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Hey all, grew up in the state, just popping back in.
First off, this thread shows me why I'm happy to not live in the state any longer. The OP talks about nice suburban neighborhoods within cities - as if a neighborhood needs to be dominated by single-family homes with yards, with no walkable business district, in order to be "nice." It's just my own opinion, but why bother living in a city - with higher taxes and such - if you don't have city amenities like access to transit, a quick walk to shops and bars, etc.
IMHO Connecticut cities don't really suck because of "the poors." Somewhere like Portland (or Burlington) is of course not comparable. But closer cities are. Providence is only a bit bigger than Conneticut's larger cities, but it has a much better downtown, a prosperous east side, and the amazing urban neighborhood of Federal Hill. Many small Massachusetts cities, including New Bedford and Lowell, have revitalized their downtowns. Worchester has the Green Island area right outside of its CBD which has become a hipster area. And in the Hudson Valley there are upscale urban enclaves in Albany, Kingston, and elsewhere. All of this is in spite of these areas having relatively substantial nonwhite populations.
Connecticut's issue is that it went very heavily "all in" during the urban renewal era. The cities became convinced that the solution to residents, employers, and customers leaving for the suburbs was to offer continually increasing parking. But in order to provide that parking, they had to demolish a large portion their greater downtown areas. The more buildings were knocked down, the less people went to downtown. Fundamentally, you can't turn a CBD into a shopping mall or an office park.
Of course, things did not unroll similarly in every city. New Haven was relatively lightly touched by urban renewal. It lost its waterfront, but kept much of its CBD, and pretty uniquely kept residential neighborhoods like East Rock and Wooster Square within walking distance of downtown (both of which are desirable middle class areas now). In contrast, Hartford basically leveled everything to convert its CBD into an area filled with office towers for the insurance industry and state workers. The CBD is also surrounded by highways on all sides but one, and has blocks of space surrounding it which are a no-man's land filled with parking lots and institutional uses. You couldn't point to a neighborhood primed for gentrification there, because there's no neighborhood which bumps right against the CBD like in New Haven.
That said, having lived elsewhere in the country (including Detroit for awhile) Connecticut's cities could be worse. Even during the worst periods for them, there was relatively little abandonment, so you don't see blocks and blocks of urban prairie. Still, given the movement of employment and young professionals into urban areas, Connecticut is going to have to do a better job building at least some of its cities back up again, or it will continue to see a large proportion of children raised in the state never returning after graduating high school or college.
Many people who live in CT really don't have much interest in our cities, and are happy to watch them slowly die. I think many people view living in CT as a way to have amenities without actually living in a city. Whereas other states look to their cities for growth we look at our suburbs. I think it would take a big change in thinking to fix it. Which is a shame really.
Hey all, grew up in the state, just popping back in.
First off, this thread shows me why I'm happy to not live in the state any longer. The OP talks about nice suburban neighborhoods within cities - as if a neighborhood needs to be dominated by single-family homes with yards, with no walkable business district, in order to be "nice." It's just my own opinion, but why bother living in a city - with higher taxes and such - if you don't have city amenities like access to transit, a quick walk to shops and bars, etc.
IMHO Connecticut cities don't really suck because of "the poors." Somewhere like Portland (or Burlington) is of course not comparable. But closer cities are. Providence is only a bit bigger than Conneticut's larger cities, but it has a much better downtown, a prosperous east side, and the amazing urban neighborhood of Federal Hill. Many small Massachusetts cities, including New Bedford and Lowell, have revitalized their downtowns. Worchester has the Green Island area right outside of its CBD which has become a hipster area. And in the Hudson Valley there are upscale urban enclaves in Albany, Kingston, and elsewhere. All of this is in spite of these areas having relatively substantial nonwhite populations.
Connecticut's issue is that it went very heavily "all in" during the urban renewal era. The cities became convinced that the solution to residents, employers, and customers leaving for the suburbs was to offer continually increasing parking. But in order to provide that parking, they had to demolish a large portion their greater downtown areas. The more buildings were knocked down, the less people went to downtown. Fundamentally, you can't turn a CBD into a shopping mall or an office park.
Of course, things did not unroll similarly in every city. New Haven was relatively lightly touched by urban renewal. It lost its waterfront, but kept much of its CBD, and pretty uniquely kept residential neighborhoods like East Rock and Wooster Square within walking distance of downtown (both of which are desirable middle class areas now). In contrast, Hartford basically leveled everything to convert its CBD into an area filled with office towers for the insurance industry and state workers. The CBD is also surrounded by highways on all sides but one, and has blocks of space surrounding it which are a no-man's land filled with parking lots and institutional uses. You couldn't point to a neighborhood primed for gentrification there, because there's no neighborhood which bumps right against the CBD like in New Haven.
That said, having lived elsewhere in the country (including Detroit for awhile) Connecticut's cities could be worse. Even during the worst periods for them, there was relatively little abandonment, so you don't see blocks and blocks of urban prairie. Still, given the movement of employment and young professionals into urban areas, Connecticut is going to have to do a better job building at least some of its cities back up again, or it will continue to see a large proportion of children raised in the state never returning after graduating high school or college.
