Income Needed for Family of 4 to Live Comfortably in Dallas (Houston: obgyn, loans)

[JVDZETA]

We’re doing well on a 75K single earner salary and 2 kids in Stonebridge Ranch neighborhood. Bought our 4 bdr, 2400 sq ft house In 2017 for about 300K. 1 lease New model SUV.

Budgeting that doesn’t kill us and smart spending.

Little debt to include:
2 major credit card : under 1k balance And other one FOR EMERGENCY ONLY!
4 store credit cards: paid balance every month or pay at least every pay period. (No big spending) usually cash on the barrel and we TRY TO STICK TO IT.
Utilities (AC on or heater on during seasons)
Church tithes
Emergency fund
No cable TV
Amazon Prime
Sling TV
Fiber ATT internet (military discount)

I think the best deal is I get a company car so that’s great in itself. We sold the other car and saved on insurance, etc.

We are able to travel at least twice a year by saving and numerous little road trips within the mileage limits of our lease.

I used every loophole, advantage I am eligible for as a veteran, credit rating, etc.

Mortgage rate is currently 2.25% through CAREFUL shopping and credit maintenance.
Same thing with home and car insurance.

I’ve pretty much taught myself to be able to handle small home projects such as plumbing, small carpentry, home maintenance.
I cut my own grass...(kids will do as they get older)

We take advantage of the parks and trails, library events, church events etc.
Money is taken out of my pay as far as savings/401k so I don’t necessarily feel the pain.

So far kids haven’t wanted to do any extra curricular but I get them playing and teach them myself in things such as coding and wood working.


We are able to budget nice clothes for the 2 kids...a lot of had me downs but since they are good quality, the little one is happy as well.

We have nice dinner once a week as the kids like trying new foods.

My experience may not be the “norm” but I bet there ar elements of people out there doing it as well.

My wife Sacrifices for the kids and I sacrifice for the wife and kids. We usually hold off on stuff for ourselves but do occasionally splurge.

Save save save! Didn’t touch our tax refund for the first time!! Saved the stimulus check as well. My wife and I were never like this but in all honesty moving from a state we’re the high cost of living was killing us As a two worker household to Now living in Texas...it’s given us true opportunity to save like crazy and budget like crazy!

There’s probably other stuff I forgot to add but these are the best ones I can think of that made our life here in Dallas/McKinney so very fulfilling.

Once I again I know my experience may not be the norm but we are living comfortable and content! (Were not scruffy looking or smell so hope that’s not the impression I’m giving off lol)

[mastershake575]

Originally Posted by justsomeguy

Housing prices must be soaring because I am not seeing anything decent with 2500 sq ft under $400k anywhere in Frisco, Plano, anywhere.

no prices did not increase

80% of the inventory has sold in the last 8-10 weeks. All you're seeing now is houses that didn't and can't sell which will not a proper reflection of the market. You're basically fighting for scraps

[albert648]

I can't possibly imagine an upper middle class lifestyle for a family of 4 on less than $300k a year, unless you have significant assets. I feel like with kids your cost of living scales exponentially.

$250k after taxes is probably about $15k/month. If you put away $15k/year in your retirement, you're probably looking at $14k/mo.

Housing will probably eat up about $3500/mo assuming a new construction/newish SFH, $550k purchase price and 10% down. Utilities and ancillary expenses (water, power, gas, trash, sewer, HOA, gardener, provisions for maintenance) about $700 = $4,200/mo

Assuming cars are owned free and clear, gas, tolls, insurance and maintenance on 2x cars at about $300 each = $600/mo

Food costs are like measuring a piece of string, but assuming you're shopping at the likes of Whole Foods/Central Market and buying decent ingredients, $350/head = $1,400/mo

Extracurriculars - I don't have kids so I have no idea, but let's say $500/head = $1,000/mo

Clothing - Say $100/head/mo = $400/mo

Toys and nice things - $300/head/mo = $1,200/mo

Dining out - $250/head/mo (between 4-6 brunches at $20 each plus occasional takeout, coffee, fast food) = $1,000/mo

A nice vacation will run you about $3k a head assuming longhaul overseas travel and a duration of a week each, factoring in the fact that you must travel during peak seasons (school etc). x4 and 2x a year = $2,000/mo

College fund - assuming $200k/head saved over 20 years at a 7% ROI x 2 = ~$775 (round up to $800)

Misc - $500/head = $2,000/mo

Total: $14,600

For private school, add another $3k per kid per month.

Total to safely sustain this lifestyle: $14,600 + 25% savings = $18,050/mo after tax. Translates to ~$320k in AGI. This also assumes that the employer(s) fully cover all health insurance premiums. Also assumes no other household debt of any kind other than a credit card balance that is paid off in full every month, which for the vast majority of millennial households at least, is an unrealistic assumption.

