The colorado river is in crisis, and it's getting worse every day (Denver: standard of living, prices)

[BarryK123]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

Being mostly an arid state, Arizona really has no business having so much farm land, especially in the desert regions.

And Las Vegas has no business having so many golf courses. And then there are the Bellagio Fountains...

[jwiley]

Originally Posted by xeric

The Colorado Front Range is NOT in any way a poster child for good water stewardship. Almost everybody has Kentucky bluegrass lawns - not just one or 2 neighbors (its probably Bermuda or another warm season turf grass in Phoenix but no matter). I’m also not familiar with any Front Range city that has water restrictions every summer - can you enlighten me on this? Maybe once every 10 years if we are in a prolonged drought. Not defending Phoenix here but just pointing out that the Front Range is just as wasteful when it comes to water. And since half of our water supply comes from the Colorado River Basin, we’re not going to be able to dodge this bullet anymore then the downstream states in the southwest are.

Unless you live in Pueblo than you may want to check with your city, as they all usually have watering restrictions. Arvada, Fort Collins, Greeley, and Lakewood all had watering restrictions when I lived there, Colorado Springs had watering restrictions when my parents lived there, as well as several of the small towns like Brighton. You could only water on certain days a week and only certain hours of the day.

[xeric]

Originally Posted by jwiley

Unless you live in Pueblo than you may want to check with your city, as they all usually have watering restrictions. Arvada, Fort Collins, Greeley, and Lakewood all had watering restrictions when I lived there, Colorado Springs had watering restrictions when my parents lived there, as well as several of the small towns like Brighton. You could only water on certain days a week and only certain hours of the day.

Fort Collins has had watering restrictions once during the summer growing season since 1991. That was a severe drought year - 2002 or 2003 and residents were only allowed to water 2 days per week in summer and 1 day per week in winter. I personally think those restrictions should have been permanent but that would apparently interfere with people’s “rights” to have a lush green lawn. In 2020 there were winter watering restrictions to one day a week and the city was planning summer restrictions to 2 days a week, but a huge storm hit in April 2021 and they cancelled them.

Here are the current rules (no restrictions as usual): https://www.fcgov.com/utilities/water-restrictions

Greeley used to have permanent 3 day per week watering restrictions but they changed to a water budget model awhile ago. Last I checked, Colorado Springs had 3 day per week watering restrictions. Aurora seems to have the best water conservation program overall, with the lowest per-capital water usage in the state (except for high mountain towns). Denver, on the other hand, doesn’t even have a lawn replacement program (which is common in western cities):

https://www.coloradoindependent.com/...-conservation/

[hindsight2020]

Originally Posted by Valley Native

Also, agriculture consumes a whopping 74% of the available water supply in Arizona. I'm really not a big fan of sprawl development, but it would actually save water to get rid of most of the remaining agriculture in Maricopa & Pinal Counties & replace it with housing, shopping, and entertainment.

I'm not a fan of sprawl either, but you're 100% spot on. This incessant focus on residential use stories is such a tired red herring. They never speak the quiet part our loud and bring up agriculture use as a comparison. And I don't even say that as a defense of the entitled and ecologically apathetic American behavior mind you.

[Valley Native]

Originally Posted by BarryK123

And Las Vegas has no business having so many golf courses. And then there are the Bellagio Fountains...

Newer golf courses in the Las Vegas area are no longer allowed to use Colorado River water. The Bellagio fountains (which are on a well, not Colorado River water) are actually on the site of where a golf course used to be, and use less water than the golf course did. But I see where you're coming from. I'd rather see golf courses take a hit on water allocation than residents.

Originally Posted by hindsight2020

I'm not a fan of sprawl either, but you're 100% spot on. This incessant focus on residential use stories is such a tired red herring. They never speak the quiet part our loud and bring up agriculture use as a comparison. And I don't even say that as a defense of the entitled and ecologically apathetic American behavior mind you.

Yep. States like California & Colorado have it all wrong when they put restrictions on water for residential landscape, but lawns & trees demand far less water than farming. One thing that Arizona is doing right is restricting water to agriculture first & foremost, and there are no restrictions on residential use ... at least, not yet. I'd hate to see what Phoenix would look like if everybody was required to cut back on watering their yards & trees, or forced to rip out their greenery. It would really look unattractive! Desert landscape (especially crushed rock) generates heat, which we certainly don't need more of!

[xeric]

I don’t think residential use is a red herring at all. Every time a western state needs new water for more people moving to it’s cities, the first idea is always to build a new water project. Municipal water use policy in the west is generally an argument between water conservation and new water projects. You can talk about the imbalance of how much agriculture uses vs. other uses and it’s a good argument to have but in general the cities are still not dipping into that giant pot in any substantial way. If it were up to me, there would be no more water projects in the West, ever. The farmers would charge top-dollar for their existing water rights and cities would have to address how much of those expensive water rights they need to buy as opposed to implementing mandatory conservation measures.

The environmental benefit of irrigated landscaping, however, IS a giant red herring generally propagated by people who don’t like living in a desert (or shortgrass prairie). Pumping large amounts of water over mountains to cities produces carbon emissions. And then using half that water to keep a giant sponge (aka an irrigated lawn) moist to cool the air above it is a very inefficient method of cooling. It’s also a very inefficient way to water trees (as opposed to using a hose to water the roots).

[WRM20]

When the City of Houston had water use restrictions, one of them was allowing lawns to be watered only by hand at really inconvenient hours. Businesses and such that had alternate water sources were still allowed to use sprinklers, for example, Rice University has sumps that collect huge amounts of ground water from around basements, and that's used for watering the trees and grass.

[moguldreamer]

Originally Posted by Mike from back east

We built the 800-mile Alaska oil pipeline under hurry up conditions in a dreadful climate across pristine lands, but we can't find the will to build an 835-mile water pipeline to move some of the prodigious flow of the Columbia River from Boardman, OR to drop it into the COLO River at Moab, UT.

The litigation over that proposal would probably take 50 years to work its way through court as NGO self-important EnviroNazis do everything possible to prevent it.

[Mike from back east]

Originally Posted by moguldreamer

The litigation over that proposal would probably take 50 years to work its way through court as NGO self-important EnviroNazis do everything possible to prevent it.

What I always wonder is who funds those enviro groups that try to stop everything. My deep suspicion is that there are some foreign actors in the mix doing their best to keep us crippled, especially anything to do with transport infrastructure which is a key underlying foundation to compete in a global economy. Having worked for DoD for 30 years I've learned a lot about how our enemies use every means possible to keep us frustrated and now with social media they're able to spread massive disinformation and foment agitation.

[VikingsToValhalla]

I find it bizarre why more money isn't being invested into new desalination technology.
The planet's surface is 70% ocean water, why not use it?