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Old 05-06-2013, 11:19 AM
 
Location: Wherabouts Unknown!
7,805 posts, read 17,598,073 times
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Kaptain Karl wrote: Who do you trust more?

Government regulators or the free market?


I trust the government regulators slightly more than the so-called free market. If it was truly a free market, then it would be a no brainer.
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Old 05-06-2013, 10:49 PM
 
9,840 posts, read 20,561,092 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CosmicWizard View Post
Kaptain Karl wrote: Who do you trust more?

Government regulators or the free market?


I trust the government regulators slightly more than the so-called free market. If it was truly a free market, then it would be a no brainer.
I don't trust anyone. In my experience government bureaucrats know little to nothing about the industries they are involved in regulating, only that all the thousands of forms are filled out correctly. Government is regulating so much now it doesn't know it's right from left hand and often doesn't even know it's own rules correctly.

So far all the fracking fear mongering about people growing two heads and turning green have turned out to be false, but of course there is nothing wrong with keeping up with these industries and verifying they are doing the right thing. Locally, there is a volunteer group that tests the water in the local streams and creeks for any contamination and that is great example of how one can be involved without being a conspiracy kook.
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Old 05-07-2013, 01:17 AM
 
Location: CO/UT/AZ/NM Catch me if you can!
5,824 posts, read 5,250,463 times
Reputation: 12744
Mr. Karl wrote, "Somebody needs to stop using totally biased sources. (Or, if you have such a personal bias, state it as I did.)"
I don't know what's biased about using the financial meltdown of 2007/2008 as an example. It happened. It's a fact that it happened. What's biased about it? Just because you were apparently vacationing on a small atoll in the South Pacific during that time period doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Quote:
You really should do some reading on the Community Reinvestment Act, a *government* program, which was the regulatory trigger for the fiscal crisis you noted. (Thank you for making my point.)
Indeed. And I would suggest that others wishing to educate themselves on the CRA should begin with a reputable source. If they did, they'd discover that only about 6% of the banks involved were subject to CRA rules. The rest were out there just daring someone to enforce the Glass Stiegel Act which had been rendered toothless by then, anyhow.

Quote:
Since you probably will not educate yourself, the government regulators -- under the Clinton Administration -- *forced* the banks to make the idiotic loans to people who could not possible repay them. The housing market still has not recovered. And because of 0bamanomics, the banks today are paralyzing small business (which is the real engine of our economy) by holding cash instead of helping with startups and expansions. (I don't blame the banks. I blame this insanely stupid Administration.)
Oh, even silly little me knows that the CRA began life under the CARTER administration (hello?) It was an attempt at correcting one of the many social injustices that the US suffers from - both then and now. Unfortunately, many on these CD Forums still get a charge out of blaming minorities and the government for every last thing they see wrong in the US. Some things never change. From the link above:

Quote:
Predatory lenders took advantage of such [minority] communities and disproportionately sold their wares there. They masked the true costs of the loans they were selling, and told prospective borrowers that they could always refinance their mortgages before adjustable rates kicked in; property values only go up, after all. Subprime lenders then packaged their loans as securities with little regard for how those loans would perform.
I very much doubt Obama has it in for the banks and financial institutions. If memory serves, Goldmansach's was one of his leading campaign contributers. Which is why there has never been so much as a hair touched on those scoundrels' balding heads.

Now could we get back to fracking?

As fascinating as "The rest of [my] hyperbolic post, ...." may be.

- Yours, Rambler
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Old 05-22-2013, 12:57 PM
 
2,253 posts, read 6,380,107 times
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Wink But, how can this be?

"From the perspective of medical professionals, we know that many of the signs and symptoms of exposure to airborne chemicals associated gas and oil extraction can be vague and non-specific. Flu-like symptoms, fatigue, nosebleeds, headaches, neurological pains, and gastrointestinal symptoms are often either overlooked and/or misdiagnosed in current healthcare settings because training has not been implemented for our hospital staff or primary care professionals to recognize the symptoms of industrial chemical exposure." [1]


Apparently Boulder County had a moratorium on oil drilling. One since expired on May 11, 2013. It seems the county commissioners not only intend to let this moratorium permanently lapse, but now welcome fracking in the county.

As Erie, CO has since discovered—with a good portion of it lying outside of Boulder County—fracking interests will follow but the letter of the law, if that. Or no concern in setting up their noxious operations next established residences and elementary schools. [2]

Only today, a hopeful new Colorado resident from Jacksonville, FL is on this forum inquiring about the possibility of living in Superior, Louisville, Lafayette or Erie.[3] As oft the case, they would prefer such as affordable housing, friendly neighbors, low crime, good schools, etc.—and in sum the usual Colorado dream.

