[MikefromCT]

Originally Posted by JViello

I'm not going to get into the BBS debate with you, but that statement above tells me you are clueless about the city and/or other places in the country.

Hartford is FAR FAR FAR from being "gridlocked".

The curves on 84 are the worst the city has to offer, and by national standards, it's not bad.

East of the river Gridlocked? Come on. You mean 600 feet of traffic to get over the Founders? LOL

I made a post about traffic East of the river, with pictures taken from my work truck during rush hour. One exit out of the city and I was going 55+ with little traffic. HARDLY gridlock.

Read it for yourself:

//www.city-data.com/forum/4164166-post17.html

No, I'm pretty knowledgeable about the city, thank you.

I'm glad you enjoy a comfortable commute on I84, because more often than not when I'm on it - eastbound or westbound - it's been consistent traffic snarl. I'm not making this up. Just because you yourself have found it to be smooth sailing doesn't mean everyone else does. Whenever I go to Mass. to see frends of mine I always jump on 218 thru Bloomfield and Windsor and pick up I-91 N there - in part because I can since it's not far for me but also because at least it moves. I've had enough frustrating experiences with the 84/91 interchange - again, at various times of day and sometimes night - where I avoid it. 84 westbound coming into Hartford isn't too bad if you're in Manchester or E Htfd, but believe me, if you stay on 84 westbound past the exits for downtown it can be brutal. There's an accident or something happening on this stretch regularly that often results in a lane closure.

So that's it. I'm not going to argue about any of this anymore. So please, be nice and share your vegetables with others.

[njohnson]

I haven't been there too many times, maybe 5 or so but it has some stores that I like, notably C&B, REI, and B&N. The rest are a bit too foofoo for me but my girl does like Ann Taylor and White House/Black Market. We did have a great salad at Rizzutos.

Architecturally it doesn't fit into the rest of the area but I don't feel it's bad, they want it to be different and I like the small town feel they created with it.

Honestly what I want in West Hartford are some really nice wine bars or swanky lounges. Everything in the old West Hartford closes way too early, I think the latest is the Elbow Room which is just ok. A few months back we met a friend there and everything seemed dead by 10pm so we had to venture into Hartford, duck a few bullets (ok just kidding), and head to Trumbull Kitchen.

I'd open a nice wine bar but I don't have that type of cash laying around, I personally think it'd be a big hit, especially with a number of high end restaurants nearby such as Max's, Briccos, Grants, and others.

[jojofree]

I choose not to shop there because of the parking situation.
Gaining access to any business should be convenient. JMO

[JViello]

Originally Posted by MikefromCT

but believe me, if you stay on 84 westbound past the exits for downtown it can be brutal. There's an accident or something happening on this stretch regularly that often results in a lane closure.

So that's it. I'm not going to argue about any of this anymore. So please, be nice and share your vegetables with others.

No it's not. Period. I run a service business and travel the highways all day every day going East and West of the river so I know what I'm talking about.

You ever live in a major Southeastern city?

Ever try traffic in Orlando? How about Atlanta? Charlotte? DC?

THAT is brutal. Not a 10 minute delay getting out of Hartford.

Sorry.

[JViello]

Originally Posted by njohnson

II'd open a nice wine bar but I don't have that type of cash laying around, I personally think it'd be a big hit, especially with a number of high end restaurants nearby such as Max's, Briccos, Grants, and others.

Bin 228 Hartford. Great place, great wine, great food.

__bin228__

Just try not to get tangled up in all the "horrible" traffic or get lost on all the "one way streets."

[JayCT]

Originally Posted by njohnson

I'd open a nice wine bar but I don't have that type of cash laying around, I personally think it'd be a big hit, especially with a number of high end restaurants nearby such as Max's, Briccos, Grants, and others.

Actually they are going to be opening one on Raymond Road in Blue Back Square opposite Whole Foods. It is going through the approval process now and should be opened later this year. Jay

[MikefromCT]

Originally Posted by JViello

You ever live in a major Southeastern city?

Ever try traffic in Orlando? How about Atlanta? Charlotte? DC?

THAT is brutal. Not a 10 minute delay getting out of Hartford.

Those cities have about 3x the population of Hartford, so OF COURSE traffic is going to be worse there. I guess what I was saying is from my own experiences being on 84 has been a pain in the ass. It doesn't make either of us "wrong." It's all based on one's experience.

No, I haven't been to Atlanta or Charlotte but I have battled the freeways in LA many times before and it's probably the worst of the worst. It's the only EXPWY I know that has six lanes and is routinely jammed. It is bad out there.

I think we're getting carried away by this and not focusing on the big thing: The Cheesecake Factory is damn good!

[ironhacker]

Originally Posted by JayCT

Ironhacker - Where have you seen this "done better"?

OK, here it is:

crocker park westlake - Google Maps

Originally Posted by JayCT

Blue Back Square is hardly "cookie-cutter". In fact, it is a model for mixed use development throughout the country. Developers from other states have come here to see it and are using it as an example for their developments.

THIS is what BBS is a copy of: crocker park - Google Image Search

Do any of those photos look familiar to you? Thought so!

http://www.crockerpark.com

I don't see any other developments ANYWHERE looking to emulate that pricey BBS parking garage.

Highway access, more stores, and free parking (even in the garages) make the difference between crowded and empty stores. This is what BBS could have been.

[njohnson]

Originally Posted by JViello

Bin 228 Hartford. Great place, great wine, great food.

__bin228__

Just try not to get tangled up in all the "horrible" traffic or get lost on all the "one way streets."

Oh yeah I knew about that place, I was looking for something in West Hartford downtown area to have dinner and then walk to a nice wine bar or lounge.

Originally Posted by JayCT

Actually they are going to be opening one on Raymond Road in Blue Back Square opposite Whole Foods. It is going through the approval process now and should be opened later this year. Jay

Great, any clue what the name of it is? I'm interested to see what it is.

[JayCT]

Ironhacker - What makes this better than Blue Back? It is bigger, but that does not make it better. As for your percieved similarities in architectural styles, well BBS is no more similar to this than West Hartford Town Hall is to Independence Hall. They have similar architectural styles but they are not cookie-cutter. I did notice that the Dick's Sporting Goods store in that complex looks exactly like the one at the mall in Buckland Hills. So which development has the "cookie-cutter" design?

Also, this is New England and large scale developments are rare. We do not have multiple regional malls like other major cities around the country. You do not see vacant shopping malls here like you would see other places. In general, retail in Connecticut is under-stored because we have limited sites to build on. Again this is NOT the midwest so you can't really compare them.

Being on the highway is not a necessity either. Like I said, why has West Hartford Center thrived while downtown areas on the highway like New Britain struggled? Ask any retailer and they will tell you that they would rather be in an area surrounded by affluent neighborhoods than in a remote location on the edge of town. Furthermore using your logic, it would mean that places like the Farmington Valley are not desirable because the towns there are not accessible to highways. We know that is not true.

I will agree that having free parking is nice, but it was just not possible for BBS because of the location. Limited site size means structured parking and structured parking costs money. Someone has to pay for it, so it is the user. Will this be a problem for BBS? Only time will tell. Judging from the crowds I see there, so far I do not think so. JMHO, Jay