Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
No, I have never had a parking ticket. If you know it is two hour parking but still go over that amount, sorry, live with the consequences. If you want to take the risk, fine, but live with the consequences.
Again, despite all my driving not only in the US, but all over the world, I have never had a parking ticket, and that includes my numerous trip driving around San Francisco.
And the point is that the consequences are too harsh in some cases, not that it is okay to illegally park. The point is that sometimes people either make a mistake or an intentional decisions because they see no other option, and the punishment (or effect of it) for a certain subset of people should not be permanent loss of the car.
Quote:
Well, if you cannot afford your car, you should not have one. San Francisco has an excellent public trans system, so it is not like a car is needed to get around there. If California's registration fees are so high, perhaps they should lower them? Perhaps people should vote in representatives that will lower them? But seems to me they are satisfied with such fees. Elections have consequences, lol.
Just because someone can't spare a few hundred to thousand+ to recover a towed car does't mean they can't afford to own the car. Often the cars are worth less than the cost to recover them after a few days sitting in the tow lot, hence they are sold to recover the money owed and rid of the car. Someone can own a car outright and just need to pay for occasional maintenance and other normal fees related to owning a car and still get screwed under this scheme.
I don't see how this is so hard to understand. There are so many "well too bad, so sad" attitudes here. It's very telling, people simply don't care about poor people or feel much sympathy for them. It may be true that their life choices have contributed to their situations but schemes like this don't help. They make things worse, like I said they keep poor people down. This is pretty obvious no matter what biases one has against poorer people in society.
I still haven't seen someone articulate how it could possibly be unfair and too easy to lower fines for poor people yet it's fair currently where people who an easily afford it can easily afford it, and then some, and thus see less of an impact when this happens and less of an incentive, likely, to control their behavior to not break the law, when compared to those who currently suffer crippling effects from the same conduct. One who can easily afford getting towed might simply think, if they have no other choice or think they don't, eh whatever, I'll just pay to recover my car if it comes down to it. What's the incentive if they're desperate then?
Not gonna lie, this thought process has gone through my mind. In November in NJ we had a freak bad snow storm dumping about 6 inches and it came at a bad time and towns weren't prepared for it. I got stranded in a city for a few hours, in total gridlock traffic, barely moved for hours, had to leave my car overnight or it would have taken me probably 8+ hours to get home, in bad conditions. I ditched it on the street. Cops actually started telling us to to get rid of the traffic volume. I parked it where I knew spots were, it wasn't in the middle of the street, but I couldn't even see the lines in the street to know if it was in a proper spot. The signs did not allow for overnight parking. I thought, if I get towed, I get towed. Not much I can do about it. I'll just pay to recover the car, I can afford it. Luckily I didn't get towed, I came back to the spot the next morning and my car was there. But others who abandoned their cars in other spots got towed. I know someone who did. We had no reasonable alternatives other than ditching our cars and hoping for the best. And yeah, the city had the nerve to start towing people who were in spots that very next morning, barely even gave some of them time to come back and retrieve their cars. After telling us we can leave them. So yeah, it happens. People can get towed after accidentally parking illegally, or doing it out of necessity in the moment. Life happens. No one is perfect.
No, I have never had a parking ticket. If you know it is two hour parking but still go over that amount, sorry, live with the consequences. If you want to take the risk, fine, but live with the consequences.
Again, despite all my driving not only in the US, but all over the world, I have never had a parking ticket, and that includes my numerous trip driving around San Francisco.
Well, if you cannot afford your car, you should not have one. San Francisco has an excellent public trans system, so it is not like a car is needed to get around there. If California's registration fees are so high, perhaps they should lower them? Perhaps people should vote in representatives that will lower them? But seems to me they are satisfied with such fees. Elections have consequences, lol.
I don’t know why you think that it is ok to allow people’s lives to be thrown into disarray over one act of poor judgment that injured no one and caused no property damage. Perhaps they should pay for their mistake, but not in such a way that the total bill piles up faster than they can possibly save up the money to pay it. Booting or towing a vehicle and piling fees upon fees is not accountability. It is ruinous authoritarian penalization.
“Actions have consequences” does not imply that we as a society should not put a reasonable effort in to keeping fines proprtional to the damage caused by the original act.
As to not having a car, yes, in principle. However, keep in mind that American infrastructure is the result of decades upon decades of pro-automobile policy. Sometimes a trip that would be 20 minutes by car can take 2 hours by bus, involving multiple transfers and significant wait times. If our society were to reasonably attempt to wean off automobile dependence, there would need to be something done about it. Many cities are far less transit friendly than what you are used to.
As to voting, most policies are not up to a referendum, so you are only voting for people and not policy. Sometimes none of the candidates support the policy one wants, and sometimes one candidate does support it but is harmful in other ways. Finally, voting is not a remedy for problems that disproportionally affect immigrants. This is why democratic society needs people to make use of their freedom of speech and other basic liberties. I respect your right to speak your opinion, but I am also exercising my right to openly disagree!
Having a vehicle towed, if you're poor, basically steals your vehicle from you.
It's like, $175 plus to get it out of impound the first day, and the fine escalates very very quickly until the fine is more than the vehicle value, and at that point, the tow yard owns the vehicle.
It's insane. I first learned this reading Hand to Mouth by Linda Tirado. Towing companies who win the government contract can basically steal your car, and if you're in poverty, it's theirs to keep.
