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Further, the panic and disruption to others and the flight in general is not necessary. We all choose when to fly commercial vs flying private. This is one of those times we should choose to fly private.
Who is this "we" who can "choose to fly private?" Did you have a personal assistant type that for you?
They have kicked small children off before. If the crew feels they are creating a disturbance or a possibly unsafe situation (for them OR others) they have the right to make that decision. In the case I recall reading about, the small child (no disability) refused to keep her seat belt on for takeoff and the mom tried to insist the girl be allowed to sit in her lap, and both were escorted off the plane.
My point, in part, was that the daughter was not doing anything threatening, disruptive, noncompliant, etc. yet. I don't know how the mom phrased this with the flight attendant, but I think it was along the lines of "I am concerned that if my daughter doesn't get hot food, she might meltdown and when she is melting down, she could scratch people." And the plane did in fact have jambalaya, which I agree they didn't have to offer to the daughter. So do we kick people off plane for something that a person might/could do?
Do we kick off a 300 lb. bodybuilder who looks really mean and vicious? What if he has a felony conviction for assaulting someone? God, he could have been taking steroids, which means he could get violent and snap our necks! Land the plane. Oh, lord, look a brown person that looks like an Arab! He could hijack our plane! Jump on the guy and land the plane. How preemptive or prophylactic do we get? There has to be some perceptive action, no?
Some people are making up the narrative without facts supporting it (of course, it is possible that I didn't see the article that spells it all out). The mom was "threatening" the flight attendant that no hot food = nail attack. Maybe, maybe not. We don't know, do we? Has the mom talked about this specifically?
I think this is supposed to be funny but it is not at all.
I regret that you were offended by the post that did not entertain you adequately, and may have been perceived to be offensive by some. You have my insincerest apologies.
My point, in part, was that the daughter was not doing anything threatening, disruptive, noncompliant, etc. yet. I don't know how the mom phrased this with the flight attendant, but I think it was along the lines of "I am concerned that if my daughter doesn't get hot food, she might meltdown and when she is melting down, she could scratch people." And the plane did in fact have jambalaya, which I agree they didn't have to offer to the daughter. So do we kick people off plane for something that a person might/could do?
Well we may not know but I and other people know that the mom said this in and interview:
Quote:
Beegle said. "I said, after she has a melt down and tries to scratch in frustration, will you help her then?"
And:
Quote:
Beegle said she told flight attendants that her daughter was about to have a tantrum, and that she could scratch someone.
If she is telling interviewers she said that I am pretty sure what she actually said was much worse. Other people have rights too.
Also she was doing things that were threatening and disruptive:
Quote:
One passenger said she agreed with United’s decision to land the plane and remove the family.
“There was a lot of howling and like, what’s going on?†passenger Marilyn Hedlund said. “It never stopped.â€
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTQ3000
Do we kick off a 300 lb. bodybuilder who looks really mean and vicious? What if he has a felony conviction for assaulting someone? God, he could have been taking steroids, which means he could get violent and snap our necks! Land the plane. Oh, lord, look a brown person that looks like an Arab! He could hijack our plane! Jump on the guy and land the plane. How preemptive or prophylactic do we get? There has to be some perceptive action, no?
Certainly if he starts making threats like "If Jimmy does is about to have a tantrum, and he could assault someone. Get Jimmy his oatmeal cause you do not want to see Jimmy mad!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTQ3000
Some people are making up the narrative without facts supporting it (of course, it is possible that I didn't see the article that spells it all out). The mom was "threatening" the flight attendant that no hot food = nail attack. Maybe, maybe not. We don't know, do we? Has the mom talked about this specifically?
Mick
Well at least you admit you do not have enough information to make an informed decision so now I understand where you are coming from.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTQ3000
I regret that you were offended by the post that did not entertain you adequately, and may have been perceived to be offensive by some. You have my insincerest apologies.
Mick
I understand that you think this situation is funny. Cool. Your attempt at humor while not offensive to me just was non-sensical. Howard Stern has a much more refined sense of humor.
My last link is 12 years old. My first is as recent as 2 and half years ago, with replies as recent as a few months ago with the same accusation against the schools. You can claim something never happens all you want. It doesnt make it a reality, sorry to say.