So imagine how one might feel in learning that figuring a commute to Denver may be the least of their problems. Or that they may wish to avoid Erie entirely due what is transpiring there. But that Lafayette or indeed most anywhere else along the Front Range may allow no safety from what is occurring.


1) 'The health impacts of fracking: an open letter to the Boulder County Commissioners,' East Boulder County United
East Boulder County United | Stopping fracking in Boulder County and beyond through grassroots political organizing

2) 'Fracking operation in Erie begins near two elementary schools, wakes up neighborhood,' The Colorado Independent
Fracking operation in Erie begins near two elementary schools, wakes up neighborhood | The Colorado Independent

3) 'Boulder area: Superior, Louisville, Lafayette or Erie?,' City-Data
//www.city-data.com/forum/color...ette-erie.html
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Old 05-24-2013, 03:59 PM
 
2,253 posts, read 6,380,107 times
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Wink Alternative solutions: in roads

Note: The following has nothing per se to do with fracking, and yet perhaps a great deal, as one alternative source to our energy needs.



"Our long range goal is to cover all concrete and asphalt surfaces that are exposed to the sun with Solar Road Panels. This will lead to the end of our dependency on fossil fuels of any kind." [1]


The idea is simple and audacious enough: use our existing global road network (with modification) as an intelligent solar collection system.

With funding from the Federal Highway Administration the practical construction and trial of this is already underway. To date this is minimalist, with a trial road section installed in the companies' Sandpoint, Idaho parking lot prior to the winter of 2012/13; the full 12x36 foot section of the parking lot is scheduled for completion in spring 2013. Thus, these 12x12 foot road sections have already been developed, and now in real world testing.

One might have any number of questions. Such as perhaps if the glass surface of a solar panel would not be too smooth or fragile for road traffic. Turns out this has been addressed. Fuller answers to this and other aspects is available from Solar Roadways website.

In concept this new road system is intended to generate not only electricity but act intelligently to assist with such as signaling with LEDs embedded throughout the road (as well as heated towards winter snow). Each 12x12 foot road panel is expected to output 7,600Wh of electricity daily (based on 15% efficiency, with four hours of sunlight). By another computation, that would be 428 average American homes which could be powered by a 4-lane road of this nature, one mile long.

The German publication Der Spiegel has a brief article on this which provides a good introduction and overview.[2] One might begin there. More details are available from Solar Roadways.

If this all seems somewhat preliminary and uncertain, then of course it is. But the Brusaw's may be on to something. The next time I'm dodging yet another pothole in Colorado (per usual) I'll be reflecting on possible alternatives that prove more than ideal roadway and otherwise quite useful.


1) Solar Roadways
Solar Roadways - A Real Solution

2) 'Electric Avenue: Solar Road Panels Offer Asphalt Alternative,' Der Spiegel
Solar Road Panels Offer Asphalt Alternative - SPIEGEL ONLINE
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Old 05-27-2013, 11:51 PM
 
2,253 posts, read 6,380,107 times
Reputation: 2635
Wink Mora County Community Bill of Rights

“Existing state and federal oil and gas laws force fracking and other extraction activities into communities, overriding concerns of residents.* Today’s vote in Mora County is a clear rejection of this structure of law which elevates corporate rights over community rights, which protects industry over people and the natural environment.” [1]


Anyone familiar with Mora County in northern New Mexico knows that it is a traditional place. So much so that tradition has cycled into the future with Mora County apparently the first in the United States to ban all oil and gas extraction, which of course would also include fracking.

There is some precedent. Certain municipalities, including Longmont in Colorado, have banned fracking within city limits. In Colorado this is contentious, with the state seemingly willing to contest the wishes of local citizens. In New York, the New York State Supreme Appellate Division ruled that townships can ban fracking within municipal borders.[2] The state of Vermont has banned all fracking within the state.

Mora County is somewhat different in not only applying such a ban on a county-wide level, but also applied not only to fracking but all oil and gas extraction. The citizens of that economically poor county, as expressed through their county commissioners, have decided to forego the not inconsiderable amount of money possible, and leave the oil in the ground for perpetuity.

The feeling is that their land, water, and legacy left to their children and children's children are more important.

1) 'Press Release - First County in U.S. Bans Fracking and all Hydrocarbon Extraction - Mora County, NM,' Community Environmental Legal Defense Fund
The Community Environmental Legal Defense Fund*:*Press Release - First County in U.S. Bans Fracking and all Hydrocarbon Extraction - Mora County, NM

2) 'Mora County Commission bans oil, gas extraction,' Sangre de Cristo Chronicle
Sangre Chronicle > Archives > News > Mora County Commission bans oil, gas extraction
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Old 06-25-2013, 12:53 AM
 
2,253 posts, read 6,380,107 times
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Wink Spend, Baby, Spend

"The oil-and-gas industry punches above its weight when it comes to influence on Colorado politics," claim the authors of "Spend, Baby, Spend," the scathing report from Colorado Ethics Watch. The report notes that while the industry accounts for only about 2 percent of the state's gross domestic product and less than 1 percent of its employment — just under 30,000 jobs, according to federal data, although the Colorado Oil and Gas Association claims it's more like 44,000 — the companies involved have spent far more on state lobbying than higher education, the telecom industry, agricultural interests or just about any other major business sector except health care.' [1]


A good deal of attention is naturally upon our poor forests and so many of them presently in flames. But while the wildfires occurring now will have far reaching impact, not the only environmental impacts ongoing, or that one might have concern for.

