Greenhill vs Hockaday (Paris, Bishop, Howe: private schools, shop, swimming)

[TX75007]

There's a website that compiles all this information for lazy people like myself. Hockaday has 44.6% at what they define as "top schools" and St. Marks has 52.3%. By comparison, Brearley (top all girls in NYC) has 73.5%, Chapin (another all girls in NYC) has 68.9% and Collegiate (all boys in NYC) has 66.5%. Because the owner of the site is focused mostly on NYC, the list of schools that are not in NYC is not very comprehensive. Greenhill is not on there for example and no one is interested enough to ask him to put it on there.

The top boarding schools are in the mid 50s to low 60s.

Take from that what you will.

Ahh. The Boarding Schools. The TX NMSF cutoffs are just 2-4 points under the East Coast Boarding cutoffs which are the highest in the nation.

Some of this college acceptance is skewed by the "local school" effect. A lot of parents went to UT or A&M and so their children will as well. The same goes for the East Coast where the Ivies are the "local school." The other is the cost of the Ivies vs a state schools and how people make cost-value judgements. I know I chose that route.

In addition, parents in NYC are far more competitive about this kind of stuff. My NYC friends reflexively say "go to the best school you can" even though it may be a poor fit for the child no matter how smart they are. Your post reflects that attitude. Others may interpret that as snobbery. I don't think it is.

At the end of the day one has to ask what is education? The geniuses of the 20th century did not come from the boarding school/Ivy axis. In fact they came about mostly by their own devices not some pre-decided path. If someone is spoon-fed, then that is all they will be able to eat or eat with. No matter the quality of the spoon.

[Vacation101]

Originally Posted by LMKH

My daughter applied at Greenhill. I am sure she would have gotten in as she had straight A's elsewhere and her ISEE scores were 9, 9, 8, and 7. However, then she shadowed a student. She saw so much bullying going on that even after having paid the application fee and doing all the work, we pulled her application before we even got an admission decision. Maybe she would not have been admitted. Who knows. But the point is, she did NOT want to go there once she shadowed and saw how the kids treated each other on campus. The bullying was worse than she ever saw in the public schools. We moved on. It was too bad too. We picked Greenhill for what seemed like excellent academics. My daughter needed a program where she could take advanced math and sciences, beyond what the other schools tend to offer. Oh, I forgot about the extensive discussions of a drug party where Greenhill students had partied with Parish Episcopal students over the weekend and some kids were arrested. The students seemed rather thrilled and excited about the whole thing. They seemed quite accustomed to the idea of doing drugs on the weekends and being at parties like that.

Interesting. Was she applying to high school? Where did your daughter end up going? What private schools did she think did not have these kinds of issues?

You're going to find drugs at every single private school in the country. That's pretty much unavoidable.

What kind of bullying did she witness? Is Greenhill worse than the others in terms of a culture of bullying???

[TurtleCreek80]

Originally Posted by Vacation101

You're going to find drugs at every single private school in the country. That's pretty much unavoidable.

Correction: you're going to find drugs at EVERY SINGLE SCHOOL in the country. A kid who wants to try drugs will have no problem finding them, whether it's a private, public, religious, magnet, international, etc. Plus, there are drugs for every budget so it's just not a "rich private school kids" problem.

Not to scare any parent, it's just a fact every parent needs to know to help raise good kids and help prepare them for situations that may occur at any high school.

[Considering Coming Back]

Originally Posted by TurtleCreek80

Correction: you're going to find drugs at EVERY SINGLE SCHOOL in the country. A kid who wants to try drugs will have no problem finding them, whether it's a private, public, religious, magnet, international, etc. Plus, there are drugs for every budget so it's just not a "rich private school kids" problem.

Not to scare any parent, it's just a fact every parent needs to know to help raise good kids and help prepare them for situations that may occur at any high school.

My findings, a dozen years post high school, are that the kids who went to the name-brand schools, Sidwell, Dalton, Hockaday, etc, were able to do drugs and function at a very high level (they still do). Prescription drugs and cocaine mostly. The kids *I* went to high school with, a lowly middle class public school, smoked pot and did ecstasy and became utter failures.

