Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Education > Colleges and Universities
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 02-18-2014, 07:16 AM
 
3,670 posts, read 7,172,831 times
Reputation: 4269

Advertisements

i didn't socialize that much i college and i definitely regret it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-18-2014, 07:24 AM
 
11,642 posts, read 23,941,355 times
Reputation: 12274
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
Well we can agree to disagree. For the record, my daughter is in college right now, in my department. I can see exactly how much they changed. And I also teach as an adjunct both at the CC and uni level.
My son is also in college and I don't see that things have changed all that much. There are some changes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
Lets start with an obvious one. The consequences of underage drinking are vastly different now than they were 20 years ago. That is fact. Twenty years ago, students got a slap on the wrist from the campus police. Many schools now tie scholarships to not getting in trouble with drinking while underage.
I agree that the consequences of underage drinking are one thing that has changed over the past 30 years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
Another simple one. In many schools, large classes (i.e. bio 101, calc 1, and so on) now require exams to be given all at once (to prevent cheating) and on Saturdays or Sundays when most students do not have exams.

Computer lab hours, study groups, tutoring, is most available without long waits on the weekends. A little hard to get up Saturday morning to go get time for X if you were partying until 4am.
This must be a large school thing. My son has exams during his normal class periods and study groups are voluntary. They can be arranged at any time that the people in the group agree to meet. I don't know of many study groups that are meeting Sunday at 6AM regardless of whether students party or not.

My son only took one class that required computer lab but he managed to get an A in it even though he drinks on some weekends. He has no experience with science labs as he was able to exempt those classes in college.

As far as I know tutoring is arranged between the tutor and the student. My son is a tutor (even though he parties he is an A student). Maybe large schools have different procedures but as far as I know most tutoring sessions are done in the middle of the week or during the day on the weekends. I have never heard of a tutor requiring students to appear at 6AM on Sunday morning for tutoring. Maybe at big schools. I went to a small school and my son is at a medium sized school.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
I thought we were talking about partying specifically? Socializing, is a vastly different animal.

Partying, implies alcohol, hangovers, very late nights, and so on.

Socializing need not include any of those.
Socializing does not have to include alcohol, late nights or hangovers but I don't see why it would matter much if a student does not get out of control with partying. I think we can agree that excessive partying would be a problem but I just don't see why one or two nights a week spent partying would be a huge problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
And lets be clear, nearly 50% of students feel they do not have enough time to do their schools work, 88% do not have good time management skills. Maybe we shouldn't be encouraging them to party since at least half don't have the skill even you think are required to manage partying.

College students struggle with organizational skills
Poor time management skills really has nothing to do with whether a student parties or not. Students with good time management skills should be able to carve out two nights a week for whatever they want. Students with poor time management skills will have problems with college regardless of whether they party. The problem is time management.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-18-2014, 07:31 AM
 
12,101 posts, read 17,129,060 times
Reputation: 15776
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
I suspect it is as much, if not more so, a function of major and degree. Reality is there are easier degrees, that fundamentally require less out of class work and other commitments.

Someone majoring in chemical engineering is just going to have more to do than someone say in an education major.
I used to think more like you.

The more I think about it, academic performance and school reputation means less in the real world than most think. Definitely much less than it should.

In industry, nobody cares about your GPA or where you went to school after a little while if they ever cared at all and charisma trumps nose to the grind hard work.

Your pHd at a top school might only be able to land you tenure at a really, really crappy school or you might get into med school, become a radiologist and make huge bucks, but absolutely detest it.

Of course, these are all real life examples.

It's good to have at least a 3.3 or so. It'll give you more options than if your GPA was horrid.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-18-2014, 02:32 PM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,768,215 times
Reputation: 20853
Quote:
Originally Posted by jobaba View Post
I used to think more like you.

The more I think about it, academic performance and school reputation means less in the real world than most think. Definitely much less than it should.

In industry, nobody cares about your GPA or where you went to school after a little while if they ever cared at all and charisma trumps nose to the grind hard work.

Your pHd at a top school might only be able to land you tenure at a really, really crappy school or you might get into med school, become a radiologist and make huge bucks, but absolutely detest it.

Of course, these are all real life examples.

It's good to have at least a 3.3 or so. It'll give you more options than if your GPA was horrid.
Again, I suspect most of the above is entirely dependent on what field you choose.

