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My tone was tough and harsh because of the two small children whose needs are primary. If they had no children, then it would not matter. However, I bet she has heard the same, many times, from her parents and has chosen to ignore such advice and run away to Colorado. Her post--they lives with her parents. Read between the lines and think what is the situation with this young woman. She expected to get support and validation from the internet. Perhaps, maybe perhaps, she will now listen.
Your letting your heart run your brains. You have small children, very little money, husband with basic job skills and no car. The Denver area is expensive and would not offer you any more quality of life than MN. The job opportunities would not be better. Nothing for you will be better here. You would also have to spend down your little money in relocating and starting a new life. Also, you would only be a one income family because you have to stay home and take care of your children. Putting your children in expensive daycare only works for people who have good job skills and can make more money than the cost of job care. Do you have those job skills?
Even though Denver and parts of the suburbs have good public transit, a cook works odd hours and may not be able to be served by that transit. It would only be possible in some very dense urban areas; but with your funds, you would be living in not a good neighborhood--not a good place for small children.
The real issue is that you are only thinking about yourself, your fantasies and your idealized dream of Colorado. You should think about your children first and stop all this nonsense about wanting to move because you "loved it". Make your life where you are now located.
Livecontent
$10,000 grand is "little money saved up"? How much does one need to save to move, $20,000? $30,000? My parents "ran away" to California (43 mi from SF to be exact) from WA with myself and my 9 yr old sister about 20 yrs ago with less money than that. My dad worked at a machine shop making $9 an hour. My mom did not have a job lined up. We lived in an apartment and got by just fine.
Of course, my parents were "naive" in doing that right? They now own a house, my father is retired, and my mother will soon as well. If the OP saved $10,000 then I have to tell you she is a bit more responsible than you are giving her credit for. And it was not her "fantasy" to move, but rather a mutual choice by both her and her spouse.
We're talking Minneapolis to Denver, not Minneapolis to New York City.
$10,000 grand is "little money saved up"? How much does one need to save to move, $20,000? $30,000? My parents "ran away" to California (43 mi from SF to be exact) from WA with myself and my 9 yr old sister about 20 yrs ago with less money than that. My dad worked at a machine shop making $9 an hour. My mom did not have a job lined up. We lived in an apartment and got by just fine.
Of course, my parents were "naive" in doing that right? They now own a house, my father is retired, and my mother will soon as well. If the OP saved $10,000 then I have to tell you she is a bit more responsible than you are giving her credit for. And it was not her "fantasy" to move, but rather a mutual choice by both her and her spouse.
We're talking Minneapolis to Denver, not Minneapolis to New York City.
What is wrong with your reasoning? You are comparing a situation 20 years ago when your Dad made $9 an hour at a machine shop, semi-skilled or skilled work, which is much more buying power than now and was not consider such a low wage back then. The Year is 2012, soon to be 2013, have you not noticed?
What is wrong with your reasoning? The woman has children that need daycare which is expensive if she chooses to work and I bet she has no job skills to make a good wage to cover the daycare expenses. How much is daycare for two pre-school children--plenty.
What is wrong with your reasoning? They do not have a car and the husband is a cook. How is he going to get to work at odd hours when public transit does not work.
What is wrong with your reasoning? Denver is an expensive area which is now suffering a severe apartment housing shortage--cost to lease are rising every month, and she does not want to live in a "ghetto"--for that is where she and her two small children will be living with the minimal job skills they bring, and the money they do not have. I can bet they will not qualify for many apartments because of their low wages. Rent for a decent apartment would be most of his take home pay, if he can even get $10 a hour wage.
What is wrong with your reasoning? $10,000 is small money and will quickly evaporate with the move, deposits on an apartment before the man gets his low paying job with no job skills. He has been a cook for 9 years and only hoping for $10 an hour which means he cannot or will not progress in his "career".
What is wrong with your reasoning? It is very difficult to get jobs in Colorado. At his skill level and the job he is hoping to get, he will be competing against many more than that have one skill, I bet he lacks--he does not speak Spanish. For many of these low level cook jobs are filled by legal and illegal immigrants. Why would an employer pay him $10 an hour when he has mucho choices of willing workers at $8 an hour or $5 under the table and when his worker is deported, he finds another.
What is wrong with your reasoning? At the wage the husband makes with a wife and two kids, they would be considered very poor and would immediately have to apply for welfare. That is what we need in Colorado, more people on welfare.
What is wrong with your reasoning? What about healthcare costs for these small children and their parents. How can you afford that on his low wages in the restaurant industry that has few benefits. Another case of Medicaid, Child Health Insurance Program--welfare.
