Lakewood vs. LH (White Rock Elementary)? (Dallas, Bryan: real estate market, credit, broker)

[Houstondad]

My wife and I are moving to Dallas and are looking to purchase a home in either Lakewood (feeding to Lakewood Elementary) or Lake Highlands (feeding to White Rock Elementary). We've visited both schools and were impressed by both but frankly have heard positives and negatives on both areas and schools from a limited number of friends we have that are familiar with the areas. Our priorities our elementary schools (although the JH and HS, if good, are a positive from long term/home value perspective), neighborhood/community/parent involvement, value (relative to historical peaks/lows) and commute to downtown Dallas. If anyone has been through this process or has an opinion, specifically plus/minus of each my wife and I would greatly appreciate any feedback.

[jennifw]

How old is your child? If you are planning to purchase a home, I would look at the big picture down the road, including JH and HS, as you make your decision. Maybe you are planning private for those years, but you never know, right?

You will find a lot of threads here about Lakewood. The community is GREAT and the elementary is one of the best in the city. Once you get to MS, things change. Lots of opinions on that on the multiple threads on this board. I think from a community standpoint, Lakewood is hard to beat. Homes here hold their value.

I am not as familiar with White Rock Elem but I am guessing there are some threads here, too.

Good luck!

[Lakewooder]

Lakewood Elementary is so popular that there is a group raising private money to fund an addition. Really though it starts at birth with the LECPTA. You may have heard of their annual home tour (which raises around $150,000 each year for Lakewood, Long and Woodrow), but it's much more than that. Kids form lifelong friendships through this and so do their parents.

The secondary schools in Lakewood offer International Baccalaureate. J. L. Long is in the final steps of accreditation for IB MYP, which takes two-three years, but has implemented the curriculum over the last two years after it was approved as a candidate. This year it is operating essentially as an IB school. Woodrow has been certified since March 2011 and its first IB Diploma (24 hours of college credit) students will graduate next year. It is also one of only 20 or so schools in the nation offering IBCC. Fear not, if you don't want to be in IB there are three other college prep academies and 22 AP and 8 Dual Credit courses. A possible fifth college prep academy is being discussed, because enrollment has jumped by 200-250 since the school redesign roll-out started almost three years ago. Long has $6 million in renovations and Woodrow $14 million along with a new 40,000 square foot Science and Arts building. The ribbon-cutting and open house is at noon on Saturday, March 23 if you want to check it out.

Lakewood would be your best bet for home appreciation in my opinion (I know I have my money on it, and I'm a real estate broker and investor) and of course the best commute to downtown.

[Houstondad]

Thanks Jennifw and Lakewooder that's really helpful. I'm a conservative investor so really focused on buying an area that, although property appreciation would be nice, I'm not going to lose money by buying in at all time highs/bubble markets. A top-notch public education is enough appreciation for me assuming my house holds it's value.

- Lakewooder, any idea what % of Lakewood students are actually pushing through Long/Wilson vs. moving or private schools? Also, any thoughts on where the Lakewood market is vs. the last 5 years or so; bottom, all time high, somewhere in the middle?

[Lakewooder]

For 2010 the figure was 73% going from Lakewood to J. L. Long (compiled by a parent who is a St. Mark's grad, BTW). A parent posted on a thread here at City-Data in 2012 that it was 85%. I think I know who this parent is and she would be in a position to know. Enrollment has grown by around 200 I believe (more familiar with Woodrow enrollment growth). There are 33 new teachers at Long this year, and they are all IB-trained.

The Lakewood Real Estate market kept going up while other markets went down. It did take a breather in the last year or so but seems to be over the peak now. I have been getting solicitations and I was recently shocked to get one from a builder on a house I own in the original Lakewood Country Club Estates Conservation District (teardowns can be done, but the new house must follow restrictions set to mimic the look of the original homes). The last two places I rented had increases of $200 and $400 per month (or about 25 and 30% increases).

[HockDad]

Both of the elementary schools are highly regarded. People pay a premium for both (Lakewooder will tell you about Lakewood and plenty of people swear by White Rock). Personally, I would look at the two high schools and junior high schools. I think that both of the high schools are good, but not great. Personally, I would prefer to be in RISD instead of DISD, but I have never run the numbers to compare the schools. I am sure that Lakewooder can give more insight- I am sure that the comparison is common.

