Houses and salaries (sales, mortgage, credit)

[frenzyrider]

Originally Posted by synchronicity

Er, per the US Census: American FactFinder - Results * (sadly, I can't link directly to each city and table, you'll have to enter the names yourself and then go to the appropriate tables) looking at females with children under 6 years of age, in Frisco 61.9% of those families had "all parents in family in the labor force" compared to 'only' 55.7% in Southlake. Of females with children ages 6 to 17 years, the numbers are 70% for Frisco compared to 55.9% for Southlake. 65.3% of Frisco females age 16 and over are employed compared to 51.5% in Southlake. I suspect that at least part of that difference is attributable to the far greater affluence of Southlake (median household income of $183,441 compared to $105,647 in Frisco) allowing more families to choose to have one parent not work, but if you want to attribute those differences to, in your words, "the general mindset that men of the house only work" then knock yourself out. I'm sure you wouldn't mind somebody using the derogatory "Frisclosure" name for your burb and making uncharitable comments about people living beyond their means, and then say "just look at the foreclosure data", right?

Why use passive aggresive tone in calling it "Frisclosure" and other derogratory comments? "females" with children under 6 is not present in the table. It states "females 16 years and above" in "labor force" that is not related to "all parents in family in labor force." In short, I do not see anywhere "females in families in labor force" Further it does not differentiate between full-time and part-time work.
Look we can disect this dataset all day long but the fact of the matter is just like you "jumped" on letting it clearly know what you think about "Frisco" is pretty much how people can have impressions about your little corner.

[mos]Off topic; argumentative; orphaned[/mod]

[Vadha1]

I recommend just doing a google search for "Mortgage Calculators" their are plenty of free mortgage calculators online that allow you to plug in the information (down payment, home cost, taxes etc.) and will show you what your cost will be for home ownership.

[frenzyrider]

Originally Posted by synchronicity

No, you don't get it. I have nothing against Frisco, other than the general thing I "have" against almost all of DFW, which is the predominance of new development with scads of chains and as much house as possible crammed on as little lot as possible. I guess Frisco is a bit more notorious for having "zero-lot-line" homes than some other burbs, but it's a malady that afflicts all of DFW as well as newer developed areas in other cities.

However, you're the first person I've heard talk up some dominant male patriarchy that looks down on working women in Southlake. Of all the criticisms I've heard of the burb, that's the one makes me go "What?!?!?!"

My point is that one can run down any suburb if they so choose on a variety of issues, but a general attitude of looking down on working women in Southlake? That's a new one and can't say I've heard ANYONE else roll that out, much less cite it as a reason not to live there.

Got it! We don't like zero lot line homes either and thankfully, Frisco is providing some good options now. As far as the male patriarchy comment, it stemmed from 3 different people living in SL telling me on the same day at work. It is very possible they were not the right peeps to hang out with

[synchronicity]

Originally Posted by frenzyrider

Got it! We don't like zero lot line homes either and thankfully, Frisco is providing some good options now. As far as the male patriarchy comment, it stemmed from 3 different people living in SL telling me on the same day at work. It is very possible they were not the right peeps to hang out with

Whoa! Yeah, get yourself some new co-workers!

All I can tell you is that my wife works, that our neighbor's wife is the primary breadwinner in their household, down the street there is a woman who is a SAHM to kids and husband travels a lot, and I don't know about most of the other homes yet because we're just getting to know people. At a block party we attended shortly after moving in it sounded like most of the women worked (it was a kid-themed thing so these were all "moms") but I wasn't doing a survey or anything. There certainly wasn't a vibe of "oh, your wife works, oh dear" or anything like that.

Again, I may be living a sheltered existence, or my corner of the 'burb may be atypical.

As an aside on schools, I heard while commuting this AM that the whole "exemplary/recognized/acceptable/unacceptable" categorization system is being replaced by "making progress/not making progress". Note that this was caught in passing on the radio while driving on 635, so there's lots more detail that was missed.

[synchronicity]

Moderator cut: Off topic; argumentative

Back on topic - the "no more than 3x income" rule for mortgages is a decent no-thought rule of thumb to guesstimate "how much should we be earning" to afford a home (again, that's really rough, but it's a starting point). Also as an FYI - again per the Census "American Community Survey" from 2011, of the ~1.4 million "owner occupied housing units" in the Metroplex, only 4.7% of them (just over 67K) cost 500K or more. An additional 136K (9.7%) cost between 300K and 500K. So at a guess, we're talking 8% to 9% of all homes/condos in DFW costing 400K or more.

[happycrow]

I know this is going to be an official real-estate heresy, but I far prefer "no more than 3x the *lowest* income."

Living within your means isn't very popular, but I'd rather have a house paid off in seven or eight years than pay a bank 30 years of interest and hope nothing happens to either of us or our jobs during that timespan. (Got a friend whose hubby croaked unexpectedly on Monday...they bought the house in November. She's now in a world of hurt on *two* counts.)

