Thinking about Alt-Certification for Elementary Education (Dallas, Irving: renting, credit, attorney)

[jimday]

What are the job prospects for teaching 4th-5th grade as an alternate certified teacher? I'm primarily interested in teaching in Dallas ISD or Irving ISD. How hard is it to get a job as an alt-cert teacher in these districts?

Any recommendations on alt-cert programs? It seems going through DISD's program would give me the best chance of placement in DISD, but what about Irving ISD?

I have a Ph.D. - will this hurt my chances of being hired because the school would have to pay me more?

Thanks for your help!

[xS☺B☺s]

Prospects are not so rosy. Teaching jobs are plentiful in a good economy cuz no one wants to do it when you can make 70K selling widgets. But since the crash everyone who's gotten laid off does the same thing as you are - trying to alt cert. Simultaneous to massive layoffs comes reduced tax revenues and ultimately - teacher layoffs. 2008 had over 200 teachers laid off in DISD that caused a glut in the teacher pool. So to this day, teaching opportunities are limited. Once TI starts hiring C++ writers for 100K again, teaching positions will open up again and of course then no one will be interested.

This year has been better than last year. My wife is at least getting substitute positions. Opportunities as a sub are plentiful. Pay is crap though. I make more money in two hours of OT than my wife does in the whole day of wrassling hooligans + 1 hour commute time. God bless the teachers, I dunno how they do it.

Want a good job? Go medical. Best people in the world and guarantee of continuous business.

[JS1]

elementary alt-cert no experience has a ZERO chance of employment; don't waste your time and money

[fratermus]

Dunno about zero, but it's a very tight market now.

Theoretically, the Ph.D. shouldn't matter but there is anecdotal evidence on the various teacher forums that it may count against you in the beginning.

[jimday]

That isn't what I was hoping to hear Don't the alt-cert programs include placement in an elementary school for a year? Are you saying that most people going through these programs don't get placed, or that after the first year they're unable to find a permanent job?

For the record, I'm not considering teaching as just another way to earn a living. I could find another job in my current profession (human resources), but after 13 years I haven't experienced the level of personal impact that I was hoping to achieve when I first chose the field. I want a profession that makes a real difference in people's lives. My education, experience, and interests are more suited to human growth/development than to the medical field.

I do have some experience teaching at the university level. My kids are currently in 4th-5th grade, and while I realize teaching a whole classroom of kids is a lot different than parenting, I think this is the age that would be the sweet spot for me.

I have a friend currently working in an elementary school, and he is going to arrange for me to do some class observations. I want to ensure I'm not idealizing elementary education, and have a realistic idea of what I'm getting into.

The job prospects are a concern, based on what everyone is saying here. Any suggestions you have would be appreciated!

[xS☺B☺s]

There's an issue with Alt-cert in Tx that the school's accreditation is adversely affected by a higher number of alt-cert teachers. I think that's stupid, but until/unless that changes, that will pose a problem for you.

Within the frame of health care there is a huge sector involved with administration. For example, the Harvard School of Public Health alone is like 15 stories tall. Another opportunity I think would fit you would be government - be that city state or federal.

Teaching is a very commendable goal, but besides the low pay, the odds stacked against alt-certs, I personally think it's a tough job. Many people who go into teaching burn out within a year.

Recently I read this quote"

When a teacher first starts, he's out to save the world.
By the second year, they want to save their kids.
By third, they want to save some of their kids.
By the fourth, they hope they can save at least one kid.
After that, they just hope they can save their own arses.

Sorry for the pessimism, but good luck.

[loves2read]

first --you can't be hired until after you have gone through a minimal training program--and for most companies offering this certification that is just what it is--minimal
you do most of your work on-line from what I understand with very little face time or in-class observation even...unless you have dealt with children with special needs before I don't know that your PdD offers any practical help for entering this area of the teaching field

second--none of these companies after taking your money can actually guarantee that you will receive a job offer/yrs work which you must complete before you fulfill the certification requirements--there are people who have paid their money, done the prep work and passed the tests and yet did not get hired for a teaching job--YOU are responsible for getting your interviews and job offers--for a while the FTW and DISD programs for alt-cert would feed those prospects into their vacancies but think even those districts now have more applicants than job openings...

third--I am not sure that your PhD will actually enable you to receive pay at that level--your degree is not in education--I don't think ISDs would pay someone with say a PhD in engineering on a PhD level to teach alt-cert elementary school...if you were teaching high school physics it might be a different story...IF you are entitled to that pay level then I think you will find it very difficult to get a job--
most people with PhDs in ISDs are superintendents, some principals, supervisory heads of instruction in larger districts like Dallas--
there are very, very few actually teachers with PhD's for reason that are probably self-evident

fourth--the time lag--most of these companies start their training classes at specific times...
schools normally hire in the spring for openings they are funding and know about for the coming year--and then there are some job openings that develop during the summer and right around school opening

fifth--frankly you should be prepared to apply at other ISDs not in your target area
the state has decided that special needs students should be integrated into the classroom--there are fewer and fewer self-contained classrooms so those jobs will be shrinking
special needs students sometimes are pulled out of class during the day--in high school the special needs students have teachers come into the regular classroom to work with them which is one of the most stupid ideas I have come across in a long time...

[loves2read]

for what it is worth--there is an attorney who became an alt-cert social studies teacher at my school--not because he was not successful or was laid off and saw alt-cert as a stop gap for a few years
he is truly an excellent teacher/person who gets great deal of positive reward from what he is doing now--and does make a positive impact in his students' lives (as much as any teacher can)
so it is possible to change from business to education--and frankly he while he started as regular social studies teacher--he soon moved into the IB program and teaches the better class of students which does make a difference in your teaching experience...

[jimday]

Thanks for the comments so far.

My Ph.D. is actually in a relevant discipline (industrial/organizational psychology), although it's not specifically in education. I might consider school administration at some point, but want to get some solid teaching experience first. My biggest concern is actually getting placed that first year following completion of the ACT.

It's encouraging to hear about your friend's success in transitioning to education. I have another friend who was a Professor of Economics at M.I.T. He has been teaching 6th grade for the past 4 years, and loves it.

[JS1]

No one will place you. You have to apply for a job yourself and will be competing with hundreds of applicants, many of whom have experience or a teaching degree or both. Your chances are zero!