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Am I the only person who has never seen any Star Wars or Star Trek movies or shows?
My dad watched Star Trek when I was growing up so I had seen that. I avoided Star Wars until I had kids. My second child loved Darth Vader from the first time the commercials came out for the twenty five year anniversary. He was only three. We rented a couple of movies and then finally bought him the set. I started enjoying them then.
Lol. Folks ready to go to blows over Trek vs Wars aye. Well, I reckon there's street gangs out there and old family feds drawn up over stranger lines. Personally, I find the two imaginary universes to be so disparate as there is no comparing them, thus I take each at face value of entertainment. Which is all I see them as. Entertainment. I'm sure not willing to get to feuding over which one is "better". Fantasy is just that ya know. This rather equates to fighting over a womans (or mans) ....affections... that's starring in a porn flick. Mixing it up to get the attention of a mere image that isn't real and never will be. (Sigh) Such a world we enjoy.
I suppose if I just HAD to pick one of the two universes to live in , the cowboy in me says Star Wars, but the older and wiser body I inhabit these days says Treks universe would be far more comfortable with longer life expectancy. Lol, but I ain't willing to fight about it.
Lol. Folks ready to go to blows over Trek vs Wars aye. Well, I reckon there's street gangs out there and old family feds drawn up over stranger lines. Personally, I find the two imaginary universes to be so disparate as there is no comparing them, thus I take each at face value of entertainment. Which is all I see them as. Entertainment. I'm sure not willing to get to feuding over which one is "better". Fantasy is just that ya know. This rather equates to fighting over a womans (or mans) ....affections... that's starring in a porn flick. Mixing it up to get the attention of a mere image that isn't real and never will be. (Sigh) Such a world we enjoy.
I suppose if I just HAD to pick one of the two universes to live in , the cowboy in me says Star Wars, but the older and wiser body I inhabit these days says Treks universe would be far more comfortable with longer life expectancy. Lol, but I ain't willing to fight about it.
No need to fight. You just use the Vulcan death grip.
"Get a life, will you people? You've turned an enjoyable little job that I did as a lark for a few years into a colossal waste of time! How old are you people? What have you done with yourselves? There's a whole world out there! When I was your age I didn't watch television, I lived! So, move out of your parents basements, and get your own apartments and grow the hell up!"
Shatner lost a lot of fans from that one, putting down people for admiring your work sufficently to choose to play in its world. He goes to the cons now. The DS9 people attended conventions during and after the show, as did and do the tng cast. It's rare that your work is remembered so long and they see it as a positive.
The goal of a tv show is to make the setting real for the viewers and sell their characters as real too. When people want to gather and *celebrate* it it just says that they did their job.
And don't forget, fans are drawn to other fans. They share more than they don't. The sciffy tv shows who gather a fandom like spending time with others who choose to exist in some way in that world too. This isn't just scifi, but other kinds of entertainment, but the earliest rising of a fandom was with science fiction, and all the others have copied. The really cool thing now is that there are many more 'segments' of media fandom, along with being part of sciffy fandom in general, and instead of arguing who is best and actual negativity, people are celebrating the creativity and imagination which has made fantasy/science fiction/space/general tech fantasy a bigger fandom than ever, and one who is no longer looked upon as belonging to a few odd and isolated geeks.
The biggest example is Comicon, which now is in multiple cities, but started in San Diego. I ran the hospitality (for guests and staff) area for a couple of years in the eighties. It still fit in the one convention center, but the big studios and others in entertainment were coming to show their projects to the fans. I haven't been for some time, and its too busy for me now, but what I recognize is that the people who come in some kind of costume come to have fun and live in a different world for a few days. It's interesting with costumes that hide who you are, a number of people with face recognition, come IN costume so they can just go and play. And science fiction worldcons continue to grow. People have embrased the idea that its okay to play, be it at a big convention or in a story or with some friends in conversation.
Or writing fanfiction, even if mine is somewhat darker and in a darker trek alternative world.
It's notable that the people who created these little universes gladly come and join the celebration with their fans and have from the start. All but Babylon 5, which was a very good story, similar in its ways to DS9, but didn't want to share the universe.
