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I do have a solution to bring the NHL to Cleveland. I think pro hockey would do well in Cleveland. Heres my farfetched but within the realm of possibility idea. Dan Gilbert I love you but Cleveland is not a basketball town. Even if there are fans in Cleveland that love the game, it is not a landing spot for free agents. There are at least a few NHL teams that are not doing well. Cleveland trades its basketball team for their NHL team. It is very farfetched I know but not an impossible idea. If a city that has a NHL team cannot support it or a major sports team then that would be a perfect situation for this trade. The NBA wants to contract so Cleveland trades Cavs to this team for their NHL team. The city gets contraction compensation and we get a NHL team.
As long as the Columbus Blue Jackets exist, there will not be an NHL team in Cleveland. The Penguins and Blue Jackets share Northeast Ohio when it comes to league territory rights. You would have to pay a moving fee to both the Pens and Jackets to compensate the teams losing territory. By league law, you can't move into another team's home territory without some financial compensation. There's little reason to do that especially since the Jackets are having enough problems. I don't think the league would even allow a team so close to another market that seems to be struggling.
I do have a solution to bring the NHL to Cleveland. I think pro hockey would do well in Cleveland. Heres my farfetched but within the realm of possibility idea. Dan Gilbert I love you but Cleveland is not a basketball town. Even if there are fans in Cleveland that love the game, it is not a landing spot for free agents. There are at least a few NHL teams that are not doing well. Cleveland trades its basketball team for their NHL team. It is very farfetched I know but not an impossible idea. If a city that has a NHL team cannot support it or a major sports team then that would be a perfect situation for this trade. The NBA wants to contract so Cleveland trades Cavs to this team for their NHL team. The city gets contraction compensation and we get a NHL team.
LOL... Dan Gilbert isn't a dumbass. Why would he trade an NBA team when it's far more popular than the NHL (and they play the same time of year)?
The NBA (and basketball) is still more popular among whites in Cleveland than the NHL (or hockey). And the NBA is FAR more popular among blacks. And Cuyahoga County only happens to be 30 percent black.
And even though the Cavs are 11-47, they are sold out this year. Yeah, I know it's because of No. 6 and people having to re-up before he left, but they are still bringing 18,000-plus actual people to the arena. And nights like tonight, the place was nearly full.
Don't underestimate the basketball fans here. I was at the game tonight. There was close to 20,000 there. It was one of 41 home games for a team with the worst record in the NBA.
To put it in perspective ... I was at the Browns-Colts game two years ago and there wasn't more than 30,000 people in the stadium. It was a balmy December day too (temps in the 40s). And the Browns only play 8 home games a year. Oh and at least 5,000 or so were Colts fans.
Both were technically sellouts ... but why were there only 10,000 more in the stadium for the Browns when there are only 8 home games and Cleveland is such a football town?
Cleveland is more of a basketball town than people believe. The Cavs have survived 40 years (about half in Richfield). The Barons couldn't survive three in downtown.
Also, I'd like to see the Columbus local numbers for this year. I'd be willing to bet the Cavs are still pulling in higher numbers there than the hometown Jackets.
Having an NHL team in Columbus just seems pointless. Also an MLS team. Really?
Columbus, Nashville, or Miami was a hockey town before they had the NHL? Cleveland's hockey base has more people involved than those three cites combined before they got NHL teams.
Regarding the NBA vs NHL Cavaliers debate; Someone please explain to me why the Barons, the Crusaders, the Barons again, and the Lumberjacks all came and went while the Cavaliers keep going?
No reason really, but I think Toledo would be a viable location for an NHL team.
Having an NHL team in Columbus just seems pointless. Also an MLS team. Really?
Columbus, Nashville, or Miami was a hockey town before they had the NHL? Cleveland's hockey base has more people involved than those three cites combined before they got NHL teams.
I agree. If Cleveland's population had been steady over the past 20 years, I guarantee that Columbus would have never saw an NHL or MLS team.
Even with a declining population, Cleveland is the center of one the 20 largest CSA's in the nation. Akron is almost exclusively Cleveland sports fans. I think it's totally bogus when people like Shapiro blame the poor attendance on the cenusus numbers. The Browns are the only team in Ohio that will draw no matter how bad they are---everyone else HAS TO WIN!(this should be obvious to the owners of the franchise, but sometimes I feel like these billionaire owners are just treating this stuff as a fun hobby--Gilbert being the exception).
Having an NHL team in Columbus just seems pointless. Also an MLS team. Really?
Columbus, Nashville, or Miami was a hockey town before they had the NHL? Cleveland's hockey base has more people involved than those three cites combined before they got NHL teams.
Regarding the NBA vs NHL Cavaliers debate; Someone please explain to me why the Barons, the Crusaders, the Barons again, and the Lumberjacks all came and went while the Cavaliers keep going?
No reason really, but I think Toledo would be a viable location for an NHL team.
The Crusaders were a WHA team. In 1976, the Gunds moved the NHL Golden Seals to Cleveland. Thus, the Barons were born. The NHL was the premier hockey league so that's why the Crusaders disappeared. At that time, the WHA was struggling financially so Mileti was willing to let the Barons come to town.
The NHL Barons were a bust at the gate and on the ice. They were lucky to get 10,000 fans. Whether that's because they were in Richland or poor performance, its hard to say. The Barons had a terrible lease agreement with Mileti which is one reason they had trouble making money. The Gunds attempted to buy the Coliseum but were rejected. When that happened, they decided to cut their losses and go to Minnesota.
