Maybe Millennials Sort of Like Dallas After All (a more nuanced look) (Houston: job market, neighborhood)

[Treasurevalley92]

Originally Posted by Silverlight04

How is Houston the best city for overall value? COL has become just as expensive in Houston compared to any other major city

I'm sorry but that is wrong. Houston is still cheaper than other top 10 metros and even cheaper than Dallas. Houston is still cheaper than Chicago and Philly which in my book are incredible value cities as far as what you get for your money.

[RJ312]

Originally Posted by Treasurevalley92

I'm sorry but that is wrong. Houston is still cheaper than other top 10 metros and even cheaper than Dallas. Houston is still cheaper than Chicago and Philly which in my book are incredible value cities as far as what you get for your money.

Houston has advantages on COL and attitudes of residents.

Dallas has advantages on a broader base of companies with strong presences in the region and lack of hurricane/flooding risk.

Life is all about trade offs.

[Treasurevalley92]

Originally Posted by RJ312

Houston has advantages on COL and attitudes of residents.

Dallas has advantages on a broader base of companies with strong presences in the region and lack of hurricane/flooding risk.

Life is all about trade offs.

No doubt.

I think Dallas offers good value at it's price. I think it punches below it's weight culturally and socially for how large/ economically important it is, but it is priced accordingly.

Plus there is plenty of fun to be had here. I've made great friends here. The social scene is definitely better than a majority of smaller cities.

[jaysan89]

Originally Posted by LocalPlanner

I'm a native Houstonian, so I can't comment on the city from the perspective of an outsider. I'm also an older Gen-Xer, so qualify my thoughts as you will. Also, I'm a gay Anglo male.

That said, I did not grow up very socially connected - frankly my parents were somewhat anti-social and didn't partake of common cultural or social activities. I went out-of-state to college and actually worked on the West Coast for a few years afterward, and got a masters degree out there also. Then I came home.

Houstonians are often used to hearing people who have moved there from elsewhere about how uncommonly open and welcoming the city is, no matter your point of origin. I can certainly say that I never encountered any resistance socially or professionally to re-integrating back into Houston life. I've seen many many quotes from professionals in the media that have talked about how they have been almost astonished about how much they were welcomed and supported, as long as they were committed to working hard.

Does this also translate to the social scene for folks in their 20s and 30s? I don't know, but you have to wonder if there really isn't some substance to this openess and welcoming reputation that wouldn't apply there as well. If so, I don't know why Houston would have generated this vibe, maybe it's something in our humid, chemical-laden air?

Is the same thing commonly said about DFW?

I am probably close to your age since you said you are an older Gen Xer. The same thing cannot be said about DFW, unfortunately. DFW is a deeply racist area and I do not feel welcome here since I relocated from PA in April 2018. I do not feel any connection with the people who are born and raised here. A lot of the transplants to this area are stuck up too. The 2 nicest people I met here are both from Missouri. There is a Chinese dude who works out at my gym who is open and friendly. He is from Southern CA and feels the same way about DFW as I do. He said he will be moving back to CA. I have considered relocating to Houston. However, it is too deep in the South for me. I don't like the climate and risk of flooding there.

[EDS_]

Originally Posted by jaysan89

I am probably close to your age since you said you are an older Gen Xer. The same thing cannot be said about DFW, unfortunately. DFW is a deeply racist area and I do not feel welcome here since I relocated from PA in April 2018. I do not feel any connection with the people who are born and raised here. A lot of the transplants to this area are stuck up too. The 2 nicest people I met here are both from Missouri. There is a Chinese dude who works out at my gym who is open and friendly. He is from Southern CA and feels the same way about DFW as I do. He said he will be moving back to CA. I have considered relocating to Houston. However, it is too deep in the South for me. I don't like the climate and risk of flooding there.

Aren't you that guy who in another thread said that you find most people in DFW ugly? IMO think you have some sort of overwhelming anti-DFW bias that renders your thoughts about the area worthless.

[jgn2013]

Originally Posted by Treasurevalley92

People in Houston are more approachable in general...Dallas is a harder city to make friends in according to my friends who have lived in both.

Based on visiting people in Houston are more laid back and approachable in general...less of the social scene are the SMU/ TCU type, crowd, even if Houston does have Rice.

My theory on that is going to SMU or TCU is less about being smart and more about being able to afford the school. Rice is in another league academically.

Dallas has a great social scene compared to smaller cities, but overall Houston has a more "Urban" culture vs "Suburban" even if both cities are super suburban in layout.

Dallas an Houston are more similar than different, but this is definitely one of the things that is a distinction between the two cities.

Agreed.

To put it another way, Dallas and Houston have similar demographics but Houston social scene/nightlife is more welcoming to urban professionals of color. Dallas is very SMU/TCU-ish and caters more to the upper middle class 22-year old white crowd. The city doesn't embrace it's 'Southerness' as much but seems to overemphasize it's Anglo-side. It's difficult to explain but it makes a lot of sense in practice.

