DFW suburbs and trouble getting into TX flagship schools (Plano: appointed, 2013)

[UnfairPark]

Acceptance Rates 2019

Stanford 4.8%
Harvard 5.3%
Columbia 6.1%
Yale 6.5%
Princeton 7%
MIT 8.1%
Rice 8.7%
Brown 8.7%
Penn 9.9%
Dartmouth 10.3%
Cornell 15.1%


UT 35%
Baylor 37%
TCU 37%
SMU 49%
A&M 67%
UNT 71%
UTD 76%

[cordata]

Originally Posted by UnfairPark

Acceptance Rates 2019

Stanford 4.8%
Harvard 5.3%
Columbia 6.1%
Yale 6.5%
Princeton 7%
MIT 8.1%
Rice 8.7%
Brown 8.7%
Penn 9.9%
Dartmouth 10.3%
Cornell 15.1%


UT 35%
Baylor 37%
TCU 37%
SMU 49%
A&M 67%
UNT 71%
UTD 76%

For the UT number does that include the 6% (or whatever it is). ? Or is it 35% of applicatns who are not auto-admits are admitted ?

[EDS_]

Originally Posted by cordata

For the UT number does that include the 6% (or whatever it is). ? Or is it 35% of applicatns who are not auto-admits are admitted ?

It does. Automatic admission plans render admission rates near meaningless for comparison purposes with other schools. There's another factor too..........the overall acceptance rates tell us only what percentage of applicants were admitted into the school. A better metric is what percentage of applicants were admitted per program per school.

According UT the overall admission rate for those outside the auto-admit cadres was a shade under 14% last year.

[TheOverdog]

Stanford 4.8%

Acceptance rates are simple factors of those who apply vs number of open slots, and since the applications are generally not free, they are tempered and thus are not measures of relative difficulty, popularity, or generosity of acceptance.



Comparatively (and nationally), becoming a Wal-Mart cashier has a similar acceptance rate (# of people who apply vs acceptance - applying to work for Wal-Mart is free) to Harvard.


Hence the article's point that no-one from 750 Texas high schools worth of students applied to go to A&M or UT.

[TurtleCreek80]

Originally Posted by Waterdragon8212

It is interesting to hear this perspective. In the last few years, I've heard of many HP kids with strong legacy ties getting capped or rejected from UT - many of whom would have gotten in easily in my day and age and some of whom were top 10%. There appears to be a large contingent of these kids going to OU now - a few of whom I've heard comment that since they grew up with Texas/OU weekend, they wanted to be able to participate in the rivalry. Doesn't seem like the wisest reason to pick a school, but hey, they are 18/19 year old kids. My outside observation was always to assume less kids were going to UT from HP, but perhaps I am underestimating the loyalties of the top 6% kids (or have a misconception of the number of kids that get in who are not auto-admit.) In order to graduate from HP in the top 6%, you have to have an insanely high GPA - my niece had over a 4.0 and wasn't close. I always imagined kids like that would pick more prestigious schools (especially since money is not typically an issue with the majority of HP grads.) I'm not knocking UT (it's my alma mater), but if I had enough money and could choose between Brown/Stanford/UChicago/etc. and UT, I doubt I would pick UT. Of course, all college admissions have gotten insanely competitive as of late, so maybe some of the ones that choose UT didn't get their dream school admission and went with family tradition. Or maybe they get into Plan II or other honors programs that make it worth it for them. It's just fascinating to me that the numbers have stayed roughly the same despite the admissions changes over the years.

Couple thoughts:
1. Legacy is different than donors. When one of Tom Hicks’ or Bill Duvall’s grandkids gets rejected from UT, let me know.

2. If you’re not in T6%, you need to be strategic about what college you apply to. You’re probably getting flat out rejected as a Business major, but can still get into many other undergrad programs. A strong college counselor like at HP or privates can help navigate that.

3. I believe more than half the HP kids matriculating at UT do not meet the auto-admit criteria based on our friends’ experiences who have had kids graduate over the past 4-5 years.

[Soccernerd]

Certain state universities offer favorable tuition packages for out-of-state students. For example, my alma mater, the University of Missouri, regularly recruited students from Illinois (mostly from the Chicago area). University of Arkansas has become a popular option for Missouri students. As I understand it, a lot of people from DFW go there as well as Oklahoma for college.