Have you been to any Connecticut city recently? They are pretty vibtant now. New Haven has tons of things to do, as does Hartford. Dunkin Donuts Park has played to MANY sell out games this year. The Infinity Music Hall attracts wonderful talent almost every night. The Xfinity Meadows has a lot of great concerts. There is Hartford Stage, Theaterworks and the Bushnell. There is the Wadsworth and Connecticut Science Center. And there are many restaurants aswell. There have been a couple of thousand new apartments added to downtown Hartford and they are renting as fast as they are being built. The problem with Hartford is that it is so small, only 17 square miles, that it does not have a lot of room for nicer neighborhoods like larger cities. The West End is very nice and West Hartford is really just an extension of Hartford itself. Its only separated by an invisible line some where in the West End. Hartford is the second largest employment center in New England with more than 115,000 workers. Not bad for a small city. Jay
Have you been to any Connecticut city recently? They are pretty vibtant now. New Haven has tons of things to do, as does Hartford. Dunkin Donuts Park has played to MANY sell out games this year. The Infinity Music Hall attracts wonderful talent almost every night. The Xfinity Meadows has a lot of great concerts. There is Hartford Stage, Theaterworks and the Bushnell. There is the Wadsworth and Connecticut Science Center. And there are many restaurants aswell. There have been a couple of thousand new apartments added to downtown Hartford and they are renting as fast as they are being built. The problem with Hartford is that it is so small, only 17 square miles, that it does not have a lot of room for nicer neighborhoods like larger cities. The West End is very nice and West Hartford is really just an extension of Hartford itself. Its only separated by an invisible line some where in the West End. Hartford is the second largest employment center in New England with more than 115,000 workers. Not bad for a small city. Jay
I was in New Haven back in the spring. I spent the better part of a day walking around Downtown, East Rock, and Wooster Square. The amount of new development over the past 14 years was pretty breathtaking, though the city clearly still has some ways to go. I feel like if New Haven's downtown scored a major employer or two it would be firing on all engines.
I spent some time driving randomly around in Bridgeport, which didn't seem to different from what I remembered - nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be, but not that much new and interesting going on either.
I didn't get into Hartford, though I did stop off in West Hartford for dinner with my family (I like West Hartford, but the big parking lots behind the business district confuses me - does everyone drive there and park, or does anyone in West Hartford walk there?). Honestly while the downtown events are a good thing, that's still being stuck in the late 20th century paradigm where the city is somewhere you go for a night on the town, and then you return home to your cozy suburb. Cities need to be 24 hour areas with middle-class residents as well, and the few new downtown apartments are a drop in the bucket (nowhere near what New Haven has in and around its downtown. The West End is nice...for Hartford...but the Farmington Avenue business district isn't that impressive (half fast food and strip malls) and the neighborhood doesn't seem like it's gotten any more gentrified.
Although this might sound weird, I've long felt Frog Hollow actually holds the most upside potential of gentrification. I know it's a high-crime, Latino neighborhood, but it has all the raw materials. It's the only intact Hartford neighborhood where you can walk to downtown without having to cross a highway (though it would be up to a half hour). It has some of the best historic urban housing stock in the state with all of the brick walkups. And although it's run down and half abandoned, the Park Street business district is still mostly intact with lots of beautiful 19th century buildings. Definitely the most functional urban neighborhood in Hartford - it just needs to be more of a mixed-income area.
I was in New Haven back in the spring. I spent the better part of a day walking around Downtown, East Rock, and Wooster Square. The amount of new development over the past 14 years was pretty breathtaking, though the city clearly still has some ways to go. I feel like if New Haven's downtown scored a major employer or two it would be firing on all engines.
I spent some time driving randomly around in Bridgeport, which didn't seem to different from what I remembered - nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be, but not that much new and interesting going on either.
I didn't get into Hartford, though I did stop off in West Hartford for dinner with my family (I like West Hartford, but the big parking lots behind the business district confuses me - does everyone drive there and park, or does anyone in West Hartford walk there?). Honestly while the downtown events are a good thing, that's still being stuck in the late 20th century paradigm where the city is somewhere you go for a night on the town, and then you return home to your cozy suburb. Cities need to be 24 hour areas with middle-class residents as well, and the few new downtown apartments are a drop in the bucket (nowhere near what New Haven has in and around its downtown. The West End is nice...for Hartford...but the Farmington Avenue business district isn't that impressive (half fast food and strip malls) and the neighborhood doesn't seem like it's gotten any more gentrified.
Although this might sound weird, I've long felt Frog Hollow actually holds the most upside potential of gentrification. I know it's a high-crime, Latino neighborhood, but it has all the raw materials. It's the only intact Hartford neighborhood where you can walk to downtown without having to cross a highway (though it would be up to a half hour). It has some of the best historic urban housing stock in the state with all of the brick walkups. And although it's run down and half abandoned, the Park Street business district is still mostly intact with lots of beautiful 19th century buildings. Definitely the most functional urban neighborhood in Hartford - it just needs to be more of a mixed-income area.