When I think Houston....everything from Bun B to Beyonce to a bunch of highly educated/well-to-do Nigerians immediately comes mind. Dallas, my first thought is blonde-haired Tri-Delts that all have a shot at starring on The Bachelorette.

[jcp123]

Dallas is a nice place. It reminds me in some ways of the Bay Area, where I grew up. It has quite a bit of culture, and a real big city vibe, but is fairly cheap for a major metro. I think it’s an underrated place, certainly more so than Houston which I want to like but never quite can. I think Austin blows both out of the water, and San Antonio has a bit of an edge too.

[Redlionjr]

Originally Posted by jgn2013

Agreed.

To put it another way, Dallas and Houston have similar demographics but Houston social scene/nightlife is more welcoming to urban professionals of color. Dallas is very SMU/TCU-ish and caters more to the upper middle class 22-year old white crowd. The city doesn't embrace it's 'Southerness' as much but seems to overemphasize it's Anglo-side. It's difficult to explain but it makes a lot of sense in practice.

When I think Houston....everything from Bun B to Beyonce to a bunch of highly educated/well-to-do Nigerians immediately comes mind. Dallas, my first thought is blonde-haired Tri-Delts that all have a shot at starring on The Bachelorette.

Exactly! DFW has just as much diversity as Houston yet Houston does a better job of integrating cultures Into the mainstream better than Dallas who’s marketing mainly focuses on the Anglo-side of life and really a certain class of the Anglo-side is emphasized over other groups. Also people’s perception of cities right or wrong are shaped by the personalities that represent those cities or images they see on tv. Doesn’t help that Dallas embraces that larger than life Texan image. Houston embraces the international city niche and I honestly don’t know if that’s genuine but when ppl visit both cities generally they like Houston better socially than Dallas.

Also doesn’t help that 2 of DFW’s biggest schools are religious ones. That’s not to say most students that graduate from the schools and remain in the area are hardcore bible thumpers of the lighter hue but that there is a significant amount of those students that do exist. Houston has UofH/Rice and TSU as the big 3 so you can obviously tell it’s a difference right there generally speaking.

When Millineals think of Dallas I’m pretty sure Cowboys or Jerry Jones is one of the first things that come to mind. When they think of Houston it’s probably Beyoncé or Screw music.

[Treasurevalley92]

Originally Posted by Redlionjr

Also doesn’t help that 2 of DFW’s biggest schools are religious ones. That’s not to say most students that graduate from the schools and remain in the area are hardcore bible thumpers of the lighter hue but that there is a significant amount of those students that do exist. Houston has UofH/Rice and TSU as the big 3 so you can obviously tell it’s a difference right there generally speaking.

I wouldn't say it is so much that they are religious schools...they are more just expensive private schools with good, but far from elite academics.

Rice is Prestigious. It's the closest thing that Texas has to and IVY school. SMU is know as Southern Millionaires University.

Not dissing SMU, I have several friends who went there for Lawschool or got their MBA there. Both are good programs. Undergrad at SMU, especially compared to Rice is more about how much money your parents have than how accomplished you are academically. The result is pretty good academics (After all, kids who are privileged and went to privates tend to be well prepared for college) but not borderline elite to elite academics like Rice.

[Treasurevalley92]

Originally Posted by Redlionjr

Exactly! DFW has just as much diversity as Houston yet Houston does a better job of integrating cultures Into the mainstream better than Dallas who’s marketing mainly focuses on the Anglo-side of life and really a certain class of the Anglo-side is emphasized over other groups. Also people’s perception of cities right or wrong are shaped by the personalities that represent those cities or images they see on tv. Doesn’t help that Dallas embraces that larger than life Texan image. Houston embraces the international city niche and I honestly don’t know if that’s genuine but when ppl visit both cities generally they like Houston better socially than Dallas.

Dallas is definitely less diverse than Houston, though both are very diverse. Houston does a better job of integrating, I agree.

While most people I know prefer Houston culture, they all also prefer Dallas's layout. Houston is closing the gap on that though.

In the 10 years since I first visited Houston it has urbanized at an incredible rate, and while both Dallas and Houston are both terrible pedestrian cities, both have improved, Houston having the more drastic improvements. At this point, they are nearly even.

Houston has also done a much better job with dealing with projects.

While People in Dallas a bickering over removing a highway on one side of their downtown, Houston made the decision to do it.

While Dallas has wasted 20 years on tollway in the park in the floodway disaster Houston built a sensible and functional Park near downtown.

While DFW is building yet another stupid billion dollar ball park in a inconvenient suburb Houston built theirs downtown.

While DART adds miles of pointless rail lines, Houston actually increases ridership by redoing the bus system.

While Dallas wants to add parking minimums to include patio spaces for bars (you actually want MORE people drunk driving???) Houston has removed parking minimums within the loop.

I prefer Dallas for alot of things, but damn if I don't get jealous of how much more pragmatic Houston is.