So I learned early on that drugs = terrible life. But a student at an elite school probably learned that drugs = fun break from stress.

[nakold23]

Originally Posted by LMKH

My daughter applied at Greenhill. I am sure she would have gotten in as she had straight A's elsewhere and her ISEE scores were 9, 9, 8, and 7. However, then she shadowed a student. She saw so much bullying going on that even after having paid the application fee and doing all the work, we pulled her application before we even got an admission decision. Maybe she would not have been admitted. Who knows. But the point is, she did NOT want to go there once she shadowed and saw how the kids treated each other on campus. The bullying was worse than she ever saw in the public schools. We moved on. It was too bad too. We picked Greenhill for what seemed like excellent academics. My daughter needed a program where she could take advanced math and sciences, beyond what the other schools tend to offer. Oh, I forgot about the extensive discussions of a drug party where Greenhill students had partied with Parish Episcopal students over the weekend and some kids were arrested. The students seemed rather thrilled and excited about the whole thing. They seemed quite accustomed to the idea of doing drugs on the weekends and being at parties like that.

This is absolutely ridiculous. Having teenagers who have gone through Greenhill, this has never been their experience. Of course there will be some drugs. As stated above, they are at EVERY school. St. Marks, Hockaday, and Greenhill are absolutely no exception. But to paint the school in such a negative light where this is not the reality at all is pretty disappointing, especially if people take this post as the truth. My children weren't social recluses, they went out to parties and what not. I am not ignorant of the party scene of private school children at all, but nothing they have been to has been out of control or dangerous. They are very open about these things with us.

And I am still very confused about the bullying arguments. Both my wife and I have served on the board so we are aware of major events that occur. Yes, there are scattered incidents (including an often cited one in the middle school a few years ago that the administration handled very nicely), but overall the children I have known and watched grow up are extremely respectable, friendly, and are going off to great colleges. Bullying is much like drugs, it will exist in moderation everywhere, but it is in no way worse than St. Marks or Hockaday, where many of our closest family friend's children attend (and love!). There is one class (current Freshman) that have had their share of issues, but otherwise the children we have encountered have been nothing but a pleasure to get to know.

[TurtleCreek80]

Originally Posted by LMKH

My daughter applied at Greenhill. I am sure she would have gotten in as she had straight A's elsewhere and her ISEE scores were 9, 9, 8, and 7. However, then she shadowed a student. She saw so much bullying going on that even after having paid the application fee and doing all the work, we pulled her application before we even got an admission decision. Maybe she would not have been admitted. Who knows. But the point is, she did NOT want to go there once she shadowed and saw how the kids treated each other on campus. The bullying was worse than she ever saw in the public schools. We moved on. It was too bad too. We picked Greenhill for what seemed like excellent academics. My daughter needed a program where she could take advanced math and sciences, beyond what the other schools tend to offer. Oh, I forgot about the extensive discussions of a drug party where Greenhill students had partied with Parish Episcopal students over the weekend and some kids were arrested. The students seemed rather thrilled and excited about the whole thing. They seemed quite accustomed to the idea of doing drugs on the weekends and being at parties like that.

I'm wondering which school your child ended up at and if it has lived up to bullying-free and drug-free expectations......

[GreyDay]

I went to a school in the midwest that had drugs, bullying and...dancing.

[synchronicity]

Originally Posted by GreyDay

I went to a school in the midwest that had drugs, bullying and...dancing.

All at the same time?

[carroll4628]

As a parent, I think it would be prudent to talk to the admissions officer at the school. Not to "report anyone" or anything like that, but to simply inform them that the student they have hosting other students may not be the best representative for their campus and that they need to find students who are more likely to boast about 'how we are different/better than the public schools' instead of 'hey look...we can party as hard as the public school kids". As a parent at that school, I would want to know that the administration is putting their "best foot forward" when selecting 'hosts or hostesses' for prospective students. Just a thought.

[Mom2017]

My 8th grade daughter is interested in applying to either Hockaday or Greenhill. Does anyone know what ISEE scores (Stanines or Percentile) my daughter needs to get into any of the two schools? The ISEE thing is totally new to me. I like to get some ideas for what scores are considered good or bad for an 8th grader.

Thank you in advance!