Any child that had been forced onto Ritalin must take it for a lifetime, doesnt matter if today that 'force' is no longer the case. Its too late for those that are or were.
If on this very day what you are trying to establish holds true for every child in every state and American Territory, then bravo! But I am hardly making this stuff up, lol.
I guess certain people depend on parents not being aware of the law - like a Bill was passed in 2005 preventing schools from doing this. Just like people still find ways to discriminate in employment against the disabled, when that bill was passed in 1990 - and the bill on color dates back to the 60s.
There is a law put into place by Bush that a school can not deny services based on a child not receiving medication. It's a federal law, and any school not following it should be sued.
Can CPS force medication: probably
Can a psychiatrist force medication: probably
Can a school force medication or force seeing a medical doctor to provide medication: no
Will there be a few cases of people breaking the law: yes
So does anyone see any evidence of discrimination? I dont from what i've read. They had no obligation to provide food. Certainly, the employees could have been flexible and more sympathetic, but its not unlawful.
As for getting kicked off the plane the mother will argue its was because here daughter was autistic, and the United will argue that the daughter posed a threat. Its a tough, but the fact that the mother said that she will have a meltdown and will try to scratch tells me that the comfort and safety of the passengers could be comprimised and therefore justifies United's actions.
I don't think they would have been force off the plane without the mother's comments. The child might have had a minor meltdown and then calmed down. If the meltdown had progressed enough for the use of restraints, maybe the diversion of the plane would have been necessary. (Although I doubt it.)
I also wonder how the second flight went. Did the mom get steaming hot food from Delta? did she make other arrangements? Did she threaten that crew with a "meltdown and scatches"?
How many other flights has she had where she said the same thing to the crew? Was she able to finish those flights?
My point, in part, was that the daughter was not doing anything threatening, disruptive, noncompliant, etc. yet. I don't know how the mom phrased this with the flight attendant, but I think it was along the lines of "I am concerned that if my daughter doesn't get hot food, she might meltdown and when she is melting down, she could scratch people." And the plane did in fact have jambalaya, which I agree they didn't have to offer to the daughter. So do we kick people off plane for something that a person might/could do?
Do we kick off a 300 lb. bodybuilder who looks really mean and vicious? What if he has a felony conviction for assaulting someone? God, he could have been taking steroids, which means he could get violent and snap our necks! Land the plane. Oh, lord, look a brown person that looks like an Arab! He could hijack our plane! Jump on the guy and land the plane. How preemptive or prophylactic do we get? There has to be some perceptive action, no?
Some people are making up the narrative without facts supporting it (of course, it is possible that I didn't see the article that spells it all out). The mom was "threatening" the flight attendant that no hot food = nail attack. Maybe, maybe not. We don't know, do we? Has the mom talked about this specifically?
Mick
Yes, the mom has said She used the words "a meltdown" and "scratching". She phrased it differently in each interview.
If the guardian of a body builder says that you better supply "x" or he will have a meltdown and assault people, they would kick them off the plane. You can't make threats on a plane.
I have seen an elderly person be escorted off a plane for erratic behavior, as well as a drunk person. Both were deemed incapable of flying. The drunk needed to sober up, and the elderly person needed an attendant. (The airlines sometimes send additional personnel with an elderly person, but usually they don't.)
Last edited by Meyerland; 05-14-2015 at 07:44 AM..
I get the air line on this. I am not anti autism, or disabilities by any means...but I traveled quite a bit with toddlers...two of them. And I was mommy on the spot with food, snacks, games, distractions, water, juice. Heck I even brought m&ms to bribe them slowly with and distract them with. And I am not a candy mom. I anticipated my kids could have a melt down or tantrum and prepared for that. I didn't anticipate or expect the airlines to do anything special except maybe let us board first (and that was mostly for other people).
And then the landing. A 15 year old girl is strong, as strong as many adults. In my experience, autistic people can be extremely strong and unpredictable when a melt down happens. I would have landed as soon as the mom threatened a melt down.
The mom should have planned better. And if there is no way to keep her daughter calm enough for a flight, then they have to make other travel arrangements. Life isn't fair.
Its up to crew to decide when they have a problem or possible problem and need to land. Enough said;IMO.
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