Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
In SLC where they give a "free apartment" to the homeless, the projections about "lack of incentive" all turned out to be fruitless. Many of the homeless were able to get jobs (with help in the application process from a social worker) and made plans to keep moving on. They were able to buy appliances for their little apartment and be productive members of society. They didn't need to move into white collar work to be successful, they just needed to be able to get a little stupid apartment and a job where they could work 30 to 40 hours per week. The funny thing is while we say "no incentive", they displayed a great deal of pride in working and moving upwards.
You now know that Utah has this program, so why aren't you moving there to become homeless and get into one of those apartments? What incentive do you have to remain above poverty? When you apply the situation to ask yourself why you aren't taking advantage of it, all the arguments fall apart. Sure, this program sounds vastly better than being homeless, but I don't want to go live there. I love my house. I'm happy with the life I built for myself.
Here is the actual journalism (rare to see) and it was done by the daily show (why is a comedy show the #1 source for quality reporting??)
Right your middle class and have a good job of course you don't want to mooch off the government. If these kinds of programs become I could see a vast underclass of people simply happy to take there free apartment and not move up. Honestly housing is not a right and it should not be subsidized with our tax dollars. I see nothing wrong with tent camps or work programs but free apartments or houses are to much.
Right your middle class and have a good job of course you don't want to mooch off the government. If these kinds of programs become I could see a vast underclass of people simply happy to take there free apartment and not move up. Honestly housing is not a right and it should not be subsidized with our tax dollars. I see nothing wrong with tent camps or work programs but free apartments or houses are to much.
Tent camps or work programs? All due respect, are you aware of the main causes/reasons for homelessness in the US? I can assure you that most of these people have:
(a) Mental health issues
(b) Drug/Alcohol issues
(c) Domestic abuse situations/family dysfunction and/or abuse
You think the answer is to put these people in tent camps or work programs? Try checking with the Salvation Army's Homeless Services and ask them what their current policy is for their in-shelter clients and then get back with me. You, Sir or Madam, are shamefully misinformed or simply uninformed. Homeless people are not criminals for being homeless. A large percentage are not looking for a handout. Did you know that the average American family lives one paycheck from homelessness?
On a recent trip to Manitou Springs I did a quick Google on the homeless population there and was somewhat surprised to learn that a percentage of these people are homeless by choice. The younger ones are so just for the experience, or for the art. Some of the older people are homeless by choice because they can't cope with societal laws and norms. Some actually even have income. They are considerably different than the groups I mentioned at the top of this post.
Please, don't generalize, don't judge, and there but for the grace of God go you and I. Ease up, friend.
Perhaps we should look at why we have a "vast underclass" segment of society and address the root cause of that through training and education. Not everyone fits into regular academic programs or the four year university mold.
Based on the three types described by theperfecthologram, I could see where free/low cost housing and/or work compensation for housing programs will work for turning 33% of that list around. The other 66% have issues that could prevent them from being consistently able to succeed in such a program at all. So what do we do for them?
The sign people get old but other than that I could care less. There quite a few things I dont think my taxes should pay for, like public k-12 schools for instance, but someone is going to get your money regardless with our current tax systems.
Some places have had a great deal of success in treating alcohol addiction by simply requiring the people to show up at the courthouse and blow into the breathalyzer each day. With the technology becoming dramatically cheaper, it might be a reasonable way to help people get off the alcoholism.
This technique was used with people that were far enough gone to think there was no problem with their drinking and driving. Rather than the traditional strategy of "get them off the road", the courts there went with "get them sober". They found anyone so addicted to drinking that they would drink and drive had a drinking problem and needed to be kept off alcohol entirely. It turns out that strategy also reduced domestic violence.
I would suggest the answer for alcohol addiction is daily monitoring. Antabuse may be used to further help people avoid alcoholism. I don't know how to deal with those suffering from mental health issues, but if their mental health is so bad they can not cope with having a home or showing up to a job, then having them roam downtown seems incredibly dangerous.
Tent camps or work programs? All due respect, are you aware of the main causes/reasons for homelessness in the US? I can assure you that most of these people have:
(a) Mental health issues
(b) Drug/Alcohol issues
(c) Domestic abuse situations/family dysfunction and/or abuse
You think the answer is to put these people in tent camps or work programs? Try checking with the Salvation Army's Homeless Services and ask them what their current policy is for their in-shelter clients and then get back with me. You, Sir or Madam, are shamefully misinformed or simply uninformed. Homeless people are not criminals for being homeless. A large percentage are not looking for a handout. Did you know that the average American family lives one paycheck from homelessness?
On a recent trip to Manitou Springs I did a quick Google on the homeless population there and was somewhat surprised to learn that a percentage of these people are homeless by choice. The younger ones are so just for the experience, or for the art. Some of the older people are homeless by choice because they can't cope with societal laws and norms. Some actually even have income. They are considerably different than the groups I mentioned at the top of this post.
Please, don't generalize, don't judge, and there but for the grace of God go you and I. Ease up, friend.
Sorry, I see that I wasn't clear with my response.
