Allen#1 (Post: to live, bus, statistics)

[DTXman34]

Originally Posted by BLDSoon

Thats True.
I'm just attempting to illustrate that those differences just aren't that large. Certainly not large enough to garner the passions this topic generates.

In time this will be one spread-out, highwayed-to the hilt metropolis. Whether that will be a good (looking) thing remains to be seen.

It's already that way. The city is at least trying to infill and increase density as well as expand/improve multi-nodal forms of transportation (e.g. pedestrian friendly design, Downtown subway, expanded street-cars in Downtown, etc.) I see NONE of that in the increasingly congested western sections of Plano and Frisco (mostly along DNT & SRT). I give a lot of credit to Plano east of 75 and props to projects like CityLine as well. That's a start in the right direction, but everything west of there is a complete and utter disaster. And that also includes sections within the city of Dallas along DNT. The Midtown project, while well intended, doesn't seem to be connected to ANY rail line at all. Or am I wrong on that?

[BLDSoon]

Originally Posted by DTXman34

It's already that way. The city is at least trying to infill and increase density as well as expand/improve multi-nodal forms of transportation (e.g. pedestrian friendly design, Downtown subway, expanded street-cars in Downtown, etc.) I see NONE of that in the increasingly congested western sections of Plano and Frisco (mostly along DNT & SRT). I give a lot of credit to Plano east of 75 and props to projects like CityLine as well. That's a start in the right direction, but everything west of there is a complete and utter disaster. And that also includes sections within the city of Dallas along DNT. The Midtown project, while well intended, doesn't seem to be connected to ANY rail line at all. Or am I wrong on that?

Public transit seems to be a hard sell to suburbanites around here, why i dont know. Especially given the pages and pages of complaints about commute. It would definitely ease congestion. I'm not sure why that is not being very seriously considered. When the Legacy corridor is fully occupied, chaos will ensure. Its on its way.

[dhakaia]

Originally Posted by BLDSoon

Public transit seems to be a hard sell to suburbanites around here, why i dont know. Especially given the pages and pages of complaints about commute. It would definitely ease congestion. I'm not sure why that is not being very seriously considered. When the Legacy corridor is fully occupied, chaos will ensure. Its on its way.

That's due to car-culture induced narrow mindedness. Majority of the people living in the suburbs (present company included), values the freedom of movement cars provide a little too much... even if that means one vehicle for each member of the family. A lot of them cling on to beliefs that public transit smell like 'pee' and are filled with degenerates. They try to justify taking the car over DART, by saying "What if there's an emergency at home or my kid's school, and I have to rush back quickly??" Buses come once an hour, the Texas heat... those don't help either. When living in our townhome in Richardson, I had seen people put filled garbage bags on the roof/hood of their cars, so they can drive it to the main dumpster 100 yards away. That's how averse we are to idea of walking even just the bare minimum.

Unless there are massive tariffs put on cars to keep as few of them on the roads as possible (i.e. certificate of entitlement system in Singapore), or gas prices hit much higher levels (i.e. much of Europe)... we can't expect to see any significant change.

[HP48G]

Originally Posted by DTXman34

The Midtown project, while well intended, doesn't seem to be connected to ANY rail line at all. Or am I wrong on that?

Well there is nothing to connect it to. This project will rely on traffic off 635 and the DNT.

[jiping]

Originally Posted by dhakaia

That's due to car-culture induced narrow mindedness. Majority of the people living in the suburbs (present company included), values the freedom of movement cars provide a little too much... even if that means one vehicle for each member of the family. A lot of them cling on to beliefs that public transit smell like 'pee' and are filled with degenerates. They try to justify taking the car over DART, by saying "What if there's an emergency at home or my kid's school, and I have to rush back quickly??" Buses come once an hour, the Texas heat... those don't help either. When living in our townhome in Richardson, I had seen people put filled garbage bags on the roof/hood of their cars, so they can drive it to the main dumpster 100 yards away. That's how averse we are to idea of walking even just the bare minimum.

