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Undergraduate isn't what killed me with loans b/c I had tons of scholarships for undergrad. I graduated with very few loans. The bulk of my 100K plus debt is all grad school and no, you can't say that graduating with a law degree from a top 5 school means that you will be able to pay them off. I made 6 figures the first year out of law school and then 9/11 happened and the tech bust happened and I was laid off. Market was flooded with laid off lawyers who had a lot more than one year of experience. Only place that I could get hired (over 19 months of looking) was a crappy firm that only paid me 40K. The legal market is so bad now, 10 years later, that recent law graduates that haven't been able to get a job out of law school are actually suing the law schools.
Wow. Most of my friends in law are on the east coast, different situations, but I have heard horror stories of Georgetown grads doing hourly legal work. Best of luck with things.
WOW - did I miss something or did someone really think U-MD stood for U of Michigan?
No, the earlier posters on here interpreted the reference correctly.
Both U of Maryland and U of Michigan were cited, and both were referenced as "crappy state undergrads". IMO, that shows the ridiculous bias of the poster. Per US News, Michigan ranks 4th among public schools, behind Berkeley, UCLA, and Virginia. Maryland isn't as well-regarded, but still hardly "crappy". It's tied for 17th, only one notch below UT and Illinois.
Then again, he has repeatedly asserted that Plano ISD is a "mediocre public school". As a graduate of an actual mediocre public school, I can confidently state that Plano bears little resemblance to such a beast.
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Could someone explain why going to an average HS school and being in the top 10% (which automatically gets me into Texas - correct?), then going to the East Coast for graduate work wouldn't be a good idea.
Sure. The argument goes like this:
If you go to a crappy HS, you don't develop good study habits and have a poor base of knowledge. You will then flunk out of UT. Happens all the time to the "Top 10%ers" from rinky-dink rural TX counties.
Even if you stay afloat, your performance will be weak, relative to those from better HS programs, and you have little hope of gaining admission to a high-profile graduate program.
Even if you go to UT and do well, you'll be disadvantaged in graduate admissions relative to those who attended more rigorous undergrad programs.
For an extreme example - Harvard Med preferentially selects from "its own kind" of undergrad students. In turn, those Ivy and Ivy-style undergrads preferentially select from private high schools and (secondarily) from high-performing public high schools. You could easily, at age 14, be closing doors years down the line by attending a crummy high school.
I'm not claiming this is true or not true - just offering up the argument.
Wow. Most of my friends in law are on the east coast, different situations, but I have heard horror stories of Georgetown grads doing hourly legal work. Best of luck with things.
Yup, East Coast is where I moved from. Northeast to be exact. I've actually heard much worse over the last several years. Many top notch lawyers having to do paralegal work to pay the bills. I ended up starting my own business online and using my other skills as backup.
Yup, East Coast is where I moved from. Northeast to be exact. I've actually heard much worse over the last several years. Many top notch lawyers having to do paralegal work to pay the bills. I ended up starting my own business online and using my other skills as backup.
Still nothing compares to strolling down Walnut and 18th, Rittenhouse in Philly, BackBay in Boston (or Harvard ond Beacon) or M-street and Wisconsin in D.C. But I wouldn't want to be caught up in the rat race there.
I'm sure you've quickly recognized that people are very passionate about their neighborhoods and the topic of schools. It is undisputed that HPISD is an excellent school district. If you do not mind renting then it is an area to consider. That said, it is not the only neighborhood where your children can receive an excellent education. Many of the negative perceptions of Lakewood-area-public schools are based upon rumor and "test scores/numbers/percentages." Because of the socioeconomic diversity of East Dallas (which will not change), the schools' "quality of education" receives unfair criticism. I am a mother-of-three children in Lakewood neighborhood schools and I will put their educations up against any other for children their ages (my 8th grade daughter was actually ahead academically when she attended a local private school in 6th grade after graduating Lakewood elementary). JL Long Middle School and Woodrow Wilson HS students consistently achieve city-wide/regional/state recognition in sports, academic teams, music, dance and ROTC. There are plenty of activities for students who choose to participate and countless number of WWHS graduates attend top universities throughout the US (remember that the "best" university is the one that is the right fit for your child). Roots are generations deep in Lakewood and people do not leave--I also have a good number of friends who grew up in Park Cities who are raising their children in Lakewood.
There is a deep commitment to community and service and there is a lovely lake within walking/cycling/running distance from any-given home. Additionally, it is safe to walk/run/cycle daytime or evening and children have a fair amount of freedom to play outside and walk/bike to friends' homes and school. For the adults, there is quaint shopping, dining and live entertainment in the heart of the neighborhood. The homes are nestled on large lots with an abundance of giant trees. They are smaller than in the burbs, but the quality of life is wonderful and old fashioned with a short commute to downtown. We've lived in Lakewood for 9 years and our home unfailingly continues to appreciate and will continue to do so.
Lakewood bottom line? Purchasing a home within your price range is feasible, and your children will enjoy receiving a super, public school education while nurturing life-long friendships formed in Kindergarten. The Lakewood schools are shining stars in DISD.
P.S. Most children here attend some degree of preschool program but do not need a full-time, 5-day program to be kindergarten ready as some parents and facilities will lead you to believe--children do not require a resume before they graduate college.
Yup, East Coast is where I moved from. Northeast to be exact. I've actually heard much worse over the last several years. Many top notch lawyers having to do paralegal work to pay the bills. I ended up starting my own business online and using my other skills as backup.
