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As the title says, I recently purchased a 2012 Infiniti from a major dealership with 36k miles on the odo. The car fax and everything was fine. After about 2 days I notice oil leaking from the car. I immediately popped the hood and checked the dip stick. The dip stick was completely dry and I could see oil dripping from the front of the engine. I called the dealership that I purchased the car from and talked to some guy in service that said he will call me back but never did. After waiting for a couple hours with no call from the original dealership I decided to call the infiniti dealership to see if the remaining warranty would cover the problem. So the Infiniti dealership ran my vin number and informed me that the engine portion of the drive train warranty has been voided!!! In shock I ask why, the service writer then tells me the warranty was voided because sludge was found in the engine! Apparently the previous owner took the car in more than once because it wouldn't start, heard knocking coming from the engine. I immediately called the the dealership that I got the car from and completely got the runaround, what can I do? Can I get this fix? Do I need a lawyer??
First of all, 2012 with 36k is out of standard warranty, period. The only way it would still be in factory warranty is if someone paid for an extended
A lot of dealerships, esp used cars, come with their own warranty that is specific to their dealership. I'm confused on why you didn't call back after couple hours? Or why you didn't call back after you heard the bad news?
Getting a lawyer is useless unless you have things in writing
Infiniti has longer warranty than that, 4/50 or 4/60 for the bumper to bumper. And the powertrain is longer 6/70 or something like that. So bumper to bumper might be out based on years, but the other one should be still valid. This is the first time I hear about voiding warranty because of sludge. If sludge formed in warranty, they should have fixed the problem!
When I spoke with Infiniti they clam the previous owner took the car in 3 times, each time it was in they found sludge in the engine. Infiniti is saying the sludge is from lack of maintenance. They voided part of the drivetrain warranty, the engine.
Infiniti is saying the sludge is from lack of maintenance.
Of course they are and it's also a lie. Sludge in any modern engine is caused by condensation that forms when the engine is cold and is warming up. After the engine reaches normal operating temp, the water is cooked off to steam and removed via the PCV system. It happens in every internal combustion engine. The motor oils are designed to handle small amounts of water condensate. But if the engine sees a lot of short trips where the condensate doesn't have time to cook off and be removed, it forms sludge. So Infiniti knows this and is scamming folks into believing that the issue is lousy maintenance- not so. An engine can sludge in as little as 1500 miles under the right conditions. Infiniti recommends a synthetic oil for their engines. Why? Lousy engine design, frankly. Anytime a manufacturer states that you MUST use a synthetic oil read instead- lousy engine design that has issues solved by the base oil. It's still a lousy engine design and some of the current "synthetic" oils are yesterdays conventionals. At one time you had to have a Gp III or better base oil to qualify as a synthetic. Now you can have a plain Gp II as a synthetic which is yesterdays conventional. The reason- it does not appear in nature therefore it is a synthetic. But most folks don't have clue about what the oil really is and frankly, they shouldn't have to know. Any motor oil subjected to lots of condensate is going to sludge regardless of conventional, blend, or synthetic. Now, for the reason Infiniti is denying and warranty on the engine. The tubes for the cam timing are small and are quick to sludge due to location in the engine. Once they become clogged, the engine will generally start to buck and miss. When this happens, the timing chain is in oil starvation and it gets expensive to fix. Infiniti knows this and will deny any warranty due to their lousy engine design but blame it on YOU for bad maintenance. Welcome to Infiniti ownership. It's the same story with Nissan branded engines as well. It's nothing more than a ploy to get out of warranting the crap they sell. Your best recourse, get an attorney and have them take the car back, assuming you haven't had it long. You can have the attorney file a claim as to defraud you of your money since the dealership would have known about this when they got the car. It's not like they didn't know the VIN. All dealerships will search the VIN database to look for any recalls. The dealership knew this engine was in a void situation. Unless you signed paperwork that they told about it, it's a clear case of fraud.
FWIW, you are far from the first person to have this issue with Nissan/Infiniti. Lots of history here for your attorney to document the case. There should be no issues getting your money back providing you haven't had the car for months/years. I would strongly suggest a different brand car next time.
1. The Carfax might note some previous oil changes. If the car went in 3 times for maintenance/service that implies at least some oil changes. Look that thing over with a fine tooth comb. It should be organized chronologically.
2. Describe where the oil is leaking from. A big oil leak from the front of the engine could be very bad. A drib and drab leak might not be a big deal.
3. Figure out what kind of oil is in the car and add oil. If the dipstick is dry add a quart and then check the dipstick. Then add maybe 1/3qt at a time until the stick indicates full - don't overfill, it's better to be 1/2 qt low than 1/2 qt. over.
Then place a flattened cardboard box under the leak and leave it there overnight. You need to determine how bad the leak is.
4. Don't panic about no oil showing on the stick. If the engine was out of oil or so low the oil pump couldn't function you'd know as your engine would have failed catastrophically.
5. Get her full of oil and try to gauge how much is leaking out per day.
6. Get on the horn with Infiniti corporate tomorrow and see what they say. Then call Sewell Infiniti in Dallas if you haven't. Verify the warranty is voided and press them harder for why. Sludge alone isn't enough. If the car has a clean Carfax ask them how that can be.
7. Thinking about this some more phone calls tomorrow morning:
A. Call the GM at the dealership where you bought the car. If s/he is not there ask for the owner, finance mgr. don't stop until your talk to someone way up the food chain demand to know why the sold you a car with a voided engine warranty without notifying you..........there is ZERO chance they didn't know. At some point talk to the sales-drone who sold you the car.
B. Call Sewell Infiniti service and ask for advice - they are super.
C. Call Infiniti corporate.
D. Call Carfax and raise hell. Carafe isn't worth beans if they don't report a voided warranty on car.
8. It's critical that you don't drive the car at all until you know that it has oil somewhere between the min. and max. mark. Right on Max. is perfect.