[lakehighlands]

Originally Posted by Lakewooder

The Lakewood Real Estate market kept going up while other markets went down. It did take a breather in the last year or so but seems to be over the peak now.

From Dec 2011 to Dec 2012, home prices increased approximately 2.9% in the Lakewood market-boundaries of Mockingbird to the north, Abrams to the west, White Rock Lake to the east, and Gaston to the south. From Dec 2011 to Dev 2012, home prices increased approximately 9.4% in the White Rock North market-boundaries of Walnut Hill to the north, Goforth to the west, Lawther/Shoreview to the south, and Audelia to the east. Average DOM for both markets of 88.

[Krate]

WRE and Lakewood Elementary are very similar re. 10/10 rankings, parental involvement, nice people, demographics, etc. But after elementary school, your kids are much better off in RISD than DISD. DISD is a wreck. Thus, in the short term, it is a tie, but in the long term, WRE area is the way to go. It is also a bonus that homes in WRE area that were selling for $120/sq.ft. two years ago are now going for $220/sq.ft. I doubt many other areas can match that rate of appreciation!

[Considering Coming Back]

Sorry, Krate, but I disagree with your long term outlook. LHHS continues to have a decline in the number of white students and an increase in the number of F/R lunch students. That's a 20 year trend that shows no sign of turning around. Lakewood/Woodrow bottomed out in the late 80s/ early 90s, held steady at 15%-20% white, and for the last 5 years has shown a continued up tick in the number of white students (and middle class Hispanics) and a decline in the number of F/R lunch students.

The Woodrow feeder pattern class of 2026 (that's Kindergartners) now has, for the first time in recent memory, more whites (257) than hispanics (252). That number has grown steadily during the weak economy, and could certainly change in a full recovery, but the LHHS feeder pattern has not seen comparable growth.

Instead the LHHS feeder pattern looks more like the Bryan Adams feeder pattern just south of it. There it's Hexter or nothing, and then bail at 6th grade. In LH you have the same with WRE (sure LHE and Wallace are currently acceptable choices, but Reilly and Sanger were too only a dozen years ago).

As for the macro, district level stuff, a Lakewood family always has the choice of applying to Booker T, TAG, and SEM. In LH what do you have? Comfort in not having crazy board members? Those folks do not affect the classroom.

If you have a 6th grader, it's a tossup right now. But if your kid is younger it leans toward Lakewood.

[TurtleCreek80]

Originally Posted by Considering Coming Back

Sorry, Krate, but I disagree with your long term outlook. LHHS continues to have a decline in the number of white students and an increase in the number of F/R lunch students. That's a 20 year trend that shows no sign of turning around. Lakewood/Woodrow bottomed out in the late 80s/ early 90s, held steady at 15%-20% white, and for the last 5 years has shown a continued up tick in the number of white students (and middle class Hispanics) and a decline in the number of F/R lunch students.

The Woodrow feeder pattern class of 2026 (that's Kindergartners) now has, for the first time in recent memory, more whites (257) than hispanics (252). That number has grown steadily during the weak economy, and could certainly change in a full recovery, but the LHHS feeder pattern has not seen comparable growth.

Instead the LHHS feeder pattern looks more like the Bryan Adams feeder pattern just south of it. There it's Hexter or nothing, and then bail at 6th grade. In LH you have the same with WRE (sure LHE and Wallace are currently acceptable choices, but Reilly and Sanger were too only a dozen years ago).

As for the macro, district level stuff, a Lakewood family always has the choice of applying to Booker T, TAG, and SEM. In LH what do you have? Comfort in not having crazy board members? Those folks do not affect the classroom.

If you have a 6th grader, it's a tossup right now. But if your kid is younger it leans toward Lakewood.

This.

Plus, athough DISD suffers from administrative issues, it also opens up access to some of the top ranked high schools in the entire US. SEM and TAG have been ranked the top two public high schools in the US for quite a few years now. There are almost a dozen great magnet options, not including the IB program at Long and Woodrow, for upper grades. I would put those options up against LHHS / RISD any day. It's not exactly like someone residing in LHHS district has alternate RISD options. They can't just all show up at RISD's star JJ Pearce HS, right?