One unfortunate aspect of these wildfires will be the negative impact to watersheds, thus to the water and the infrastructure many depend upon for its delivery. This will in some cases be severe. But no less than that out of sight and underground from decisions taken which we have a choice in.

Oil and gas interests spent more than $800,000 on campaign contributions in Colorado between 2008 and 2012, and $4.7 million more in lobbying efforts to sway public officials. From the Governor on down, those who supposedly have Colorado and her future as their highest priority, yet seemingly most concerned with politics and remaining in office. In American politics that means money and a lot of it.

We taxpayers continue to pay their salaries and pensions for some reason, but that apparently is not enough for admittance to the real game where critical decisions affecting all and this great state are made, and where corporations with real money can call the shots.

Colorado's motto is nil sine numine, or 'nothing without providence,' whatever that means. Perhaps it should better be, 'nothing without money.'

Other states, it turns out, actually take their environment more seriously: Texas, for instance, imposes a daily fine for spills ten times higher than Colorado's.

Something to remember in this unfortunate season of tragic wildfires. We collectively have influenced that, but no less so other steps taken or not influencing Colorado's environment and water.


1) 'The price of fracking in Colorado,' Denver Westword
The price of fracking in Colorado - - News - Denver - Westword
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Old 06-27-2013, 11:36 PM
 
2,253 posts, read 6,380,107 times
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Wink Gasland, Part II

"This isn't about fracking anymore. It is about who we are as a people." [1]
— Josh Fox



Josh Fox, the producer of the documentary 'Gasland, Part II' spoke with The Daily Show (Wednesday, June 26, 2013).

Among that touched upon was that the United States has plans for one to two million new gas wells. As well the building of terminals on sea coasts as to export much of this natural gas as LNG, with the projected concurrent raising of domestic natural gas prices by roughly 50%.

Natural gas is often touted as burning 50% cleaner than coal. Which, if true, overlooks its costs in extraction.

A large amount of methane leaks off from fracking well sites and in distribution. Methane is 105% more potent and injurious to our atmosphere than CO2. With but 1% leakage fracking would prove more injurious to the atmosphere than the use of coal. Current leakage rates of methane are 7 to 17%.

This is a local matter only to the extent of those who will suffer the long term consequences. The oil companies involved are often multi-national corporations, such as Shell, with no allegiance to anyone but their bottom line. American politicians on the state and federal level are largely all bought and paid for by this global industry. $774 million was spent to exempt fracking, of all things, from the clean water act.

There are however many small citizen groups springing up locally to fight this.

This particular episode can be viewed on The Daily Show website, or such as Hulu.


1) 'Exclusive - Josh Fox Extended Interview,' The Daily Show
The Daily Show with Jon Stewart - Political Comedy - Fake News | Comedy Central
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Old 07-02-2013, 08:11 PM
 
9,840 posts, read 20,561,092 times
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You sure Idunn you want to post a link that says "Political Comedy-Fake News".

Doesn't help your case and josh fox has already demonstrated many times over he peddles in fairy tales.
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Old 07-03-2013, 01:33 AM
 
2,253 posts, read 6,380,107 times
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Wink The Daily Show

Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
You sure Idunn you want to post a link that says "Political Comedy-Fake News".

Doesn't help your case and josh fox has already demonstrated many times over he peddles in fairy tales.

You better believe I do.

John Stewart has said that the viewers best appreciating his program already have a sound understanding of world events—from other sources. Being true to an extent, and naturally a good deal of content is satirical.

Nevertheless one might learn many a thing from this source that are never or barely touched upon in the mainstream media. From that ostensibly comedy, and no good reflection on the supposed "news" elsewhere. Those having payed attention of late will also know that this program has increasingly become the place to be for the influential—many a politician among them—wishing a broader, more educated, audience.

I would also add, sadly, that any American wishing to be well informed in this day and age must by necessity read what they might in our press, but look beyond to foreign publications to a gain a fuller picture of what at times is simply not found domestically.

While the source of anything might always be considered, an interview can more or less be taken on its own merits, and one decide for themselves. Josh Fox had some interesting things to say, and in this a beginning point for anyone so interested. As far as I know, none of the major networks even mentioned him or this issue the same day.
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