Is DFW becoming less affordable? (lawyers, tile, kitchen cabinets)

[Aceraceae]

Originally Posted by UnfairPark

Let's face it, DFW is building a whole lot of new residential homes and commercial buildings and there is a shortage of skilled workers and they charge more. Material is more expensive and land has gotten very expensive. Builders want to make significant profit so something has to give. They cut corners where buyers can't see it. Most buyers are interested in aesthetics and don't have any knowledge about construction.

For most part, most buyers don't care about location and construction as much as they do about superficial things to impress others.

I don't think it's reasonable to expect the average person to have an advanced knowledge of construction best practices.

[numbersguy100]

Originally Posted by UnfairPark

Let's face it, DFW is building a whole lot of new residential homes and commercial buildings and there is a shortage of skilled workers and they charge more. Material is more expensive and land has gotten very expensive. Builders want to make significant profit so something has to give. They cut corners where buyers can't see it. Most buyers are interested in aesthetics and don't have any knowledge about construction.

For most part, most buyers don't care about location and construction as much as they do about superficial things to impress others.

I wouldn't say that they don't care. I would probably guess that many buyers are overly confident that their inspection will reveal all issues with the home and rely on the realtor and inspector to tell them anything that could go wrong, rather than asking specific questions and doing their own due diligence. They therefore think their only job is to assess whether the floorplan works for them and whether they like the finishes (or can afford to replace them given a home's price).

But yes custom work is expensive. We gutted the 100 year old home we live in now prior to moving in. Every cabinet, door, and most other details had to be custom built on site because while the settling of the foundation is done, it's uneven and there's literally nothing that can be done about it in most cases (we replaced plenty of the foundation so we know this). Paying someone who can come into your home, measure the room, and design and build cabinets on site that are level is so much harder than attaching some pre-built cabinets to the floor and wall. And the people who can do it expect to be paid well. But I've seen the alternative, which is pre-made cabinets going into an uneven floor and it's not even worth paying for the materials at that point because it looks like crap when it's done.

[lepoisson]

This is pretty much the exact type of home I'm looking for. Perfect for a couple with no desire to have kids. 3br around 1200-1500sqft. Single garage. Price range of $135-200K. Fairly up to date, but definitely move-in ready. Built in the 90s, so you won't have to deal with as many issues as a home built with aluminum wiring, galvanized pipes, etc.

Knightdale, NC is somewhat rural, but it's a 30 minute drive to most parts of Raleigh. I'd compare it to the Hurst, Euless, Bedford area, or maybe Burleson and Mansfield.

Most homes I've found in DFW within a 30 minute drive to Arlington in my price range are in need of major work.

403 Southampton Drive, Knightdale, NC For Sale | Trulia.com

[numbersguy100]

Originally Posted by lepoisson

This is pretty much the exact type of home I'm looking for. Perfect for a couple with no desire to have kids. 3br around 1200-1500sqft. Single garage. Price range of $135-200K. Fairly up to date, but definitely move-in ready. Built in the 90s, so you won't have to deal with as many issues as a home built with aluminum wiring, galvanized pipes, etc.

Knightdale, NC is somewhat rural, but it's a 30 minute drive to most parts of Raleigh. I'd compare it to the Hurst, Euless, Bedford area, or maybe Burleson and Mansfield.

Most homes I've found in DFW within a 30 minute drive to Arlington in my price range are in need of major work.

403 Southampton Drive, Knightdale, NC For Sale | Trulia.com

DFW is much, much larger than Raleigh though, so it makes sense that it's more expensive, given an accurate comparison. HEB area is midway between two large cities, close to Arlington and a somewhat reasonable commute to the jobs in Plano/Frisco. The link you posted is a house on the eastern outskirts of a smaller city. I'd compare it more to a place like Forney here - it's definitely not comparable to HEB. Incidentally, there are more than a few 1200-1500 sq ft, 3/2 homes in Forney in that general price point. Your examples of Burleson or Mansfield are slightly more accurate as comps, but you can also find what you're looking for in those towns at a sub 200k price point. The house you posted in NC was similarly dated to what you can find in a non-central town outside DFW.

[TheOverdog]

which is pre-made cabinets going into an uneven floor and it's not even worth paying for the materials at that point because it looks like crap when it's done.

Putting premade cabinets in an uneven floor is very common - your floor is not nearly as flat as you think it is, and there are tons of construction techniques to handle it, which include floor leveling compounds, shims in the base cabinets, trimming the kickplates, floating base cabinets, and adjusting the foundation. Heck, step one of installing cabinets is finding the high point in your kitchen and installing from there.

If you don't like pre-made cabinets that's fine, but odd layouts and uneven floors is a solved problem when dealing with them, and the techniques for installation are no different than site-built ones.