Unless there are massive tariffs put on cars to keep as few of them on the roads as possible (i.e. certificate of entitlement system in Singapore), or gas prices hit much higher levels (i.e. much of Europe)... we can't expect to see any significant change.

DART are filled with degenerates. It's a fact not a belief.

A video taken by a passenger of the attack has been seen tens of thousands of times on Facebook since Sunday night. Kennan Jones was kicked, punched and slapped for several minutes by more than a half a dozen young men and women.
No arrests have been made in the savage beating of a DART train passenger over the weekend. At least one city leader is now calling for more patrols.

Still no arrests made in weekend DART train beating - Story | FOX 13 Tampa Bay
VIDEO POSTED: AUG 03 2017 05:06AM EDT

[unexpected]

It's not that the suburbs are against public transit. Plano wants more public transit! We joined DART - we have given DART gobs of money since inception, yet DART has failed to make serious inroads here.

What else is Plano supposed to do? We could probably do better if we were not a part of DART. DART seems more focused on Dallas (see the recent controversy on the D2 line vs. the Cotton Belt Line).

Nothing would make Plano citizens happier than having a rail line down the tollway. This will never happen. Why? Because whoever negotiated the NTTA deal let the NTTA put in a clause that we could not use that corridor for a rail system. Why else? Everyone knows that HP would never allow a rail line in their city.

None of these are Plano's fault. Let's do a better job of public transit. The majority of the DART board is controlled by the City of Dallas. Access to public transit in Plano/Carrollton/Addison/Richardson is DART's failure (and indirectly, the City of Dallas).

Now if you're Frisco, and you see the mess that is DART, why would you join up? Poor Addison has paid into DART for almost 30 years and does not have it's promised rail stop!

Maybe we should re-orient DART. Given the jobs growth in the Plano/Legacy area, a public transit system of centered around Frisco/McKinney/Allen/Plano might be more appealing and effective than the current system.

[HP48G]

Originally Posted by unexpected

Maybe we should re-orient DART. Given the jobs growth in the Plano/Legacy area, a public transit system of centered around Frisco/McKinney/Allen/Plano might be more appealing and effective than the current system.

I agree. The DART network was designed to bring commuters to Dallas. What is needed now is a network of frequent buses to move people within the north suburbs to the clusters of jobs along DNT or 75.

[UnfairPark]

Originally Posted by HP48G

I agree. The DART network was designed to bring commuters to Dallas. What is needed now is a network of frequent buses to move people within the north suburbs to the clusters of jobs along DNT or 75.

Amen!

[thenewtexan]

Originally Posted by HP48G

I agree. The DART network was designed to bring commuters to Dallas. What is needed now is a network of frequent buses to move people within the north suburbs to the clusters of jobs along DNT or 75.

Sounds practical but the reality is people from Collin County will never take the bus.

[unexpected]

Originally Posted by thenewtexan

Sounds practical but the reality is people from Collin County will never take the bus.

There is nothing different about the people that live in Collin County. The Dallas elitism is ridiculous. There's very little difference in the population of the North Dallas area vs the Richardson/Plano/Frisco area. Yet DART has built Dallas multiple rail stops, bus transfer stations, etc. Meanwhile, the suburbs get shafted.

I live in Collin County, and I would LOVE to take a bus to work - we just need stops that make sense. There's no rhyme or reason to the DART stops in Plano. It makes sense if you're trying to pick up as many people as you can, and take them to Dallas, but not if you're trying to intelligently get People around Plano.

Let's use an example:

Let's say you want to get from the UTD campus to Shops at Legacy. There's a lot of jobs in the area - it would be popular for internships, etc - even popular for students that want something to do in the evenings or go out (no drunk driving!).

Google Maps says this should take 20 minutes by car (sounds about right). This same route, via DART takes 1 hour, 11 minutes! This is moronic. This is why people "from Collin County don't ride the bus".

Fortunately, an uberX is only $16 (and you can take up to 4 people). The DART fare for those 4 people would be $6? Plus all that extra time? What a mess. Thanks Dallas!