Of course they are and it's also a lie. Sludge in any modern engine is caused by condensation that forms when the engine is cold and is warming up. After the engine reaches normal operating temp, the water is cooked off to steam and removed via the PCV system. It happens in every internal combustion engine. The motor oils are designed to handle small amounts of water condensate. But if the engine sees a lot of short trips where the condensate doesn't have time to cook off and be removed, it forms sludge. So Infiniti knows this and is scamming folks into believing that the issue is lousy maintenance- not so. An engine can sludge in as little as 1500 miles under the right conditions. Infiniti recommends a synthetic oil for their engines. Why? Lousy engine design, frankly. Anytime a manufacturer states that you MUST use a synthetic oil read instead- lousy engine design that has issues solved by the base oil. It's still a lousy engine design and some of the current "synthetic" oils are yesterdays conventionals. At one time you had to have a Gp III or better base oil to qualify as a synthetic. Now you can have a plain Gp II as a synthetic which is yesterdays conventional. The reason- it does not appear in nature therefore it is a synthetic. But most folks don't have clue about what the oil really is and frankly, they shouldn't have to know. Any motor oil subjected to lots of condensate is going to sludge regardless of conventional, blend, or synthetic. Now, for the reason Infiniti is denying and warranty on the engine. The tubes for the cam timing are small and are quick to sludge due to location in the engine. Once they become clogged, the engine will generally start to buck and miss. When this happens, the timing chain is in oil starvation and it gets expensive to fix. Infiniti knows this and will deny any warranty due to their lousy engine design but blame it on YOU for bad maintenance. Welcome to Infiniti ownership. It's the same story with Nissan branded engines as well. It's nothing more than a ploy to get out of warranting the crap they sell. Your best recourse, get an attorney and have them take the car back, assuming you haven't had it long. You can have the attorney file a claim as to defraud you of your money since the dealership would have known about this when they got the car. It's not like they didn't know the VIN. All dealerships will search the VIN database to look for any recalls. The dealership knew this engine was in a void situation. Unless you signed paperwork that they told about it, it's a clear case of fraud.
FWIW, you are far from the first person to have this issue with Nissan/Infiniti. Lots of history here for your attorney to document the case. There should be no issues getting your money back providing you haven't had the car for months/years. I would strongly suggest a different brand car next time.
I'd agree with a good deal of that. However, if the OP has a car with the 3.7L NA V-6, that's one of the best engines in the history of automobiles. Lots of guys race the 3.5 version as it's a shade under 300hp - 297 IIRC.
Also your point about engines that require "synthetic" oil over conventional oil is just way too simplistic. Think about what oil has to do in turbocharged cars and way worse turbocharged diesels that meet EPA air regs. The oil has to tolerate intense heat from the turbo and it has to function full of ash. The Rotella T-6 oil drained from my Jeep 3.0 turbo diesel looks like black ink.
Finally, I'm a 2x Nissan owner and 1x Infiniti owner. I love the 3.7/3.5 engine. That said Nismo's warranty experience is abysmal.
I agree fully that there is ZERO chance the dealership didn't know about the warranty problem.
First of all, 2012 with 36k is out of standard warranty, period. The only way it would still be in factory warranty is if someone paid for an extended
A lot of dealerships, esp used cars, come with their own warranty that is specific to their dealership. I'm confused on why you didn't call back after couple hours? Or why you didn't call back after you heard the bad news?
Getting a lawyer is useless unless you have things in writing
Infiniti has a longer drive train warranty than most this is under warranty and was not out of warranty. The dealer would have said so if it was. I believe the drive train is a 6 year 70k mile warranty. The basic warranty is 4 year 60k miles for other than drive train.
I would call Infiniti back and find out when it was voided and who owned it when it was. The do a search on where the dealership you got the car from bought the car. Id call the state of texas to inquire about lemon law or any other consumer protection offered you can use. If that fails get a lawyer.
I agree call Sewell Infiniti service they are super. I have had two vehicles with the engine mentioned above with good reliability and no issues. I have had several with the 4.5 liter formerly used by Infiniti and now have a 5.7 liter in an SUV that has been flawless, as in always run and never into dealer other than for routine service. I should mention Infiniti finally recalled this vehicle for timing chain issues. I had no issue with mine but got the re engineered chain this past summer. They did seem slow to issue this recall in my view based upon trouble others were reporting.. .. frequent oil change was apparently the reason mine did not have these issues.
As the title says, I recently purchased a 2012 Infiniti from a major dealership with 36k miles on the odo. The car fax and everything was fine. After about 2 days I notice oil leaking from the car. I immediately popped the hood and checked the dip stick. The dip stick was completely dry and I could see oil dripping from the front of the engine. I called the dealership that I purchased the car from and talked to some guy in service that said he will call me back but never did. After waiting for a couple hours with no call from the original dealership I decided to call the infiniti dealership to see if the remaining warranty would cover the problem. So the Infiniti dealership ran my vin number and informed me that the engine portion of the drive train warranty has been voided!!! In shock I ask why, the service writer then tells me the warranty was voided because sludge was found in the engine! Apparently the previous owner took the car in more than once because it wouldn't start, heard knocking coming from the engine. I immediately called the the dealership that I got the car from and completely got the runaround, what can I do? Can I get this fix? Do I need a lawyer??
Using a CarFax report is a good start but even CarFax states that not all information about a vehicle may have been reported. Your issue might be covered under the Texas Lemon Law (TXDMV.GOV - Lemon Law). At this point depending on what the cost of the vehicle was, and how much it appears it will take to correct it, you might best be served by finding an Attorney that is very familiar with the State Lemon Laws.
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