I never EVER wanted to follow the "traditional" favored law route, which is roughly: get into "T14 school", work nonstop in hypercompetitive fashion to get in the top 10% and on Law Review, then try to land a job with Ginormous & Overwhelming, work a zillion billable hours/week as an associate for ~7 years to try and beat out the 25+ other hotshot "top10% from T14" associates doing the same thing for one of 3 or 4 partner slots, where....you'll then continue to work 60-80 hour weeks and have to act as a salesman to bring in as much revenue as you can, because in today's world where "profit per equity partner" is broadcast all over the intermaweb and every firm is engaged in a virtual d!ck-waving contest regarding that metric, so if you're unfortunate enough to be in an area of law that experiences a downturn (regardless of your amazing legal skills and charming personality) you won't be immune from being cut. Large firms have grown over the past 20 years to become even larger, many mid-sized firms met their fate in the 80's and 90's as that consolidation was occurring, and even now large firms go under with greater regularity than many feel comfortable with. Law firms: A less gilded future | The Economist
Even if you "succeed", it simply means you now have a life completely encompassed by your job, until after age 65 (when "mandatory retirement" stops you from working) you become another one of those forlorn figures who still comes into the firm and is given an "office" where you can mark time reading the paper or doing whatever, because it's the only existence you've ever known and have no idea what else to do. Sure, the pay is attractive, but even then many of the partners look longingly at the compensation earned by hedge fund managers and investment bankers and jealously think "why can't I be pulling down THAT level of bank?"
As for me...somehow, against all odds I found an attractive woman who adores me (for who I am, not for my wallet; heck, when we started dating I couldn't afford a car AT ALL, much less some fancy one) and even more amazingly convinced her to marry me, and now we have a kid who actually likes being around me (at least for a few more years, anyway). Through a little skill and a whole lot of luck, I've found myself in a place where I work 40 hours a week, have a bunch of vacation THAT I CAN ACTUALLY USE, and still do interesting work. Yeah, I'll likely never earn seven figures in any year, but we're not exactly eating dog food and living in a cardboard box.
And although I do have to use my limited intelligence to help wealthy clients with various legal stuff, every night I also use it to (among other things) bring to life a smallish stuffed snowman whose "personality" lights a gleam in my daughter's eyes that's worth far more than any Fifth Avenue penthouse overlooking Central Park.
The most successful people usually aren't the ones who drive the hardest along the well-traveled roads, but are those who can wander and explore and discover things and places others haven't seen, and THEN can use their knowledge and abilities to connect THOSE places with everyone else and suddenly open up whole new vistas to everyone. Yes, that takes knowledge and education and intelligence and often hard work, but "the road less traveled" by definition has fewer competitors along the way and often is more fulfilling.
As to how this ties in with this thread....I think great education and striving to excel and pushing a child to succeed is generally good, but there is a point at which it can become COUNTER-productive. HPISD is a great, great district, no doubt about it, but if you're focused on the best education for your kid, then the best thing to do is find a good to great area that is the best fit for YOUR kid and then working with them along the way. But I always think that kids need to the opportunity to be kids, and if you teach them how to think and give them the tools to make their own decisions as they mature, they'll likely turn out pretty well as adults.
Sorry, rambling, but a few things raised in this thread (obviously) are items I've thought about often.
Bravo! Awesome thread. I agree and feel a bit ashamed I thought of doing this . As for me, we are buying a , gasp, east plano or east Allen home for 250k, outright and gonna pretty much live on vacation and educate the kiddos in that way. Thanks city data for your insights .
Steve Brown, a business columnist from the Dallas Morning News reports in today's paper:
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The differences in prices by neighborhood are also dramatic. Median home-sales prices in the Park Cities (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/Park_Cities%2C_Texas - broken link) jumped 25 percent in January from a year ago, according to the Realtors’ multiple listing service data. Prices were up 12 percent in North Dallas (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/North_Dallas - broken link) and 10 percent in Frisco (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/Frisco%2C_Texas - broken link). But median sales prices fell 42 percent in The Colony, 14 percent in DeSoto (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/DeSoto%2C_Texas - broken link) and 12 percent in Garland (http://topics.dallasnews.com/topic/Garland%2C_Texas - broken link). Those neighborhoods have had higher home foreclosure rates and see more moderate-income buyers who now have a tough time getting mortgages. So what does all this mean? Expect a price spike this year in some affluent neighborhoods where the inventories of homes for sale are now at the lowest point in years.
We are going through the same thing right now. We have two children, one preK and one K in private school. The tuition and after school care is already the equivalent of making another mortgage payment so we have opted not to send them back next year. We did a lot of research on our assigned school and have determined it to be out of the question for us. Not any of the exemplary schools are accepting transfers because of over crowding and we are on the waiting list at Dealy Montessori, but it doesn't look good. So now we have no idea where we are going to send our kids to school in the fall. We LOVE east Dallas and our east Dallas home, but we are trying to decide if we should sell and then rent in a better district. The problem is where? As a 20+ year east Dallas resident, going to the burbs makes me cringe. I know, you do whatever you need for your kids, and I will. But we have driven countless hours around Coppell, Southlake, Highland Village, Colleyville and have found these areas to be devoid of the same charactor and charm we love about east Dallas. We considered Highland Park/Park Cities, but there is one major drawback from me. I was raised in a similar bubble. My family was the "have nots" in the bubble of "haves" and school life was very difficult. Elementary was okay, but middle school and high school was awful. The kids were spoiled little snots that took great pride in banding together to make the kids from the less weathly homes feel shunned. I don't want to subject my kids to that! I want my kids to get a great education and I want them to be safe and happy. Am I just missing something about the burbs that I would actually really like or see as a great benefit or should I stay on my home turf and try to move closer to an exemplary school?
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Lakewood Rah!