Shatner wouldn't be saying that now. Lots of people have been inspired to grab a little piece of the future in their lives by studying something which is a part of it, for one thing. The explosion of that future into reality (like your cell phone, and tablet and interdependence with the web) happened in part because people LIKED the idea so much. Remember, the first flip phone was an actual copy of the TOS communicator. You can still buy flip phones which look just like them. The man who invented it actually got the scematics for the communicator from a friend who worked with the show because they wished it to be very clear what inspired it.
And yes, a lot of people went and got a life, but in different pathways they might not have found if it wasn't for the way trek and other visions of the future hadn't made into real directions.
Last edited by nightbird47; 07-09-2017 at 05:45 PM..
I understand why you may be insulted by this quote, but it's not the point of this thread. You should start a new one if you like, and you can debate what you are quoting Shatner as saying, whenever he supposedly said it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nightbird47
Shatner lost a lot of fans from that one, putting down people for admiring your work sufficently to choose to play in its world.
Shatner wouldn't be saying that now.
He said this fictionally, when he hosted SNL in the 1980's. It was in a sketch where he attended a Trek Convention and blurted this out but then retracted it saying, "That was the evil Captain Kirk from the episode "The Enemy Within", so this convention is ahead Warp Factor 9!"
Ridiculous they had to resort to violence over this. I had a debate like this with a friend who is a hard core Star Wars fan, while I enjoy Star Trek more. But it was friendly and fun. He tried to use some Jedi mind trick to convince me, but a quick mind meld got me to convince him instead.
Exactly. Yes, people do feel strongly about their chosen universe, but really just want the other person to get why. I personally love both, but I just can't get to where I see Star Wars universe as something I want to play in.
Though the later star trek movies and books are not about a confident, energetic Federation but one who's won for so long they have started taking it for granted they will. I don't think they have ever lost in the movies or tv, though it was very close with the Dominion, and while they didn't follow up, nobody would ever feel like they were still untouchable after barely surviving the Dominon war. And the follow up, with so much still lost, and the remaining 'empire' vulnerable, is decidedly dark. The Federation does not survive intact in the post Dominion war books when everyone left is jockying for what they can grab.
The revelation about Section 31 was also very unsettling to many fans. But it also makes it realistic. They exist to preserve the Federation, by any means necessary. Just as the '31's in the real world do. Just as something watches from the dark in any governmental establishment so it will go on.
When you make it a competition where only one show can 'win', then is when you start losing your audience. Babylon 5 was far less idealistic, and a different and equally good look at a post space settled human empire. I really enjoyed it. But I did NOT like the really negative commentary which came out of its franchise about Startrek, especially DS9. And its producer's attitude that DS9 had 'stolen' his show didn't play well either. He also expected loyalty in his crew. Billy Mummy was a guest star on one of the best DS9's ever, and for daring to take the part he was fired off B5. So was Claudia? who had disagreed with him publically. It wasn't fun at a con to have 'their' room party make anyone in trek dress feel like they should go. B5 was a very good series, but the small mindedness around it has kept it from going onward. I don't think its even been released in syndication. I've looked for dvd's but what was produced is no longer available. That's too bad because otherwise we could be enjoying the different visions today and not have to put anybody down.
And how much would that cost the student/parent/taxpayer? How does analyzing these things benefit the student?
Actually, it could. It's not the subject, its the method. First, you have to take a look at how each fictional character acted, and what made them uniquie. You need to know the details of that and what made them different. Then you look at the sameness and difference in how they approached their jobs, and can create a clear picture of how they might have together and seperately have dealt with some crisis or each other.
It's two fictional people but its the HOW what matters.
That's the thing with both trek and starwars. They exist with a clear nature and history and even if it's not 'real' you can learn to exercise the brain and its analitical skills and even specuate how they would react to some situation. If it is of more interest than how two unknown people from some history which a student knows nothing about then its especially good a way to teach the HOW of using logic and fact and analysis and other skills which are desirable while making it interesting.
Too often things get zoned out since what its about isn't interesting, but the real intent of the lesson is the hows of learning how to cut a subject down to analize a situation based on what's factually known and observed, not someone's agenda.
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