It’s not a few apartments, it’s a couple thousand. And more are being planned and built. Again it’s making a difference.
I can see what you say about Frog Hollow. It has some interesting architecture but the crime is an issue. It’s gotten better but has a way to go. I also think Asylum Hill could be nicer. There are some stunning streets. Again the crime is a deterrent. Jay
See when I think of a City. Think of a City that has neighborhoods with a grocery store, shops, restaurants, and parks. Able to walk from one neighborhood to the next or easily use public transportation. Then the City Center has restaurants, shops, theater, a Green, a sport venue, concert venue, hospital's, and so forth. Then the entire City is walkable. There are a slew of apartment and condo complexes in a City relatively new. With the inner part of the City having more older and historical buildings. If near the water a working port that also is a tourist attraction. Bike paths through out the City. Has a University. Has a artsy neighborhood. The City has museums as well as a symphony orchestra. Cobblestone or brick streets in parts of the City. Few tall buildings.
It’s not a few apartments, it’s a couple thousand. And more are being planned and built. Again it’s making a difference.
I can see what you say about Frog Hollow. It has some interesting architecture but the crime is an issue. It’s gotten better but has a way to go. I also think Asylum Hill could be nicer. There are some stunning streets. Again the crime is a deterrent. Jay
I think Parkville Froghollow and the south end have the best chances of becoming popular livable neighbor hoods. There has been improvement in Parkville and the South end but still well short of a critical mass.
Hey all, grew up in the state, just popping back in.
First off, this thread shows me why I'm happy to not live in the state any longer. The OP talks about nice suburban neighborhoods within cities - as if a neighborhood needs to be dominated by single-family homes with yards, with no walkable business district, in order to be "nice." It's just my own opinion, but why bother living in a city - with higher taxes and such - if you don't have city amenities like access to transit, a quick walk to shops and bars, etc.
IMHO Connecticut cities don't really suck because of "the poors." Somewhere like Portland (or Burlington) is of course not comparable. But closer cities are. Providence is only a bit bigger than Conneticut's larger cities, but it has a much better downtown, a prosperous east side, and the amazing urban neighborhood of Federal Hill. Many small Massachusetts cities, including New Bedford and Lowell, have revitalized their downtowns. Worchester has the Green Island area right outside of its CBD which has become a hipster area. And in the Hudson Valley there are upscale urban enclaves in Albany, Kingston, and elsewhere. All of this is in spite of these areas having relatively substantial nonwhite populations.
Connecticut's issue is that it went very heavily "all in" during the urban renewal era. The cities became convinced that the solution to residents, employers, and customers leaving for the suburbs was to offer continually increasing parking. But in order to provide that parking, they had to demolish a large portion their greater downtown areas. The more buildings were knocked down, the less people went to downtown. Fundamentally, you can't turn a CBD into a shopping mall or an office park.
Of course, things did not unroll similarly in every city. New Haven was relatively lightly touched by urban renewal. It lost its waterfront, but kept much of its CBD, and pretty uniquely kept residential neighborhoods like East Rock and Wooster Square within walking distance of downtown (both of which are desirable middle class areas now). In contrast, Hartford basically leveled everything to convert its CBD into an area filled with office towers for the insurance industry and state workers. The CBD is also surrounded by highways on all sides but one, and has blocks of space surrounding it which are a no-man's land filled with parking lots and institutional uses. You couldn't point to a neighborhood primed for gentrification there, because there's no neighborhood which bumps right against the CBD like in New Haven.
That said, having lived elsewhere in the country (including Detroit for awhile) Connecticut's cities could be worse. Even during the worst periods for them, there was relatively little abandonment, so you don't see blocks and blocks of urban prairie. Still, given the movement of employment and young professionals into urban areas, Connecticut is going to have to do a better job building at least some of its cities back up again, or it will continue to see a large proportion of children raised in the state never returning after graduating high school or college.
I would say New Haven downtown is superior to Providence’s downtown at this point. Providence does have Federal Hill though, which is very vibrant.
Have you been to any Connecticut city recently? They are pretty vibtant now. New Haven has tons of things to do, as does Hartford. Dunkin Donuts Park has played to MANY sell out games this year. The Infinity Music Hall attracts wonderful talent almost every night. The Xfinity Meadows has a lot of great concerts. There is Hartford Stage, Theaterworks and the Bushnell. There is the Wadsworth and Connecticut Science Center. And there are many restaurants aswell. There have been a couple of thousand new apartments added to downtown Hartford and they are renting as fast as they are being built. The problem with Hartford is that it is so small, only 17 square miles, that it does not have a lot of room for nicer neighborhoods like larger cities. The West End is very nice and West Hartford is really just an extension of Hartford itself. Its only separated by an invisible line some where in the West End. Hartford is the second largest employment center in New England with more than 115,000 workers. Not bad for a small city. Jay
I have been to most CT cities recently. While a small handful have vibrant sections, there is not one city in CT I can agree that is anywhere close to “vibrant”.
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