For a STEM student in a competitive field, a good undergrad GPA is necessary to go to a good grad school. A 3.3 is just not going to cut it unless you have something astounding to set you apart, which would entail working harder than the average student and goes back to my original point.

I am not sure what you are talking about with PhDs and radiology. Radiologists are MDs. And a PhD is required to teach at almost any school. And if you think a PhD at Harward is meaningless compared to one from a state school, again at least in STEM you would be mistaken. PhDs in the sciences spend some serious time as postdocs, their GPAs, schools, and degrees, all matter for quite sometime.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-18-2014, 02:36 PM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,768,215 times
Reputation: 20853
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momma_bear View Post
My son is also in college and I don't see that things have changed all that much. There are some changes.



I agree that the consequences of underage drinking are one thing that has changed over the past 30 years.



This must be a large school thing. My son has exams during his normal class periods and study groups are voluntary. They can be arranged at any time that the people in the group agree to meet. I don't know of many study groups that are meeting Sunday at 6AM regardless of whether students party or not.

My son only took one class that required computer lab but he managed to get an A in it even though he drinks on some weekends. He has no experience with science labs as he was able to exempt those classes in college.

As far as I know tutoring is arranged between the tutor and the student. My son is a tutor (even though he parties he is an A student). Maybe large schools have different procedures but as far as I know most tutoring sessions are done in the middle of the week or during the day on the weekends. I have never heard of a tutor requiring students to appear at 6AM on Sunday morning for tutoring. Maybe at big schools. I went to a small school and my son is at a medium sized school.



Socializing does not have to include alcohol, late nights or hangovers but I don't see why it would matter much if a student does not get out of control with partying. I think we can agree that excessive partying would be a problem but I just don't see why one or two nights a week spent partying would be a huge problem.



Poor time management skills really has nothing to do with whether a student parties or not. Students with good time management skills should be able to carve out two nights a week for whatever they want. Students with poor time management skills will have problems with college regardless of whether they party. The problem is time management.
Move the goal posts all you like. I never said students shouldn't socialize. But if you want to pretend the term used by the OP and in all of my posts, "partying" ,does not imply alcohol, red solo cups, and so on, go nuts. It does not make it so, and certainly does not remotely change the fact that for the vast majority of college students, "partying" is about drinking, and for some 40% of them that means binge drinking.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-18-2014, 08:51 PM
 
11,642 posts, read 23,941,355 times
Reputation: 12274
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
Move the goal posts all you like. I never said students shouldn't socialize. But if you want to pretend the term used by the OP and in all of my posts, "partying" ,does not imply alcohol, red solo cups, and so on, go nuts. It does not make it so, and certainly does not remotely change the fact that for the vast majority of college students, "partying" is about drinking, and for some 40% of them that means binge drinking.
I am not moving the goal posts at all. What I said that

"Socializing does not have to include alcohol, late nights or hangovers but I don't see why it would matter much if a student does not get out of control with partying. I think we can agree that excessive partying would be a problem but I just don't see why one or two nights a week spent partying would be a huge problem."

I did not say partying did not include alcohol. Never. Not once.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2014, 04:26 AM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,768,215 times
Reputation: 20853
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momma_bear View Post
I agree with your last statement but many young people are able to party on the weekends and still become educated. Just because someone parties in college that does not mean partying is the purpose of being there. Not everyone has to party in college but there are plenty of students who manage to party and still obtain an education.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momma_bear View Post
I am not moving the goal posts at all. What I said that

"Socializing does not have to include alcohol, late nights or hangovers but I don't see why it would matter much if a student does not get out of control with partying. I think we can agree that excessive partying would be a problem but I just don't see why one or two nights a week spent partying would be a huge problem."

I did not say partying did not include alcohol. Never. Not once.
Unless I am miss reading a similar user name, what you originally said to me was the quote above.

The part about socializing was after you had moved the goalposts already. My original post stated socializing was fine. But the reality is from peer reviewed research that the majority of student who do "party", are binge drinking, which by definition is out of control. If you want to move them so you comment refers to a minority of students go ahead. Might as well claim some alcoholics can get a 4.0, it's equally true, just for a slightly smaller subset of the population.

I stand by my original statement. And I'll say this as well, for the majority of college students who do "party" it correlates strongly with a lower GPA.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2014, 06:18 AM
 
20,793 posts, read 61,385,224 times
Reputation: 10696
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
Unless I am miss reading a similar user name, what you originally said to me was the quote above.

