Senate report on for-profits (bachelor's, cost, public schools, masters)

[Gatornation]

Senate Report: For-Profit Colleges Exploit Students : NPR

SENATOR TOM HARKIN: The average dropout rate was almost 50 percent, some dropout rates as high as 67 percent.

SANCHEZ: And because most students in for-profit schools - 96 percent - take out loans, many end up saddled with debt that they are unlikely to pay back. In many cases, students were misled about the true cost of their tuition, according to investigators. Students in for-profit schools represent 13 percent of the nation's total college enrollment, but account for almost 50 percent of all loan defaults.

[L210]

This has already been known. There are still many people who defend for-profits as being the only ones willing to take on disadvantaged and non-traditional students while community colleges are overcrowded. The thing is that most for-profits do not offer remedial courses. It's pretty much sink or swim and too many sink after taking out thousands of dollars in loans. Since most (probably 99%) of for-profits don't require students to take something like the Accuplacer, SAT, or ACT; they do not know how many intellectually challenged students they are enrolling. I can guarantee you that they are taking advantage of people with learning disabilities and mental retardation.

[Jayess1]

Hmm. The figures quoted aren't as bad as I thought they'd be - they're pretty much on par overall w/public schools. Consider that the public school raw numbers far exceed FP's, it would seem that the dropout/finance issue is greater there...

[L210]

The finance issue is greater with for-profits because they account for a very disproportionate amount of loan defaults. They have 13% of the enrolled students, but 50% of the loan defaults. I don't see how that isn't so bad.

[Briolat21]

I've never had an issue taking a class at a community college. I hold a bachelor's and masters from a traditional state university, but have occasionally taken community college classes (for prereqs for the masters, for "brushing up" on a subject I'd taken forever ago) or just for personal growth.

I can understand in an area like NYC (really high population density) that community colleges would be crowded. But in the majority of the country, is there really a crisis where people can't get into the comm. college classes they want?

I would say always go the Comm. College route rather than the for-profit type which are simply out to enrich themselves.

[L210]

I found my local community colleges to be remarkably flexible when it came to online courses. I know a lot of people complain about not being able to get into nursing and other medical programs.

[Gatornation]

There is NO reason to not go to a CC if it is an option over a for-profit.

[Jayess1]

Originally Posted by L210

The finance issue is greater with for-profits because they account for a very disproportionate amount of loan defaults. They have 13% of the enrolled students, but 50% of the loan defaults. I don't see how that isn't so bad.

But far fewer dollars/student. Note this from NYT this past fall:

"According to Department of Education data released Monday, 8.8 percent of borrowers over all defaulted in the fiscal year that ended last Sept. 30, the latest figures available, up from 7 percent the previous year.
At public institutions, the rate was 7.2 percent, up from 6 percent, and at not-for-profit private institutions, it was 4.6 percent, up from 4 percent".

It seems that caution would be called for as various reports seem to be mixing rates/units to confirm story lines...

[L210]

Originally Posted by Jayess1

But far fewer dollars/student. Note this from NYT this past fall:

"According to Department of Education data released Monday, 8.8 percent of borrowers over all defaulted in the fiscal year that ended last Sept. 30, the latest figures available, up from 7 percent the previous year.
At public institutions, the rate was 7.2 percent, up from 6 percent, and at not-for-profit private institutions, it was 4.6 percent, up from 4 percent".

It seems that caution would be called for as various reports seem to be mixing rates/units to confirm story lines...

Yes, and 15% of those who borrowed money to attend for-profits defaulted. These numbers only include borrowers.

For-profit college students take on more debt, with 96 percent receiving loans compared with 48 percent at four-year public schools.

For-Profit Education: Is An Entire Industry Going Away? | Forexpros

So while they only make up 13% of students, they make up a much larger portion of student loan borrowers. Twice the percentage of borrowers, twice the percentage of defaults. That reasonably puts them at about half of all defaults.

I wouldn't be surprised if the loans they default on tend to be much higher too since for-profit students graduate with more debt on average.