[numbersguy100]

Originally Posted by Waterdragon8212

It is interesting to hear this perspective. In the last few years, I've heard of many HP kids with strong legacy ties getting capped or rejected from UT - many of whom would have gotten in easily in my day and age and some of whom were top 10%. There appears to be a large contingent of these kids going to OU now - a few of whom I've heard comment that since they grew up with Texas/OU weekend, they wanted to be able to participate in the rivalry. Doesn't seem like the wisest reason to pick a school, but hey, they are 18/19 year old kids. My outside observation was always to assume less kids were going to UT from HP, but perhaps I am underestimating the loyalties of the top 6% kids (or have a misconception of the number of kids that get in who are not auto-admit.) In order to graduate from HP in the top 6%, you have to have an insanely high GPA - my niece had over a 4.0 and wasn't close. I always imagined kids like that would pick more prestigious schools (especially since money is not typically an issue with the majority of HP grads.) I'm not knocking UT (it's my alma mater), but if I had enough money and could choose between Brown/Stanford/UChicago/etc. and UT, I doubt I would pick UT. Of course, all college admissions have gotten insanely competitive as of late, so maybe some of the ones that choose UT didn't get their dream school admission and went with family tradition. Or maybe they get into Plan II or other honors programs that make it worth it for them. It's just fascinating to me that the numbers have stayed roughly the same despite the admissions changes over the years.

I am from New England and it has taken time to understand the Texas mindset where college is concerned. Frankly I still don’t completely get it, and I will almost certainly urge my kids to leave the state for college. But lots of the smart kids from HP you are generalizing about will have grown up with the idea that they would go to UT, have big school sports, and be in an exclusive sorority or fraternity (whose networking opportunities work in lieu of the type of opportunities people in the northeast get from their small private colleges). Because they’ve grown up with that expectation, they are more likely to prefer the flagship of a nearby state to a directional campus of the UT system. That’s where I think one of the bigger problems in the Texas vs California approach exists. UTD or Arlington or Tyler (etc) grew up as commuter schools and they’ve retained that reputation even as the reality changes. Within the UC system there are certainly reputational differences among the schools but none are seen as commuter schools. That’s more true once you get to the 2nd and 3rd tire systems within California.

[austinaggie]

Originally Posted by Taub201

According to HPISD Naviance, 80% of applicants are admitted to A&M. Very few want to do CAP or Gateway so if offered those options, people seem to head out of state.


I know a top 11% student at a suburban high school who didn't get into A&M or UT but was capped at UT. Guess she didn't choose A&M Gateway option (i.e., Tarleton, Commerce, CC). She chose Arkansas and got enough scholarship money to make the cost only a bit more than an in-state option.


I talked with an A&M admissions recruiter if the top 10% rule is challenging for his non-suburban recruitment area. He said it's not much of an issue. For the most part, the top 10% are about the only ones willing and able to attend. He has to convince those auto-admits to make the leap.

Just a small correction. The Gateway program at A&M is offered to very few students and it is usually offered to kids that have experienced a hardship such as experiencing a major illness or injury or if they have a death in their family while in high school that affected their ability to perform well in school. It allows students to attend school at the A&M main campus the Summer before their Freshman year and if the make the minimum required GPA they are admitted as a full time student to the College Station campus. The PSA program is where students are offered a pathway to the main campus in College Station by enrolling in one of the A&M system schools for their Freshman year (Corpus Christi, Tarelton State, Prairie View, etc.) and are guaranteed admittance to the main campus after successfully completing that year at the system school. These students only have a guaranteed pathway to the main campus if they are enrolled in certain majors and make the required GPA. This is the program that is basically they same type of program as the UT Cap program.

A ton of kids accept the PSA offer because they really want to go to A&M and unfortunately even though these kids have stellar stats they are not getting into the main campus so this is the next best alternative.

[calgirlinnc]

Originally Posted by numbersguy100

I am from New England and it has taken time to understand the Texas mindset where college is concerned. Frankly I still don’t completely get it, and I will almost certainly urge my kids to leave the state for college. But lots of the smart kids from HP you are generalizing about will have grown up with the idea that they would go to UT, have big school sports, and be in an exclusive sorority or fraternity (whose networking opportunities work in lieu of the type of opportunities people in the northeast get from their small private colleges). Because they’ve grown up with that expectation, they are more likely to prefer the flagship of a nearby state to a directional campus of the UT system. That’s where I think one of the bigger problems in the Texas vs California approach exists. UTD or Arlington or Tyler (etc) grew up as commuter schools and they’ve retained that reputation even as the reality changes. Within the UC system there are certainly reputational differences among the schools but none are seen as commuter schools. That’s more true once you get to the 2nd and 3rd tire systems within California.

Great post, but I grew up in Orange County and I can assure you UC Irvine was considered a commuter school. It may be different now. Thirty years ago the smart kids went to UCLA or Cal; everything else in the UC system was considered second best. All those other schools are now more difficult to get into, of course.

[cordata]

Originally Posted by calgirlinnc

Great post, but I grew up in Orange County and I can assure you UC Irvine was considered a commuter school. It may be different now. Thirty years ago the smart kids went to UCLA or Cal; everything else in the UC system was considered second best. All those other schools are now more difficult to get into, of course.

Certainly Berkeley and UCLA are at the top .. but when I talk to California parents they talk about getting into "a UC" vs a "state school."