The original AHL Barons folded because of the Crusaders. Mileti owned both and the WHA was trying to become a major league, something the AHL never aspired to be.
The Lumberjacks folded when the IHL did. It wasn't because of any issue, just the league went under and only a few teams moved over to the AHL.
When the Gunds brought the Barons back in 2001, they did a terrible job marketing the team. It was really an afterthought. That's why they struggled and went under. Besides, Gilbert wanted to own the AHL franchise and the Sharks didn't want to give up control of the Barons. He wanted to start fresh and own the team so he was happy to see them go.
To answer how the Cavs survived, I think there are several reasons. For one, the arena was always tied to the Cavs. As I mentioned, the Barons had an awful arena deal. The Cavs were always boosted by that. You're also comparing minor league to major league teams for the most part. The Crusaders were semi-major league and the NHL Barons barely existed.
If the Gunds had gotten control of the Coliseum, the Barons would've survived. That was the main difference during those lean years. Its ironic that only a few years after the Gunds were rejected by Mileti, they ended up getting control of the Coliseum by buying the Cavs. If that had happened a few years earlier, they would've co-existed.
Having an NHL team in Columbus just seems pointless. Also an MLS team. Really?
Columbus, Nashville, or Miami was a hockey town before they had the NHL? Cleveland's hockey base has more people involved than those three cites combined before they got NHL teams.
I drove to Columbus on Wednesday for the Avalanche-Blue Jackets game (I'm an Avs fan) and couldn't believe how pitiful the atmosphere was. Attendance was less than 9,000, and a good chunk of that was Colorado fans. Before the game, the one sports bar I could find in the Arena District (Boston's) was also full mostly of Colorado fans or people more interested in the Tigers-Rangers game than anything else.
How Columbus got an NHL team and that arena (Nationwide Arena is beautiful) is a mystery. And why they haven't bolted yet is an even bigger mystery. The Atlanta NHL team left for Winnipeg last year. How is it that Columbus still has its team?
Columbus has always been, is now and will always be a college town. The only people sitting remotely close to us at the game on Wednesday were talking about the OSU-Nebraska football game and the OSU quarterback situation. Not a peep about the hockey game going on in front of them.
I drove to Columbus on Wednesday for the Avalanche-Blue Jackets game (I'm an Avs fan) and couldn't believe how pitiful the atmosphere was. Attendance was less than 9,000, and a good chunk of that was Colorado fans. Before the game, the one sports bar I could find in the Arena District (Boston's) was also full mostly of Colorado fans or people more interested in the Tigers-Rangers game than anything else.
How Columbus got an NHL team and that arena (Nationwide Arena is beautiful) is a mystery. And why they haven't bolted yet is an even bigger mystery. The Atlanta NHL team left for Winnipeg last year. How is it that Columbus still has its team?
Columbus has always been, is now and will always be a college town. The only people sitting remotely close to us at the game on Wednesday were talking about the OSU-Nebraska football game and the OSU quarterback situation. Not a peep about the hockey game going on in front of them.
The flip side of that is this wasn't always the case. Just a few years ago, the Jackets fans consistently filled the arena. But fans have become apathetic. You'd be apathetic too if you've had one decent season in 11 years. Its no different than the Indians in Cleveland. At one time, it was impossible to get a ticket to a Tribe game, now they practically give them away.
And just an FYI, you were at the wrong bar. There's an entire hockey bar in the Arena District. Its called the R BAR and that's where all the fans hang out, even on non game nights to watch games on TV. R BAR in Arena District
The arena was built privately by Nationwide. The city wanted pro teams and Nationwide saw it as a civic duty after citizens rejected an arena vote so they built it. Columbus still has a team because it has a devoted owner and had very strong support up until a couple of years ago. As an Avs fan, you should know that support declines as teams struggle. They don't exactly sell out in Denver anymore either.
I drove to Columbus on Wednesday for the Avalanche-Blue Jackets game (I'm an Avs fan) and couldn't believe how pitiful the atmosphere was. Attendance was less than 9,000, and a good chunk of that was Colorado fans. Before the game, the one sports bar I could find in the Arena District (Boston's) was also full mostly of Colorado fans or people more interested in the Tigers-Rangers game than anything else.
How Columbus got an NHL team and that arena (Nationwide Arena is beautiful) is a mystery. And why they haven't bolted yet is an even bigger mystery. The Atlanta NHL team left for Winnipeg last year. How is it that Columbus still has its team?
Columbus has always been, is now and will always be a college town. The only people sitting remotely close to us at the game on Wednesday were talking about the OSU-Nebraska football game and the OSU quarterback situation. Not a peep about the hockey game going on in front of them.
Until very recently Blue Jackets attendance had been pretty respectable. They have been to the playoffs once in eleven years and have yet to win a game. If they do start winning, the place will fill up again. Fortunately the city, county and convention authority have a deal in place that should be finalized by year end to have the authority manage the arena and provide a more favorable lease to the Jackets in exchange for the Jackets staying through 2039 - they're not going anywhere soon.
I was at the Avs game on Wednesday too - I have to laugh at your comment about most of the fans being Avs fans....seriously? I counted a few dozen Avs fans among the 9,000. As for the Avs, they averaged 14,820 last season compared to the Jackets' 13,658 - is that really much better? With regard to sports bars in the Arena District, I guess you somehow missed the RBar, Gordon Biersch and several other places where places where people congregate before games.
Also, nice of you to throw stones at Columbus when the Bengals are barely drawing 40,000 for their games - they bolting for LA soon?
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