My offering for a solution is to see what the Salvation Army is doing for their shelter clients re their work program, daily monitoring of D/A issues, MH issues. Take those pieces and start there. They've had tremendous success with their approach.
Now, as for those who are homeless by choice? I don't really know. Let's hear your ideas, phetaroi.
Perhaps now we know why those entities that were around during the great depresion have those serrated teeth on many rails, planters, and other horizontal objects.
When I was younger, I can recall any number of business that had the used cog rail sections cut down and welded them onto different objects to prevent sitting.
There are legitimate cases of homelessness.....and there are other cases where they are too !$&@%# lazy to work. I don't know if I agree with the "most are mentally ill" statement, either. Certainly some are, but I doubt it is over 50% which would be needed make the word "most" a fact. I'm tired of supporting laziness. I'm tired of my taxes feeding steak, twinkies and Doritos to lazy people. I'm tired of seeing healthy people of all ages standing at intersections asking for handouts. I'm tired of the "need gas to get to Fort Collins" B.S. at gas stations. I'm tired of thinking- "poor dog" when I see losers asking for money to feed themselves and using the dog for sympathy. I'd like to see tent camps outside of town for subsidized housing, thereby freeing up the in town rentals for working people to afford. I'd like to see separate lines at the grocery store for welfare card holders so I can get in and out faster when going to and from my job. A separate line may also help put the shame back into welfare like when I was young and food stamps looked like Monopoly money, so everyone knew you were lazy. I'd like to see incentives put in place for welfare recipients to work at least part time or we SLASH their benefits. How about we have them shovel sidewalks, mow TAXPAYERS lawns or weed my decorative rock in my yard? Or is that abusing their rights? There is way too much abuse of the system AND VERY LITTLE BEING DONE to change anything. I don't care about their "rights" to have a cell phone paid for by MY tax dollars. I'd prefer to sustain them with rice and beans while providing shelter that consists of a tent or other simple structure that may give them the ambition to get off their *** and make a better life for themselves by working even several lousy jobs to make ends meet. Just like so many other self respecting, proud, motivated people do every day. I spoke with a person the other day who works at two convenience stores and mows lawns all summer to try and earn a living. THAT is the type of person who deserves a little assistance in my opinion. Do you think that person rolls a grocery cart full of beef, frozen pizzas, chips and salsa and other overpriced FREE food up to the checkout at King Sooper a couple times a month? I doubt it.
And please, I don't want to hear anymore bleeding hearts telling me how so many didn't have the same opportunity as others growing up, blah, blah, blah. If you are so concerned, YOU cough up the money to pay to help them. YOU find the way to break the chain of generations of welfare abuse if you don't think my idea of taking it away and limiting luxuries like steak, shrimp and coca cola on the food cards while living in apartments with televisions and cell phones is something they all deserve for sitting on their *** and possibly having more children they can't support.
This is America! Opportunities exist everywhere for anyone with enough ambition to work hard and make a better life for themselves without taking handouts from the government. I pay taxes with the hopes of the money being spent on schools, roads, infrastructure and other priorities verses supporting lazy, unproductive, unambitious losers who feel entitled to a better way of life without having to do it for themselves.
And EVERY SINGLE recipient of so much as one dime of government assistance should be subject to random drug and alcohol testing as a requirement to keep collecting. ONE strike and you are out. Just like so many people with jobs have to do to earn money.
We are on a downward spiral in this country as more and more people depend on handouts. We hear how social security may run out......but we never hear how welfare may run out. The ugly truth is we will eventually go broke. So spending less on those who do not pay taxes is the fastest way to reduce costs. Sorry welfare recipients, we need to support the workers first. Here is some rice and beans, a well for you to get water and a tent. That is your free food, water and shelter.
If you don't like it.....go get a job.
Oh, that would be just so attractive to have the Springs surrounded by homeless camps - although at least it would be a way of warning newbies that wages in the Springs tend to be less than average. Why don't we just make them live up Gold Camp Road? Nah, too close to the Broadmore. I know! How about the off ramp to the USAFC? That will bring home to the cadets how badly this country treats its veterans. How about across the road from YOU, since you are completely ignorant as to how the system works. You can't get a housing voucher ANYWHERE in the Springs. It doesn't matter the amount of rent it (doesn't) pay when the number of new vouchers is ZERO. Call up the Springs HA if you don't believe me. As for SNAP (food stamps), please get a clue about that program, as well. Any able-bodied person who gets SNAP has to go register with Work Force and prove that they are actively trying to find a job. In addition, they are also required to do at least 12 hours a week of community service. Check it out.
And why should be supporting "workers" first since they're already getting their fat checks for minimum wage working at the switchboard in the Broadmore Hotel or a call center somewhere? Sounds like a bunch of lazy, useless workers too me. I think they should be housed in cardboard shacks right outside the city limits and right next to the other riff-raff in the tent city slums you've created. And god forbid that you give a homeless person's dog a handful of dig chow. Those dogs are just con artists, too. Keep on reading those editorials in the Gazette. That rag sums up the attitudes of all too many in the Springs. Blech!
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
