Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Cost of undergraduate education: $20,000
Cost of dental school education: $120,000
Cost to build dental office: $300,000
Annual cost to run dental office (includes employees, lab, supplies, utilities, etc): $400,000
After all that, if you still don't think it costs much to provide services, you can buy Orajel, a topical anesthetic, at the drug store. Feel free to fix your own teeth.
Yea, just take those rusty pliers and pull the tooth out yourself, go ahead, you can do it. Listen, I work in an office that sees only patients on public welfare and low income. Some patients pick up that insurance because they are down on their luck and lost their job, no big deal, we'd be happy to see them and some have good oral hygiene. But then again there are those that just don't care, ride the system for awhile if not forever, who I'll see every two weeks because of toothaches. I don't hear anyone complaining out getting their haircut at the Barber for $15 or when that auto mechanic charges you well over $600 to put new tires on. I love it when a patient comes in with a crown that needs to be redone because of secondary decay, I'll ask the patient how long they've had the crown, "oh, at least 15 years, maybe 20." And of course they'll complain that a new crown has to be made, but yet I bet they've traded in their car or truck at least 4-5 times in the past 20 years. Yea, don't tell me dentists are expensive, when it comes to your health you better be ready to shell out the money, or live in pain, either way, I still get a paycheck whether you show up or not. It's very simple, brush and floss your teeth, maybe use mouthwash every once in awhile, get your teeth cleaned and examined at least once if not twice a year and maybe, just maybe we'll catch that cavity that starts early and get it before it turns into a root canal.
I plan on cancelling a dentist appointment today. In a few weeks I'm scheduled for having a crown and a few fillings replaced. It's not an emergency, but just trying to avoid problems down the road. I do not, and never have had dental insurance, and this $1600. procedure is coming at about the same time as my property tax bill.
Bottom line, if dentists offered billing to spread out the payments I would not be cancelling. I don't understand how they all succeed without doing it. Surely, dentists must be feeling the pinch in today's economy like everybody else.
I see you are in the Ohio area?? I don't know about Ohio, but here in CT, they do offer billing options/payment plans...you have to ask if it is not out there for you in black and white, ask. Talk to your dentist and see if they perhaps have a billing plan. Be honest and explain that you cannot handle the full 1600 all at once then talk about a payment option...and if he does offer it to you, be sure you keep up with payments or he will never offer it again. Good luck and don't let your teeth go because of this...if this dentist won't help you out with payment plan, then find one who will.
Cost of undergraduate education: $20,000
Cost of dental school education: $120,000
Cost to build dental office: $300,000
Annual cost to run dental office (includes employees, lab, supplies, utilities, etc): $400,000After all that, if you still don't think it costs much to provide services, you can buy Orajel, a topical anesthetic, at the drug store. Feel free to fix your own teeth.
This is not what someone is thinking about when they are having a tooth issue, have no dental insurance and are willing to make monthly payments. I am SURE you didn't pay for all of the above all at once, now did you??? If you did then you can well afford to help someone out who needs work done and will make payments. What risk would you be taking in a case like this if you ran a credit check on this person to find out how trustworthy they are or are not?? Don't you have someting in your Dental Degree like doctors do that reads "DO NO HARM"....where is your heart with the way the economy is now a days??? Tired of hearing that??? Well, we "paupers" who need to buy ORAJEL to fix our own teeth are tired of full of themselves people like you who refuse to be humane and help out someone who doesn't have a $400,000 dollar practice to run and depends on the high rates he pushes through the insurance companies to keep him afloat.
I am not a dentist, doctor or any other type of service oriented person but if someone needed my help and had no money, I would certainly find a way to work something out with them. This whole scenario with you is a true piece of work and part of the reason we as Americans are in so much trouble financially. We either work together or go under one at a time ALONE.
Hey I work in a clinic that sees patients on public welfare insurance. If anyone were to show up at our window in pain I'd be more than happy to see them. Now the board of directors don't like to hear that because they don't have insurance and they don't have the money, but I'd be more than happy to take a look and see what their problem is, heck I'll even go as far as to prescribe an antibiotic for them too. What I have a problem is are the ones that have the public assistance insurance and don't use it, or better yet, make an appt. and don't show up. Oh that's the best. "Hi, Mrs. Jones, yea we're calling you to remind you of your appt tomorrow at 9am." Reply: "oh I didn't know I had an appt, I won't be able to show up." Let's see, that phone call was made around 4pm the day before the appt, you think we have time to get another patient into the time slot before our office closes at 4:30pm? Probabaly not! An emergency on your part doesn't constitute an emergency on my part! And I've extracted plenty of teeth with the patient not having insurance and no money only to hear, "yea, I'll have to bring back that money tomorrow or the following day." And 90% of the time, the patient doesn't come back with the money, or better yet will only come back when they're in pain! Gee how wonderful to see you again, please take a seat, you must be exhausted from all that pain. Mind you every single tooth in this person's mouth has severe decay and doesn't know which end of the toothbrush to use, yea that's right it's the side with the brissles on it. Don't tell me about seeing patients with no insurance and with no money, I do enough of that now. Humane, trust me I'm very humane and I have a heart and I see patients all day every day. Whenever you want to come to this practice and stay for the day, I'll be more than happy to give you the grand tour, trust me you wouldn't last a day in this office. Remember, floss only the teeth you want to keep!