[synchronicity]

Originally Posted by happycrow

I know this is going to be an official real-estate heresy, but I far prefer "no more than 3x the *lowest* income."

Living within your means isn't very popular, but I'd rather have a house paid off in seven or eight years than pay a bank 30 years of interest and hope nothing happens to either of us or our jobs during that timespan. (Got a friend whose hubby croaked unexpectedly on Monday...they bought the house in November. She's now in a world of hurt on *two* counts.)

It's a great rule if you can do it, but it obviously depends on the family situation and how people prioritize. If you've got a family that earns 120K but that's split 90K-30K...well, it might be tough. If they have 40K available for a down payment you're talking a 130K house. That's doable in DFW in a decent area but is a huge difference from, say, a 400K house (or even a 250K house). Although stretching to afford a house is risky (and can be taken way too far, just see last decade for examples of that), one could also be more conservative than they need to.

If you do have a big income differential, then the more risk mitigation, the better. An obvious item would be life insurance on the primary earner, but various ways of hedging one's bets (maybe staying within 2x total income even if it's more than 3x the lowest for a mortgage) should be considered.

Everybody's different (duh, I know). Some people buy less house and spend less overall so they can retire early. Some people are very debt-averse, others are willing to live with low interest rate debt but are still aggressive savers and investors. Some people don't spend much in other areas but do spend relatively more on a house because that's where they get the most value for themselves.

[frenzyrider]

Originally Posted by synchronicity

If you do have a big income differential, then the more risk mitigation, the better. An obvious item would be life insurance on the primary earner, but various ways of hedging one's bets (maybe staying within 2x total income even if it's more than 3x the lowest for a mortgage) should be considered.

I don't want to digress the discussion but I am little confused on this. There are three types - term life, whole life, and another one that is a hybrid. Do you know of any legit sources that discuss these unbiased from influence of any of the companies?

[gymrat]

Originally Posted by Big G

In, say, the $200K range, most homeowners are 80-90% financed. In the $500K+ range, and certainly the $1M+ or HP range, not so much. There are some that are "all hat and no cattle", but there are a lot more with substantial equity at purchase, or even flat-out cash buyers.

So the question isn't "How can they afford the payments on a $400K mortgage?", but "How did they come up with $200K for equity, so that they only need a $200K mortgage for a $400K house?" That question has a lot of different answers - equity from their earlier residences, living below their means in younger years, family inheritance, scoring big with employee stock options, etc.

When we first bought this house 11 years ago we were amazed at how many younger families were in the neighborhood. Houses ranged $375k-low/mid 500's. We were mid 30's and thought it was a "big step" for us. It was nice to put down a nice big chunk of money we had been saving to go into this house #3.. Kept the previous house as a rental. Most of the neighbors all have SAHM's. Only 2 women on my block work outside of the house. We had lived way, way below our means for years and only 1 income. Of course buying this house we both were freaked over spending that much on a house. Sad thing is by going by the 3x's salary we could have and were approved for much more. We just did not want to do that. Didn't do that with house #1 and no plans for this one either to go that far as we knew college would be coming down that road fast. First one goes this fall. Nice thing is, this house will be paid off before they both finish college

Originally Posted by stan4

TRUTH!
Just got a $13000 estimate to fix HVAC system...hidden gems around every turn!
Buy less house so something like that doesn't turn stressful!!!!

TELL ME ABOUT IT!
Got the exterior repainted last spring.
New wood floors last spring as well in the downstairs areas that had been carpet.
Need new carpet upstairs in the next year or so.
The backyard is a mess right now. Landscaping matures and fades. Took out 3 trees last week that 2 were dying and were past their prime. One came out due to being in the way for the new and improved patio and outdoor kitchen. A year ago the landscape looked good. Some things just don't last and start to look really, well, just icky.
Hot water heaters replaced 2 years ago.
New garage door opener for one overhead door a few months ago.
The list goes on and on. The more house the more that can need repairing or replacing.
Oh, and some of the interior rooms need some new paint.
It is always non stop. But we enjoy it and that is what matters, it is home. Home for our family

[ritholtz]

Nice discussion. Is that 3x ratio based on loan amount or purchase price. My loan amount itself is 3.5 times of my gross. I guess, I went over this safe limit and bought more home than I can safely afford. Is that something I need to be concerned with. It is all comes down to job situation for every one. Without any income, this ratio becomes infinity. Hopefully, economy continues to improve. We also need to improve our skill set.

Any idea on typical income tax savings for home owners? My apartment rent will cover 50% of my home expense. There is no tax savings with apartment rent. How much one can save in taxes with homestead exemptions? Are we going to get this exemption every year. What are the benefits each home owner get by paying 0.21% tax to Parkland Hospital.