One of my son's cars was towed - parked illegally - and although it was irritating to go WAY out of town to redeem it from the tow lot the next day (for about $325) we did it. It was just an irritation.
What about people who can't do that? Now, that private tow company owns their vehicle.
How lucrative is THAT??
Insane. I really would like to see a STOP to his theft.
For those who don't understand this injustice, I highly recommend you read her book.
Don't park illegally, problem solved.
Or do you believe (as it seems many others do) that poverty gives people a pass to do anything they GD well please?
Towing seems like a last resort when simply issuing a fine would work in many of these cases. It all depends on how blatant the violation is, how much danger it's causing, and if the person has already been fined but hasn't taken care of their responsibility.
Car is parked a few minutes too long in a 1 hour parking space? Ticket.
Car is parked in a 1 hour spot all day every day? Tow it.
Car is parked in a dangerous spot where it could cause an accident by blocking someone's view, in a fire lane or blocking a fire hydrant? Tow it.
Car comes up with multiple unpaid parking tickets, and no one has contacted the parking enforcement folks to make a payment arrangement*? Tow it.
*Someone with a low income should have an option to try to get the ticket cost reduced, get it dismissed, or get on a payment plan if it's an expensive fine but the burden should be on them to make the effort to show they have a hardship and that they intend to be responsible and take care of what they received a penalty for. If they don't put forth any effort to make this right, then I have less sympathy when there car gets towed and they end up having to pay quite a bit and deal with a little inconvenience to retrieve it.
Having a vehicle towed, if you're poor, basically steals your vehicle from you.
It's like, $175 plus to get it out of impound the first day, and the fine escalates very very quickly until the fine is more than the vehicle value, and at that point, the tow yard owns the vehicle.
It's insane. I first learned this reading Hand to Mouth by Linda Tirado. Towing companies who win the government contract can basically steal your car, and if you're in poverty, it's theirs to keep.
One of my son's cars was towed - parked illegally - and although it was irritating to go WAY out of town to redeem it from the tow lot the next day (for about $325) we did it. It was just an irritation.
What about people who can't do that? Now, that private tow company owns their vehicle.
How lucrative is THAT??
Insane. I really would like to see a STOP to his theft.
For those who don't understand this injustice, I highly recommend you read her book.
If I am remembering right, you are a liberal.
I'm a conservative.
And I'm in total agreement with you here.
No, that is exactly what the topic is about. Did you read the article? That's precisely what it's about.
My post that 2sleepy responded to, was about how avoiding the tow is 100% under your control. He responded with how towing was an inappropriate consequence. I would expect people to be able to understand how a discussion about how to avoid a consequence, and a discussion about how the consequence is inappropriate, are two different issues. Apparently, I was wrong that level of understanding by some of the participants.
If you shop at walmart, eat fast food, use a house cleaning service, or a landscaping service, then yes, paying the providers of those services below a living wage is subsidizing your lifestyle on the backs of others.
Ah, the “living wage” nonsense. Jobs don’t pay living wages, they pay market wages. Whether one can live on that or not is irrelevant.
For my lifestyle to be subsidized, I would have to have found a way to pay below market price for goods and services, while someone else makes up the difference. That’s not happening, and it’s most certainly not happening because no-skill workers are being paid market wages for their labor.
Status:
"I don't understand. But I don't care, so it works out."
(set 5 days ago)
35,620 posts, read 17,953,728 times
Reputation: 50641
Quote:
Originally Posted by TaxPhd
Ah, the “living wage” nonsense. Jobs don’t pay living wages, they pay market wages. Whether one can live on that or not is irrelevant.
For my lifestyle to be subsidized, I would have to have found a way to pay below market price for goods and services, while someone else makes up the difference. That’s not happening, and it’s most certainly not happening because no-skill workers are being paid market wages for their labor.
That HAS happened. The workers are making up the difference, in the "market price", TaxPhd. You don't get it. The people who are living in poverty, standing all day with few bathroom breaks, ruining their knees, ruining their backs, unable to pay for car repairs, unable to buy safe housing, are carrying you on their backs.
And you don't see it. Frankly, I didn't see it either a couple years ago before I read those two books. I see it now.
I get really cheap sh*t at Walmart because the woman behind the checkout counter is earning not enough to support her family. And her legs and back are aching. And she's worked 40 hours this week.
But hey, who cares? Lookat here, I got a bargain on these 10 American Flags I need for the July 4th party. That were made in China.
What you don't know, Tax "Phd", you don't know. What you don't want to see, you don't see.
That HAS happened. The workers are making up the difference, in the "market price", TaxPhd. You don't get it. The people who are living in poverty, standing all day with few bathroom breaks, ruining their knees, ruining their backs, unable to pay for car repairs, unable to buy safe housing, are carrying you on their backs.
And you don't see it. Frankly, I didn't see it either a couple years ago before I read those two books. I see it now.
I get really cheap sh*t at Walmart because the woman behind the checkout counter is earning not enough to support her family. And her legs and back are aching. And she's worked 40 hours this week.
But hey, who cares? Lookat here, I got a bargain on these 10 American Flags I need for the July 4th party. That were made in China.
What you don't know, Tax "Phd", you don't know. What you don't want to see, you don't see.
I’m sorry that you don’t understand how subsidies, market wages, and market prices work. If you’d like to have a discussion about the economics of the situation, I’d be happy to. If you’re only interested in furthering your SJW talking points, I’ll simply continue to tell you that you’re wrong.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