The $100-$120k a year figure that people are quoting would fetch a marginally upper middle class lifestyle (but comfortably middle class) for a household of one, not four.

[justsomeguy]

Originally Posted by mastershake575

no prices did not increase

80% of the inventory has sold in the last 8-10 weeks. All you're seeing now is houses that didn't and can't sell which will not a proper reflection of the market. You're basically fighting for scraps

Incorrect. These are homes I've seen at Open Houses that were sold within a few days of listing.

[mastershake575]

Originally Posted by justsomeguy

Incorrect. These are homes I've seen at Open Houses that were sold within a few days of listing.

80% of the houses that have been listed in the last 90 days are gone. We're in a low inventory period. Look at houses sold in the last 90 days in your price range for Frisco, McKinney, Central Plano, Eastern Plano and there's tons of houses

[cordata]

Better just stay in Iowa everybody. It takes $320K a year to have a good lifestyle in Dallas.

[hkdman_35]

Originally Posted by ChristieP

No. That’s much too high. The median sales price in DFW is around $350 for most suburbs, most of which have good schools. The house you describe would sell for that. If you went up to $600k, you’d be looking at a 3500 sq ft new build with a pool in Southlake or West Plano. That’s not “median” at all.
For example, the neighborhood I live in in Grapevine has excellent schools, and houses around 2000 sq ft, and they regularly sell for about $310k.

The median price is WAY too low to think about. I think a 500-600k house for 2000 sqft would be about right. I just went through the process and am currently building a house in Allen. I originally looked in Plano - the problem is that the vast majority of plano houses are going to be close to 30 years old. For the house side I was looking at (around 3500 sqft) - I could find houses for about 650k - but I would have needed to spend another 150 - 200k to renovate the house. My suggestion - forget Plano - in Allen - for 500-600 you would have no problem finding a newer home (5-10 years old) probably bigger than 2000 sq ft.

As far as income - it sounds like your lifestyle is similar to mine in that - want some nice things but don't need a new mercedes every year. I would think 150k / year would be sufficient income. That is in Plano / Allen which are more affluent. You could go into other Dallas suburbs and make less.

[hkdman_35]

Originally Posted by cordata

Better just stay in Iowa everybody. It takes $320K a year to have a good lifestyle in Dallas.

Stop. 320k / year to have a decent life in Dallas? Maybe if your living large - but you don't need that kind of money. Granted, there are neighborhoods were 300k per year would put you as the poor people in the neighborhood - but that is not the case for most of Dallas.

[albert648]

Originally Posted by hkdman_35

Stop. 320k / year to have a decent life in Dallas? Maybe if your living large - but you don't need that kind of money. Granted, there are neighborhoods were 300k per year would put you as the poor people in the neighborhood - but that is not the case for most of Dallas.

That figure is not to have a decent life in Dallas, it's to have the life, for a family of 4, within the parameters that OP described. OP asked for the figure required to fund the lifestyle parameters described without having to cut corners or live in excessive frugality. Based on my math, that figure is $320k a year. We can argue over what constitutes a "decent" life into the next century but that's a different discussion altogether, but to me the assumptions I laid out in my first post are fairly consistent with what constitutes what I consider an upper middle class lifestyle and is certainly not "living large".

Personally I'd have to have a HHI of $300k before I even think about having one kid, let alone two.

For reference this is how I define Middle/Upper Middle/Upper class:

Upper Class = You do not need to work to maintain your current, very comfortable lifestyle indefinitely. You can have whatever you want whenever you want wherever you want.
Upper Middle Class = Your lifestyle enables you to get whatever you want, within reason. You can maintain your lifestyle indefinitely as long as you work and your income continues. You have substantial assets that can be liquidated to fund your lifestyle in a pinch, and you are accumulating savings consistently. You are able to maintain your lifestyle as it is for at least one year before you need to cut back. This IMO is where the "work for a living" crowd maxes out.
Middle Class = Your lifestyle enables you to get about 80% of what you want within reason, or whatever you want within reason but it's a stretch. You can maintain your lifestyle indefinitely as long as you work and your income continues. You have fewer assets than the Upper Middle Class but are accumulating savings/assets. You are able to maintain your lifestyle as it is for at least six months before you need to cut back.

[jiping]

What you posted above is the budget for a trust fund baby who is guaranteed to receive $300k annual payments, but definitely not for someone who works hard and earns $300K by himself. Most people I know will heavily invest to student loans, max-out 401K & backdoor Roth, stocks, houses, rental properties, gas stations, small business and medical practice, before flushing money down the toilet. I think you read too much lifestyle magazines or something.