.
When I lived in New Jersey, I commuted an hour to my job, and some of my co-workers also commuted an hour (from the opposite direction), which meant that they lived two hours away from me. I worked in a suburb of NYC, my husband worked in a suburb of Philadelphia. We never made any friends at our jobs because nobody lived or worked in the same community. We also tried joining various clubs and organizations, but we ran into the same problem. The times and distances to get anywhere or do anything was outrageous. Moving closer to the city was out of the question because the cost of living was astronomical.
My sister lives in Chicago, and when she visited Cleveland, she couldn't get over how much less traffic there is in Cleveland compared to Chicago. She almost never goes downtown in Chicago because the traffic is so bad.
What do people take for granted? That one's easy: People on the coasts take economic opportunity for granted, people in the Midwest take the quality of life for granted. People on the coasts think it's all about their careers, and they have no idea what they're missing. People in the Midwest don't realize how good they have it. They think the grass is a lot greener on the coasts.
What do people take for granted? That one's easy: People on the coasts take economic opportunity for granted, people in the Midwest take the quality of life for granted. People on the coasts think it's all about their careers, and they have no idea what they're missing. People in the Midwest don't realize how good they have it. They think the grass is a lot greener on the coasts.
That's a great observation!!! I also never thought about how difficult it is to make friends when burdened with long commutes in opposite directions from a workplace, also explained in your post. It's true in Cleveland that friends who live on the East, West and even South sides of Cleveland often socialize downtown (e.g., pro sports, PlayhouseSquare) or in Ohio City and even University Circle/Little Italy, and we take that for granted.
I have one friend who likes parking in a free Red Line lot on the West side and taking the rapid downtown for luncheon get-togethers. Now that I'm a senior (cheaper fares), I've considered doing the same thing from the Red Line Stokes/Windermere park 'n ride, but I currently park in cheap lots on Prospect Ave. and take the free bus trolley downtown. The advantage of buying a day pass and taking the Red Line downtown is that I could return to Windermere on the Healthline bus rapid and explore Euclid Ave. (I've never been to Dunbar Tavern, and there always is a myriad of things to do in University Circle, and in cool weather, I could take a good uphill hike in Lake View Cemetery).
If you haven't figured it out, there are some passive/aggressive posters in the Cleveland forum who rarely, if ever say anything specifically positive about Cleveland. Instead, while professing their love for Cleveland, they constantly insinuate that 21st century Cleveland has a negative image and is mocked elsewhere in the nation. They are gray cloud posters, if not deliberate trollers.
It's wishful thinking that your informed post based on your considerable experience will put an end to the posts by these individuals, but it may help others considering relocating to Cleveland or elsewhere in the Midwest!
That's a great observation!!! I also never thought about how difficult it is to make friends when burdened with long commutes in opposite directions from a workplace, also explained in your post. It's true in Cleveland that friends who live on the East, West and even South sides of Cleveland often socialize downtown (e.g., pro sports, PlayhouseSquare) or in Ohio City and even University Circle/Little Italy, and we take that for granted.
On the coasts too, keep in mind that people are constantly moving. So even if you do manage to make some friends nearby, as they ascend in their careers (which is the most important thing in life) they are constantly looking to "upgrade." I have lived in the same neighborhood for 5+ years, same house for getting on 4 of those years. This is not common for someone in their 20s or 30s here. Plus, lots of people will start in Boston, then go to NYC. Or then DC. Or vice versa. People are constantly moving to and from other east coast cities for work.
On the coasts too, keep in mind that people are constantly moving. So even if you do manage to make some friends nearby, as they ascend in their careers (which is the most important thing in life) they are constantly looking to "upgrade." I have lived in the same neighborhood for 5+ years, same house for getting on 4 of those years. This is not common for someone in their 20s or 30s here. Plus, lots of people will start in Boston, then go to NYC. Or then DC. Or vice versa. People are constantly moving to and from other east coast cities for work.
That's why they call them "movers and shakers", LOL. People are more interested in getting ahead in their careers than they are on focusing on their communities.
That's a great observation!!! I also never thought about how difficult it is to make friends when burdened with long commutes in opposite directions from a workplace, also explained in your post. It's true in Cleveland that friends who live on the East, West and even South sides of Cleveland often socialize downtown (e.g., pro sports, PlayhouseSquare) or in Ohio City and even University Circle/Little Italy, and we take that for granted.
Now, you get it! This is why many of us who live on the coasts want to retire in places like Cleveland. Cleveland is an ideal choice for somebody who wants the amenities of living in a big city but also doesn't want something overwhelmingly large. Bigger is not necessarily better.
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