Dallas Creatives? (Austin, Cleveland, San Diego: fit in, how much, homes)

[NomadicOne]

I am thinking about going to either Dallas or LA. I know Dallas would have less activities, but I have heard the people are very friendly, which would more than make up for LA's attractions for me. Being around outgoing interesting people is my primary value at this stage in my life. I really value people that are trustworthy and honest, which is a huge draw for Texas. Ideally I would like to be around people that are both earnest and open-minded and creative, although those traits can often be at odds.

My primary reason for leaving northern California is that I don't feel like independent creative people are valued very highly here, regardless of how successful they are. Google and Facebook are sort of turning SF into Cleveland, and the independents are scattering to the wind. The image of people building companies out of their garage is outdated by 20 years. I don't like how stressed out and cutthroat the whole area has become. My friend compared the modern bay area to early 1980s New York (see American Psycho).

I know in LA and San Diego there is a very high esteem for someone who follows their dreams and builds something of their own. I like meeting people like that, and I like being in an area where I am appreciated, which I definitely am in the Venice Beach / Santa Monica area.

Dallas is the headquarters for a lot of companies, and it sounds like most people there are going to be corporate workers, which scares me a bit. To someone who understands what I am getting at, do you think Dallas is a good place for independent creative people, or will you be considered a second-class citizen for not working at Southwest Airlines or something? I have lived in cities that were basically corporate dormitories and I did not like the environment at all.

I visited Austin, but it just seemed like a small college town without much to do. I did not feel like I fit in there at all.

Anyways, if you understand what I am getting at I would appreciate your opinion.

[RonnieinDallas]

This post is really vague. What specifically are you trying to do? I think Dallas rewards creativity, but it can punish the aimless harshly.

[NomadicOne]

Basically, if you work from home or a small office, do people look down on you for not being a corporate drone? I've lived in places where that occurs, no matter how much money you are making.

And are you going to come across other small business owners in tech, art, entertainment, and creative fields who are actually doing it and not just posing? Where do these types hang out? Is uptown just "corporate drones"?

[TurtleCreek80]

Oh, where to begin...in no particular order,

You may be idealizing Texas. I would guess our mix of honest / trustworthy vs dishonest/ not trustworthy people is about the same as anywhere.

Re: creative vs corporate, Dallas' "vibe" is much more corporate and superficial than Austin, which is more crunchy and free-spirited. A lot of people who come to Dallas say they didn't realize just how flashy it is and how the huge amount of people with major money here stands out. If you're interested in Texas, I'd urge you to take a second look at Austin. It is much more than a college town.

That said, there are a lot of small businesses here as well as startups and creative companies, ranging from advertising agencies to fashion designers to artists to innovative chefs. There is definitely a support system for startups and small businesses here in Dallas. But most startups don't want to stay quirky little shops; they want to be the next Mark Cuban and get a $1 billion payday via IPO. Entrepreneurship is definitely valued in Dallas, but I'm not sure that is what you were getting at.

My sense based on your somewhat rambling post is that Dallas is too flashy/ sleek for you and you would find many of the authentic people here to come across as "posers."

And FYI, this corporate employee thinks you may have problems fitting in anywhere with your disgust for and inability to get along with any of us "small minded" corporate drones. Why is it that the ones who claim to be so open minded are so small minded themselves that they can't find anything redeeming in large companies who create shareholder value and provide high paying, challenging careers for employees?

[NomadicOne]

I actually make quite a lot of money, but I tend to be quiet about it and try to live a modest life. That said, my definition of modest might be what others consider "flashy". Buying any car (other than like a Ferrari) I want is no issue for me, it's just a car. I actually drive an older sports car right now.

I guess I am just saying I like people who do what they love, whether they are successful or not, rather than people who work jobs they hate so they can buy more stuff. This is very important to me. Work is something I enjoy and am excited about every day. I don't like people who are stressed out and angry about their jobs.

[TurtleCreek80]

Originally Posted by NomadicOne

I actually make quite a lot of money, but I tend to be quiet about it and try to live a modest life. That said, my definition of modest might be what others consider "flashy". Buying any car (other than like a Ferrari) I want is no issue for me, it's just a car. I actually drive an older sports car right now.

I guess I am just saying I like people who do what they love, whether they are successful or not, rather than people who work jobs they hate so they can buy more stuff. This is very important to me. Work is something I enjoy and am excited about every day. I don't like people who are stressed out and angry about their jobs.

Congrats on being rich. "Flashy" in Dallas is a brand new, 5000SF+ home, matching new Maseratis or Range Rovers, private jets, second homes, and all the "right" clothes & accessories. In the suburbs, it's a brand new McMansion and new model SUV's with the kids playing multiple expensive "select" league sports. Not everyone is that way but enough are that it's a legit "rep".

There are all kinds of people in Dallas. Some toil away in jobs they hate (i.e., I can think of several law firm partners I know who fit the bill) because their lifestyle costs $500k+ per year and they aren't going to give that up. Some "starving artists" are here but most people grow our out of that by late 20's. Some people are always running "get rich quick" schemes from bad startups to selling all kinds of crap on Facebook. Some people such as myself are fulfilled and challenged by careers that they love. Some are taking any job they can to pay the bills. Seriously, all kinds of people in Dallas. How can a metro area with almost 7 million people fit one mold when it comes to work?

[jdallas]

People are the same everywhere. If you can't find friendly people in Venice Beach, Dallas will surely disappoint

[pepper131]

I think I understand what you are looking for.

You'll just need to get plugged into the right scene. If you teach your craft, contact Oil and Cotton and see about offering a workshop. They would be able to introduce you around.

Hang out on Sat mornings at Full City Rooster - more creative types coming in....I can think of a few who have studios in that neighborhood (The Cedars).

Start going out and meeting people. https://centraltrack.com/

Creatives in Dallas are thankful for our corporate presence - many do freelance work and earn a good living.
I can think of one creative couple with a t-shirt design business who also work at Fossil. There are heaps more.

[biscuit_head]

Southern California would be a better environment for you. I freelanced a lot for a lot of startups in Santa Monica/Venice (Silicon Beach) when I lived there. LA's corporate presence isn't quite as large as DFW's, but there are lots of small businesses in the area who need services from creatives/freelancers.

DFW's strong corporate presence that you seem to be so disgusted and "scared" of actually hire a lot of freelancers/1099ers for temporary contract work. If you're willing to open your mind and follow the advice of pepper131 on meeting creatives in the area along with the advice from TurtleCreek80, you can thrive as a creative in the area. There are also a lot of coworking spaces scattered throughout the city that you can utilize.

What type of creative work do you do? Also, where are you moving from?

[NomadicOne]

I'm from Northern California. What I love about LA is the entrepreneurial spirit, which I don't really see much of in the bay anymore, since it is all dominated by VC money and an east coast elitist attitude. I have found that depending on location I am either considered a high-status cool maverick or low-status loser, so it is very important to me. Socal generally has a more conservative thread to it where business ownership is seen as a cool/responsible thing. Norcal feels more "top-down", where everything comes from the university system, the State, Google, or Sequoia Capital, and you have to be a servant to one of those entities.

I feel a lot of admiration for someone who will take a job waiting tables so they can pursue their dream, even if they fail. I'm thankfully through that stage, but I just want to be somewhere where that kind of pluckiness and hustle is appreciated.