Are Dangerous Roads & Myriad of Accidents Really OK?

[sailing_st_croix]

It's not just you. I find the lines on the main interstates here almost impossible to see at night. I've lived in several cities across the country and regularly driven through dozens more, and this is the first place I have ever had problems seeing where the heck the lanes are at night.

As far as getting around Denver, it is easy in that it is a simple grid. Although, I don't think that is what the po is referring to. If you aren't familiar with the area, it is difficult to find streets you are looking for until you are either right on top of them or passing them.

[JBPisgah]

So, the consensus seems to be that I-25, along with some other Denver highways, are often poorly marked and downright scary to drive at times. What's more, any number of large urban areas maintain their highways better. Does anyone know who is responsible? Do we have CDOT to thank?

[SaxnFlutman]

Originally Posted by cityfilms

Atlanta is one of the biggest rail and road distribution regions in the country with fortune 500 companies like UPS and stuff located there. The state also has twice the population of Colorado, so they have more money. It's unrealistic to compare Atlanta to Denver. Although I also hate the 1 street sign/intersection rule here, understand that in in-town Atlanta 90% of all street lights are hanging on ugly wires and there are much more potholes there than here.

Drivers there also don't have muddy tires and they get more rain to wash off the roads.

I get mad like you sometimes also. I suggest reducing caffeine intake and ginger seems to help with relaxation.

cheers

Despite all those companies, Atlanta, Fulton County, & Georgia are all in debt, yet the lanes get painted, streets & signs are lit, and the signs are BIGGER, lit at night, at the front of the intersection, & over the middle of the street. Plus, you have signs before you get there, telling you what street is coming up, how's that for a concept?

And no muddy tires? Yes rain washes the roads, but that Ga. red clay gets muddy when wet.

And believe me, I'm not drinking coffee before or when I drive, in fact, I sometimes notice the irrationality & funkiness of the streets when driving home, late at night, after a gig, tired & relaxed.... Can't they at least get some federal funds to fix-up I-25, being an Interstate Hwy? Every time I drive it, I get the feeling it was never actually finished, it's such a hodge podge, definitely the funkiest, most dangerous interstate I've ever driven....

[SaxnFlutman]

Originally Posted by davidv

It helps if you know about the system. If you know what you are looking for, it is easier to find it.

The streets downtown are the oldest part of the system. They run NW-SE and SW-NE because the earliest settlers created a system that ran parallel to the S. Platte River. The streets that run NW-SE are numbered and given the designation of STREET (eg 15th St., 16th St, etc.). Numbered streets are only found downtown. The SW-NE streets are named after a variety of people (many are important people of early Denver like Wyncoop, Blake, Larimer, etc.) or things (Water St is near the river, Court St. is near the Courthouse, etc).

The rest of the metro area is a grid. Since the state was surveyed by the US government using the township and range system, this system has a huge impact on the street system. The state was divided into 1 square mile sections. These section boundaries often became county roads, which in turn became the major roads as the area urbanized. Most major roads are either 1 mile apart or 1.5 miles apart. This is very apparent in the southern part of the metro area.

The N-S streets are numbered relative to Broadway St (000). The streets west of of Broadway are in alphabetic order with each alphabet having a theme. Most of the time the major roads are part of the alphabet system (like Federal Blvd, Wadsworth Blvd, or Kipling Blvd.) Sometimes they are not (Sheridan Blvd is between 2 alphabets).

East of Broadway, the first 40 streets (Up to Colorado Blvd) do not follow an alphabetic pattern. The presidential streets are in this area (Lincoln, Grant, Washington, Monroe, etc). After Colorado Blvd, a thematic alphabetic system kicks in.

The E-W streets are numbered relative to Ellsworth Ave (000). North of Ellsworth, the streets are all numbered AVENUES (1st Ave, 2nd Ave, etc). There are a few exceptions (eg. Colfax Ave takes the place of 15th Ave).

South of Ellsworth the streets are a hodgepodge of names with few themes or alphabetical order. All the states are clustered together (Arizona, Florida, Louisiana, Kentucky) as well as colleges (Harvard, Yale, Dartmouth, etc.)

There are a few main roads that started out as stagecoach routes and as a result they run along the creeks and rivers or directly between Denver and some small town and are not part of the grid. Examples here include Speer/Leetsdale/Parker, Smoky Hill Rd, Morrison Rd, and Santa Fe Dr.

With few exceptions, Streets and Boulevards run predominantly North and South, while Avenues run predominantly East and West.

Thanks for taking the time to explain this mess of a layout, the problem still exists, that even knowing all this, when I pull up to an intersection, and can see no signs, I still can't tell where I am! ;-)

[SaxnFlutman]

Originally Posted by CO_Transplant

As much as I complain about Denver, the road engineering is something that I cannot criticize. Yes, the roads could be wider. The roads here are in a grid system and it is nearly impossible to get lost here!

I beg to differ, I know people who've been here many years who all tell me it's very difficult, but "you'll get used to it" once I know my way around. Plus, no matter the grid, if you can't read a single street sign, how "easy" can it ever be???
Get real...

Originally Posted by CO_Transplant

If you want to talk about poor road engineering, go to Atlanta or Charlotte! You can be traveling on a road and with absolutely no warning the lane you're in becomes a turn only lane. You have no choice but to drift over into the other lane at the last minute and keep going! I don't know how you can praise the design of the roads there. They're terrible! Their freeways are super wide, but engineering is not something they have mastered. The problems here are the narrow roads, pothole ridden roads, and poorly striped roads. The roads could be signed better, but it is not as bad as some other cities.

1. I never said Atlanta is laid out well, downtown A is a mess even after being there 15 years! However, I can read the street signs, and know where the lanes are, both a big help....
2. I see just as many, if not more disappearing lanes, exits that pop up with little warning, turn-only lanes only "announced" by faded white lines on the street, & forks that don't let you know which side is which until you're on top of it!

[SaxnFlutman]

Originally Posted by JBPisgah

So, the consensus seems to be that I-25, along with some other Denver highways, are often poorly marked and downright scary to drive at times. What's more, any number of large urban areas maintain their highways better. Does anyone know who is responsible? Do we have CDOT to thank?

That's a good question, and one I'd like to know the answer to, as well.
The most frustrating aspect of all this, for me, is that it would be of great benefit to commerce here, as visible lanes, legible & viewable signage, & better notice before lane changes, exits, forks, etc, would all contribute to preventing many, costly & delay-causing accidents! Every rush hour I hear about far too many accidents tying up far too many roads, for a city this size....