We are in a spot with our dental care situation, we have been going to one dentist for 15+ years now. They were really expensive even when our dental insurance covered them. Now the company we work for has switched to lame-0 insurance which only covers 50% of the care. And being that they were the most expensive dentists in town. We don't think we will be able to afford to go there anymore. (3 cavities filled: $950), so we ended up paying half that. And it looks like our kids are going to need some orthodontia work, I wouldn't even want to know what that is going to cost at this dentists.
We have to pick a dentist on the "plan" they deem.
Yes I think they should charge (mostly) what they do, what stinks is that the dental insurance doesn't cover jacksquat, like regular medical does.
They want you to pay up front because they're rip-off artists. It doesn't cost them thousands of dollars to work on your teeth. And truth is, if the general public had access to anesthesia they could do the work themselves!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Connecticut Pam
This is not what someone is thinking about when they are having a tooth issue, have no dental insurance and are willing to make monthly payments. I am SURE you didn't pay for all of the above all at once, now did you??? If you did then you can well afford to help someone out who needs work done and will make payments. What risk would you be taking in a case like this if you ran a credit check on this person to find out how trustworthy they are or are not?? Don't you have someting in your Dental Degree like doctors do that reads "DO NO HARM"....where is your heart with the way the economy is now a days??? Tired of hearing that??? Well, we "paupers" who need to buy ORAJEL to fix our own teeth are tired of full of themselves people like you who refuse to be humane and help out someone who doesn't have a $400,000 dollar practice to run and depends on the high rates he pushes through the insurance companies to keep him afloat.
I am not a dentist, doctor or any other type of service oriented person but if someone needed my help and had no money, I would certainly find a way to work something out with them. This whole scenario with you is a true piece of work and part of the reason we as Americans are in so much trouble financially. We either work together or go under one at a time ALONE.
In case you didn't know, my response was to the person who said dentists are rip-off artists and that it doesn't cost thousands of dollars to work on teeth. In reality, it's not thousands... it's HUNDREDS of thousands.
Your response is quite unfair as you know nothing about my charitable works. Before you pass judgement, do you practice what you preach? Do you work for free if your customer is "down on their luck"? Because I have, numerous times per year to the tune of tens of thousands of dollars. Emergencies were NEVER turned away for lack of finances. I also used to volunteer my services at a health center that treats at-risk teenagers and work at the dental school teaching dental students. I can't do that anymore because I'm back in school where, instead of earning income I incur massive debt, yet I still donate money to charitable causes.
Look, I understand healthcare costs are expensive. I can't argue with that. My point is that we're not trying to "rip off" people, that there's a reason for why costs are what they are. After putting 8+ years of education and incurring nearly $1 million dollars of debt, there has to be a financial reward commensurate with the risk taken. In case you missed it, I want to repeat---RISK. What's the risk? The opportunity cost of time and money. If I'm going to be paid the same as someone who started working right out of high school, why did I lose 8 years of income to go to school? Why did I incur debts of $1 million when I could have been earning instead? Would you do it if you were in my position? Except in very, very rare cases, clearly the answer is a resounding HELL NO!
Finally, "do no harm". You're applying it in a different way than it was meant, but I fully understand your point. Do doctors have en ethical requirement to be charitable? I would argue that they have no more and no less the ethical requirement than any other person. People should be charitable with time and possessions to the extent they can help others. Perhaps it's in the regular duty of your job. Maybe it's volunteering for a charity, school, church, or your kid's sports team. Or maybe it's a financial contribution to a worthy cause. "Do no harm" is not a special ethical case for doctors, but a general philosophy that everyone should espouse.
P.S. When I had a dental office, I did offer billing. If someone couldn't pay, sometimes I'd do the work anyways (based on gut-feeling about their true needs). When I left, I wrote-off a number of people who were paying faithfully because I thought they deserved a break.
I have two stories for you. A grandmother brought her grandson in to my office. Almost all of his baby teeth were so rotten that they had to be removed. I decided to remove 3 of his worst teeth the first day, then make a plan for the rest of them. After the first appointment, this lady said she needed to go to her car to get her checkbook. But in reality, she and her grandson got in her car and left without paying the bill.
I thought about this one for a while. She did what she did because she thought that was the only option for getting her grandson the care he needed. Ironically, if she had just told me that she could not pay, I would have done it anyways and she wouldn't have felt guilty. I guess she thought what most people do---that doctors are "heartless".
More than a year later, she brought her grandson back. I wondered why she brought him back to my office, given what she did the first time. Did she try another office who refused her? Did she like my office, despite what she did the first time? I didn't ask, so I don't know. I did more work on her grandson.
Another person walked into my office and said no dentist would help her with her massive dental needs which she could not afford. I agreed to cut my fees somewhere in the neighborhood of 70% to help her out. She was thankful and said she'd like to get started after she comes back from her cruise. That, right there, I find astounding. She can't afford dental work, but she can afford to go on a cruise. I still honored the reduced fees.
So what was the point of these two stories? It's that if someone truly has a need, I'm willing to help them out, and I'm sure most others would do the same. The difficulty is determining who truly has a need and will be honest and forthcoming. You can't imagine the number of times someone tells me dental work is expensive, but is cut short when their phone rings, and they pull out a Blackberry or iPhone. The phone and phone plan costs about what a crown does, yet which is more important? Give me someone who truly needs help, and I'll do my part.
There's an old saying, you can have it cheat, fast and reliable; pick two!
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
