Retiring to Colorado/Suggestions on Walkable, Affordable Towns (Denver, Colorado Springs: for sale, condos)

[Wisteria]

Thanks for the Castle Rock tip -- I'm going to check that out - put that on my list for my drive up the eastern slope! Hadn't even thought of that. Thanks again!

[Frances]

Check out the forum for Western Colorado for my opinion.
The situations I've described will only get worse.

"I never did give anybody hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell." -Harry S. Truman

[Wisteria]

Hi Frances, I did check out your opinion there -- thank you. When someone has lived in an area that long, they do know it pretty well -- your perspective is helpful. Actually, I do have a friend who moved there from Colorado Springs and he is a hair dresser and barely makes it -- kind of fits in with what you were saying about low wages. Last I knew he was living in a boarding house! So I do believe your opinion.

The Meth problem -- oh, that is a biggie all over -- in some areas much more than others. I hadn't realized it had penetrated Grand Junction so much. It is a huge problem in the U.S. What about gangs -- do you know of gang activity there -- just curious -- because working in a juvenile facility, I know that gang activity is migrating all over the country now.

Thanks again for the feedback.

[Frances]

Gangs. Oh, my, yes, there are a number of them. But, not necessarily the inflitration of the big city gangs although I know that there are a lot of "wannabes", but I don't think they're that organized here yet.

The gangs that are here are homegrown ones. There is one in particular here that call themselves "The Filth Crew". They pledge allegiance to the shock-rock-punk band ICP-Insane Clown Posse. They are known to many in the community as gun runners, (the dealing, selling, and trading of stolen, and illegal firearms) and drug dealers.

Local law enforcement is both complacent, and clueless.

Criminal activity equates into big business here. I'm convinced that they really don't want anyone to become educated, to get well, and then, get busy figuring out how they've really been used, abused, and robbed again by the suits that orchestrate the revolving doors of jail, rehab, and social services for all the same people, and their families year after year after year. It really is quite a sad state of affairs, and, yes, I believe that it's a national trend.

It's called the dumbing down of America.

The people here that are the most dangerous, of course, are the drug users. When an addict is desperate for the next fix they're capable of anything. Under the influence of meth nothing good ever comes. There have been gunfights out on the streets here in broad daylight in recent years because of drugs.

As I said in my earlier post, the drug problem here was ignored, and dismissed as nothing more than a petty annoyance for so long- for decades in fact that there are now several generations of folks that have never known any other kind of life.

But, time changes everything, and this community will be forced into change someday because of the high influx of other citizens from different parts of the country relocating here. All this time, this town's been under the control of a good ol' boys' network, but I see that coming to an end as both time, and elections progress to replace their influence.

"We get too soon old, and too late smart..." -German proverb

[Wisteria]

That's interesting. So you see changes on the horizon? Better changes, I assume?

Well, your gang problem is not as bad as ours in California! It is really bad out here. Of course, working in the field I do, I probably hear more about it, but I do know that we have a lot of South American gangs here that are quite violent. The City of Salinas is a prime example (I'm far enough from there that I don't have to worry about it), but it, ironically, made a "best of" list to live, and I was shocked.

Where I am, it's pretty rural, so the gang kids don't travel up here so much -- it's more in the cities. But I'm very alert to that problem. And meth -- I have no understanding of the allure of that drug. I see toothless people around, and I know they're meth addicts. It's gross what it does to people.

So, where are most people moving in from, and what kinds of changes are they creating? It may be a good opportunity to enlist the aid of newcomers to get things really moving in the right direction. With you having lived there for a long time, you could offer valuable insights as to how to move your town in a better direction.

[coltoncity]

Just to let you know ALL gangs are violent not just the South American variety you have.

I dont know if I have ever heard anyone say so many colorful descriptions to catagorize people before.
Toothless people are meth heads, kids in a city are gang members as opposed to any outside a city who would never be, South American Gangs are the real violent ones and that the only people who can save a community in having troubles are people who come in from the outside to help.
Blah Im so upset I even came upon this post.

[Wisteria]

I'm not sure why you're so upset....just trying to be descriptive. Unfortunately, I work in the field, and sometimes there are certain characteristics that are stronger with certain things. And many things are not publicized.

