Most stable suburbs (Houston, Dallas, Plano: section 8, apartments, HOA)

[pinipig523]

So I know Southlake, Colleyville are great suburbs to be at. But what about north of Dallas?

I've heard that Plano is changing for the worse (on some threads), is there truth in this? How about Allen, Frisco, McKinney?

How do those 4 rank among each other (in terms of school districts, public infrastructure, general affluence of the populace, presence or lack of apartments)?

[crankywithakeyboard]

It's nice to know that my really nice apartment drives potential buyers away from my area.

Really, almost every suburb will eventually change for the worse (in the ways you mention). Inner ring suburbs tend to change quickest. Outer burbs will probably take a lot longer. It may already be happening or you may have five, ten or twenty years until it happens. Just be prepared for it. I guess if you are ultra-wealthy you could insulate yourself from the commoners for a lot longer.

I enjoy Carrollton but then again I am a one of those commoners, we live in an apartment while trying to dispose of our upside down house in Houston, I took a $40,000 pay decrease to change careers, the people are down-to-earth, and we like the diversity of my son's school.

All of the places you mention are nice apparently. Just realize that even they will change demographically.

Originally Posted by pinipig523

So I know Southlake, Colleyville are great suburbs to be at. But what about north of Dallas?

I've heard that Plano is changing for the worse (on some threads), is there truth in this? How about Allen, Frisco, McKinney?

How do those 4 rank among each other (in terms of school districts, public infrastructure, general affluence of the populace, presence or lack of apartments)?

[pinipig523]

That's what I figured... Unless super affluent, no one is immune from the downtrend that plagues every place.

[TurtleCreek80]

Originally Posted by pinipig523

So I know Southlake, Colleyville are great suburbs to be at. But what about north of Dallas?

I've heard that Plano is changing for the worse (on some threads), is there truth in this? How about Allen, Frisco, McKinney?

How do those 4 rank among each other (in terms of school districts, public infrastructure, general affluence of the populace, presence or lack of apartments)?

There are a zillion threads on each of these. Search is your friend.

All of the northern suburbs have apartments and I believe all even have Section 8 housing in this new American spirit of "fairness."

Schools are hard to compare:
Plano performs the best academically when you look at college prep results--> average SATs in the top 5-6 public schools in DFW, % of senior class named National Merit Semi-Finalist ranks in the top 3-5 in DFW, high pass rates on AP exams. However, Plano is a HUGE district with three mega high-schools (1100-1500 students graduate from each senior high every year). It is an "eat or be eaten" cut-throat academic enviroment at the top of each class. The kids in the middle to bottom can easily get lost due to the sheer size.

Frisco is the biggest underperformer. It is an incredibly affluent suburb (very few economic disadvantaged/ limited English kids) and they do a good job passing the state exit exams, but they fail compared to affluent (and less affluent) peers on SAT, AP, National Merit, etc. The high schools rank 20-something to 30-something in DFW for average SAT score. A very small percent get National Merit (about .1-.5% of class compared to 2-3% at Plano ISD or Highland Park HS). Their schools are smaller though, about 500 kids per graduating class.

Allen is a decent district, yet it also has a mega-high school with 5000+ students. SAT & National Merit better than Frisco, but worse than Plano & top tier schools. Again, does well on state exit exams. (woo-hoo.......)

McKinney is probably the most diverse district and performs ok considering it's higher rate of economic diversity and overall diversity.

Allen is probably the most consistently affluent/ least diverse of the 4, yet the wealthiest neighborhoods in Collin County are in West Plano. Plano has the most economic diversity. In East Plano a house can cost $120k while one 8 miles away in West Plano can cost $3-5M. McKinney's roots go way back to the 1800's so there is a historic downtown with surrounding Victorian and Craftsman homes and then it's McMansion city as you move west towards Frisco. Frisco is affluent but is more consistent - lots of $300-500k homes and not the wild Plano swings from $120k to $5M.

Frisco has the busiest mall (Stonebriar Center) & surrounding commercial area, especially if you love chain restaurants. Everyone you can think up is in & around the mall.

Allen has a brand new oudoor mall/shopping center (Shops @ Fairview) and an older outlet mall across the highway.

McKinney has the least retail as it's either smaller mom & pop stores or a strip center with Wal-Mart, Target, etc off 121. People in McKinney shop in Frisco or Allen.

Plano has diverse retail, from immigrant owned Indian & Chinese restaurants to expensive date night steak houses at Shops @ Legacy. It has $1 stores and Asian marts and also a beautiful fairly new Neiman Marcus in a higher-end mall, Shops @ Willowbend. Plano is also closest to Dallas. One can leave West Plano and be at Barneys/ Nordstorm/ flagship Neiman's @ NorthPark Mall in Dallas in 15-20 minutes on a Saturday.

A plethora of fairly new highways connect all four - all but 75 are tollroads.

[EDS_]

OP,

If I were to move back to a 'burb it'd be West Plano again. Although many neighborhoods in Central Plano and East Plano are great too.

1. Generally offers an easy cruise to the big airports
2. Simpler drive into Dallas than from Frisco, Allen, McKinney
3. Better schools with significant private school opps if that is an issue for you
4. Movie theaters, shopping, bars, all right there
5. Easy access to Lake Lewisville
6. Closer to many employment centers
7. Plano is sort of the center of mass of kid club sports around here if that matters to you
8. Lots of grocery stores and gas stations
9. Very reasonable and approachable city gov.
10. Excellent roads and sensible speed limits

Best of luck!

[Cowboys fan in Houston]

I live in North Plano and love it. No place in DFW Id rather live.

[MckinneyOwnr]

Great post TC80. I think you've pretty much nailed it.

I'd also like to add my own experiences growing up in Plano... There was a time when all the houses on my parents street had nicely cut lawns, well manicured landscaping, and if something needed fixing, it got fixed! No eyesore houses whatsoever. Fast forward 15-20 years though, and while my parents neighborhood is still very nice overall, it also isn't hard to spot homeowners that have moved in within the last decade, and apparently don't have any pride of ownership. Some of them let their yards and landscaping grow wild, don't paint their houses, don't keep up with maintenance, etc.

To me, it looks really bad, as I remember how the block used to look. So, because of what's happened, I'd recommend finding a place that has an HOA, as there are large parts of Plano that are not part of one. My parents HOA is voluntary and they have no power to coerce homeowners to do anything, and that is why some of these deadbeat people have been able to let their homes slide, to the detriment of the rest of the neighborhood.

In McKinney, where I live, you'll get a notice if you skip a week or two of not mowing the lawn. While that may seem invasive (and frankly, I always used to hate HOA's) it does keep the neighborhood looking nice, and forces people to maintain their property.

[CREW747]

Frisco is less diverse and more affluent than Allen ( look up the numbers ). Some of the most stable suburbs in my opinion ......

- Southlake
- Colleyville
- Highland Village
- Flower Mound
- Prosper
- Bartonville,Cooper Canyon,Double Oak

[padcrasher]

The consistent factor in all these "stable" areas is having a small school district with one or two highschools. That is the key.

[GreyDay]

5000 kids? I guess things are bigger in Texas.

I have newfound respect for those mega districts and the logistics involved turning out educated kids.