And unless your house was built pre 1950 or was a full-custom then, then it was built as quickly and cheaply as possible using basically the same construction techniques used today. Cheap land equals cheap houses, and always has been so.

[numbersguy100]

Originally Posted by TheOverdog

Putting premade cabinets in an uneven floor is very common - your floor is not nearly as flat as you think it is, and there are tons of construction techniques to handle it, which include floor leveling compounds, shims in the base cabinets, trimming the kickplates, floating base cabinets, and adjusting the foundation. Heck, step one of installing cabinets is finding the high point in your kitchen and installing from there.

If you don't like pre-made cabinets that's fine, but odd layouts and uneven floors is a solved problem when dealing with them, and the techniques for installation are no different than site-built ones.

And unless your house was built pre 1950 or was a full-custom then, then it was built as quickly and cheaply as possible using basically the same construction techniques used today. Cheap land equals cheap houses, and always has been so.

Reading comprehension is your friend. I said my home is 100 years old. It was incredibly well built and has been well maintained over the years. I do hate the look of pre-made cabinets, and I dislike the resultant layouts. That they can be installed to hide the imperfections in a floor doesn't mean that they always are.

[lepoisson]

Originally Posted by numbersguy100

DFW is much, much larger than Raleigh though, so it makes sense that it's more expensive, given an accurate comparison. HEB area is midway between two large cities, close to Arlington and a somewhat reasonable commute to the jobs in Plano/Frisco. The link you posted is a house on the eastern outskirts of a smaller city. I'd compare it more to a place like Forney here - it's definitely not comparable to HEB. Incidentally, there are more than a few 1200-1500 sq ft, 3/2 homes in Forney in that general price point. Your examples of Burleson or Mansfield are slightly more accurate as comps, but you can also find what you're looking for in those towns at a sub 200k price point. The house you posted in NC was similarly dated to what you can find in a non-central town outside DFW.

I guess I don't always equate city size with cost. Just because a city is big doesn't mean homes are more expensive. And just because a city is small, doesn't mean homes are inexpensive.

Housing in Raleigh is actually around the same as in DFW. Good luck finding a decent home under $250,000 in many parts of Raleigh or DFW. My parents bought a house in BF Egypt Angier, NC because they got a lot more house for the money compared to what it was in town.

I'm sure Forney is comparable, but it would take me over an hour to get to Arlington in traffic.

This is a home in Burleson. It's a similar price as the one in Knightdale, but it's not quite as nice (built on a slab, yard needs work, painting, interior looks more dated and less open), and the location is more rural. Knightdale has similar amenities to Mansfield (grocery stores, restaurants, a few strip centers).

Seems like you get a little bit more home for the money in semi-rural areas of Raleigh compared to DFW.

1436 Windy Meadows Drive, Burleson, TX For Sale | Trulia.com

[Katana49]

Originally Posted by TheOverdog

And unless your house was built pre 1950 or was a full-custom then, then it was built as quickly and cheaply as possible using basically the same construction techniques used today. Cheap land equals cheap houses, and always has been so.

Not quite.

Buying an older home, you're going to have real wood, for everything. You'll have real wood doors, real wood cabinets, wooden window frames, etc.

Now, you're getting particle board... even with a semi custom kitchen or bath. No one uses real wood anymore unless you're paying out the nose.

Unless you're going fully custom, and have control over materials used, a home today will be built with cheaper materials than in the past.

[lepoisson]

Originally Posted by Katana49

Not quite.

Buying an older home, you're going to have real wood, for everything. You'll have real wood doors, real wood cabinets, wooden window frames, etc.

Now, you're getting particle board... even with a semi custom kitchen or bath. No one uses real wood anymore unless you're paying out the nose.

Unless you're going fully custom, and have control over materials used, a home today will be built with cheaper materials than in the past.

I rented a 1950s home a few years ago. The doors were all solid wood, the walls were all plaster, however, the plumbing was galvanized, the wiring was aluminum, and insulation was poor.

I think I'd rather replace a few doors than deal with rewiring and replumbing an entire home.

[Katana49]

Originally Posted by lepoisson

I rented a 1950s home a few years ago. The doors were all solid wood, the walls were all plaster, however, the plumbing was galvanized, the wiring was aluminum, and insulation was poor.

I think I'd rather replace a few doors than deal with rewiring and replumbing an entire home.

Yes, that's why I said earlier in this thread that there is no short easy answer for which is better. For me personally, I'll take a newer home with newer installation and efficiency standards.

My price point is high enough that I still get real solid wood doors and such, however, my kitchen cabinets, even though they are custom, are made from particle board.