The part about socializing was after you had moved the goalposts already. My original post stated socializing was fine. But the reality is from peer reviewed research that the majority of student who do "party", are binge drinking, which by definition is out of control. If you want to move them so you comment refers to a minority of students go ahead. Might as well claim some alcoholics can get a 4.0, it's equally true, just for a slightly smaller subset of the population.

I stand by my original statement. And I'll say this as well, for the majority of college students who do "party" it correlates strongly with a lower GPA.
That is total BS. Partying can take may forms even if it does include alcohol. A student can go to a party, have 2 or 3 drinks and be just fine. Maybe your child isn't able to handle that but the vast majority of kids most certainly can and there is NO correlation between "partying" and grades unless the student chooses to party ALL the time vs study. I know my kids go to parties, probably at least one every weekend. They go with their friends and they all drink to varying degrees, however, my kids are 4.0 students, their friends are the same or similar and almost all of them are on the Dean's list (which at their school is a 3.9 or higher GPA). I really don't think going to a party on a Saturday night is hurting them in the slightest. The only think that correlates to a lower GPA is not studying enough.....

oh, and your binge drinking stats...do you have the data to back that up? Looking at the 200 or so college kids I know just off the top of my head that were friends with our kids in high school, none of them are binge drinkers according to the definition of binge drinking--which maybe you are misunderstanding...

CDC - Fact Sheets-Binge Drinking - Alcohol

http://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publicatio...er_Number3.pdf

According to that second link, I think you are talking more about "risky" drinking..the data also shows that more people over the age of 26 are binge drinkers--70% of all binge drinkers are 26 or older....
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2014, 07:26 AM
 
11,642 posts, read 23,941,355 times
Reputation: 12274
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
Unless I am miss reading a similar user name, what you originally said to me was the quote above.

The part about socializing was after you had moved the goalposts already. My original post stated socializing was fine. But the reality is from peer reviewed research that the majority of student who do "party", are binge drinking, which by definition is out of control. If you want to move them so you comment refers to a minority of students go ahead. Might as well claim some alcoholics can get a 4.0, it's equally true, just for a slightly smaller subset of the population.

I stand by my original statement. And I'll say this as well, for the majority of college students who do "party" it correlates strongly with a lower GPA.
Whatever. You totally misrepresented what I wrote. If that makes you happy I'll go with it.

I consider partying to include drinking, not necessarily binge drinking. You can define it any way you like. I stand by my statement that students who have good time management skills can party on the weekends and still do fine in school.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-19-2014, 08:28 PM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,768,215 times
Reputation: 20853
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfgal View Post
That is total BS. Partying can take may forms even if it does include alcohol. A student can go to a party, have 2 or 3 drinks and be just fine. Maybe your child isn't able to handle that but the vast majority of kids most certainly can and there is NO correlation between "partying" and grades unless the student chooses to party ALL the time vs study. I know my kids go to parties, probably at least one every weekend. They go with their friends and they all drink to varying degrees, however, my kids are 4.0 students, their friends are the same or similar and almost all of them are on the Dean's list (which at their school is a 3.9 or higher GPA). I really don't think going to a party on a Saturday night is hurting them in the slightest. The only think that correlates to a lower GPA is not studying enough.....

oh, and your binge drinking stats...do you have the data to back that up? Looking at the 200 or so college kids I know just off the top of my head that were friends with our kids in high school, none of them are binge drinkers according to the definition of binge drinking--which maybe you are misunderstanding...

CDC - Fact Sheets-Binge Drinking - Alcohol

http://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publicatio...er_Number3.pdf

According to that second link, I think you are talking more about "risky" drinking..the data also shows that more people over the age of 26 are binge drinkers--70% of all binge drinkers are 26 or older....
Great your kids are the exception. So are their friends. Everyone you have ever met. Got it.

Study: Inverse relationship between alcohol abuse and college GPA | Penn State University

Undergraduate Drinking and Academic Performance: A Prospective Investigation With Objective Measures

Alcohol Consumption, Sleep, and Academic Performance Among College Students - Journal of Studies on Alcohol and Drugs

That is not the reality for the vast majority of students. BTW, just for the record you cannot dispute a correlation with anecdotes or attacks on my own children (who do not drink anyway). Numbers don't lie, kids who drink have lower GPAs than their peers who do not. Those are findings of literally dozens, maybe hundreds of studies.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Education > Colleges and Universities

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top