And,you're right -- any "gang" (officially noted as a gang) is often dangerous (although there are variations, and you could research those, if you really wanted to get specifics) -- although those who label themselves gangs are not sometimes really a "gang," but rather wannabes. And we also have gangs that are not of the South American variety, however, if you learn more about the variations of gangs you may be surprised in the ways in which they differ.

I'm not sure what you're getting at because crime comes in all flavors and places -- even the country, but not usually as much because of the transportation issue and lack of population access -- it's easier to get around in cities. Although, yes, in some more rural areas they do exist.

But this post wasn't meant to be a description of "gangs," but rather a comment on what is happening in some places -- and making some places rather dangerous to live in, or not a place one would recommend moving to.

I already know that some places that are crime-ridden are being tauted as being a "good" place to move to because of location to beauty, or low cost of housing, but other aspects are totally overlooked and that is where this board helps by finding out from people already in a place who can tell you the real scoop. I find it very helpful -- I don't always agree with the opinions, however, it is nice to have personal feedback.

Thanks for yours.

P.S. The comment about South American gangs has nothing to do with South Americans -- it has to do with gangs who just happen to have originated there and are numerous here -- that's all. I am from the New York area, originally, so I am quite aware of other types of gangs that are not South American -- as I said, they come in all sorts of flavors. I somehow got the feeling it was using the location in the description that may have made it sound as if only South American gangs are dangerous.

Any person who is involved in crime, and violent crime, whether or not in a gang, is dangerous. I merely made the comment based on my immediate location. I hope this helps.

Thanks.

[coltoncity]

I know about gangs and wanna bes (which are much more dangerous) and about how harmful it is to be assumed a gang member because of your skin. It doesnt take a certain job or research to see it with your own eyes. It was Mexico before it was America, so origination of Mexican gangs is relative right? Seeing as that is when they had to bind together and protect their people from white men. (Remember? The border crossed them , they didnt cross the border) After it changed to America there was a time Hispanics had to protect their neighborhoods so they formed gangs. Especially in border towns and military instalations there was a real threat to hispanic men and especially hispanic women. (Hellooooo Wearing the sailor hat folded down)
It came from a need way back when and now knuckle heads think its cool. I look around for all that to because you have to but you dont have to work in a field you think is unfortunate ... trust me you can quit.

[caligal0]

Hi Wisteria, I live in SoCal and am hoping to move to FC area next year. I looked at CS. Nice, but prefer smaller city. You would need a car in CS. Also, I found the things you were hesitant about to be right on the nose. GJ is a very different climate and terrain. Good luck. Glad to know there is someone else out there like me moving from CA.

[Wisteria]

Hi Caligal0 -- thanks for the input -- I've been thinking seriously about the walking around factor, and Fort Collins downtown seems more walkable, and I think you're right about the Springs being spread out more and needing a car. Except for housing prices, I've been leaning more toward Ft. Collins lately.

And this is the last note in reference to ColtonCity -- I think it's realistic to look at crime stats, and to have realistic information about a location, especially if you intend to buy a home or raise children there. My job is not "unfortunate," and I'm sorry it was worded in a way that it was interpreted as such. When you work in a "helping" field you usually do so BECAUSE you want to help, not the opposite -- and there is great passion in helping those who need or desire assistance, and to form community. Many of us receive very low pay to do work that others wouldn't do, but do it because we actually care about people...which is quite different from the impression I felt from your post about my feedback...as if it was uncaring.

I won't go back into that topic after this, but felt a need to clarify that working in a particular field sometimes gives one more information, and valuable information. It is not meant as a judgement about particular people. By the way, my daughter is currently LIVING in South America, so I don't hold prejudice, or she wouldn't be there! -- I merely was stating the criminal elements that realistically are there in certain places, and it's important for people to make choices based on information. I realize you noted a sensitivity, and because this is a board that is not visual, one should not assume about another's ethnicity, religion, or background unless volunteered. I feel it is a great asset that way -- you get to exchange information, and then if you exchange private messages, you can learn more.

Thanks for all the feedback!