What is wrong with your reasoning? Think about the Grandparents in MN, which they are living with, worrying about their little grandchildren that they love, while their daughter runs away with this man/husband to Colorado with little money, no job prospects and little job skills/ambition. As a parent you should understand their anguish.
You have no reasoning and you talk nonsense.
Livecontent
Last edited by livecontent; 08-12-2012 at 12:03 PM..
1. $9/hour in 1992 = $14.72 today and does not take into account the increase in taxes at the low end.
2. Sales tax rates have increased 20% in the last 20 years.
3. A car is almost a necessity in greater Denver.
a. Used car prices are at historical highs (in real dollars) ( Used Car Prices Higher Than Ever ).
b. Gasoline prices are double what they were in 1992 (real dollars, Gasoline Price History )
c. Car registration fees in Colorado are fairly high.
It is a fair amount.
But, they saved that money because "my parents, who we now live with".
Let's see:
1. Rent = $zero
2. Utilities = $zero
3. How much of the grocery bill does the OP pay?
DH and I moved here 32 years ago with about $20K saved up and NO kids. We also had furniture and other household items from previously living on our own, two paid up cars and college educations. We still used up some of that with deposits, a self-storage unit until we found a permanent apt. and living expenses until we found jobs.
I agree this is an unrealistic plan.
Last edited by Katarina Witt; 08-12-2012 at 12:40 PM..
What is wrong with your reasoning? You are comparing a situation 20 years ago when your Dad made $9 an hour at a machine shop, semi-skilled or skilled work, which is much more buying power than now and was not consider such a low wage back then. The Year is 2012, soon to be 2013, have you not noticed?
What is wrong with your reasoning? The woman has children that need daycare which is expensive if she chooses to work and I bet she has no job skills to make a good wage to cover the daycare expenses. How much is daycare for two pre-school children--plenty.
What is wrong with your reasoning? They do not have a car and the husband is a cook. How is he going to get to work at odd hours when public transit does not work.
What is wrong with your reasoning? Denver is an expensive area which is now suffering a severe apartment housing shortage--cost to lease are rising every month, and she does not want to live in a "ghetto"--for that is where she and her two small children will be living with the minimal job skills they bring, and the money they do not have. I can bet they will not qualify for many apartments because of their low wages. Rent for a decent apartment would be most of his take home pay, if he can even get $10 a hour wage.
What is wrong with your reasoning? $10,000 is small money and will quickly evaporate with the move, deposits on an apartment before the man gets his low paying job with no job skills. He has been a cook for 9 years and only hoping for $10 an hour which means he cannot or will not progress in his "career".
What is wrong with your reasoning? It is very difficult to get jobs in Colorado. At his skill level and the job he is hoping to get, he will be competing against many more than that have one skill, I bet he lacks--he does not speak Spanish. For many of these low level cook jobs are filled by legal and illegal immigrants. Why would an employer pay him $10 an hour when he has mucho choices of willing workers at $8 an hour or $5 under the table and when his worker is deported, he finds another.
What is wrong with your reasoning? At the wage the husband makes with a wife and two kids, they would be considered very poor and would immediately have to apply for welfare. That is what we need in Colorado, more people on welfare.
What is wrong with your reasoning? What about healthcare costs for these small children and their parents. How can you afford that on his low wages in the restaurant industry that has few benefits. Another case of Medicaid, Child Health Insurance Program--welfare.
What is wrong with your reasoning? Think about the Grandparents in MN, which they are living with, worrying about their little grandchildren that they love, while their daughter runs away with this man/husband to Colorado with little money, no job prospects and little job skills/ambition. As a parent you should understand their anguish.
You have no reasoning and you talk nonsense.
Livecontent
Oh, please LOL. I knew the first economics whiz would try to equate cost of living then vs now. I knew it before I even checked this page. We were low income in 1991, even in Eastern Washington, let alone the CA bay area. Since people are fact checking, might as well compare Cost of Living between those two areas.
We were poor. Poor is poor my friend, in any generation. My father borrowed money, paid it all back. He worked overtime, eventually got promoted. Still didn't make that much money even 3 yrs ago, but he bought a house. My mother eventually found work, albeit low paying work. She made $10 to start, and guess what? She makes $12 now (notice how cost of living is nullified). Hell, my uncle lives in San Franciso as a cook and pays $400 rent. How? He found a place in a decent remodeled underneath a two bedroom house. He has his own parking spot, kitchen, and bathroom in that unit. If he had posted he wanted to live in SF, I wonder what your response would be?
If you have an ultra logical, risk averse, conservative mind, great. But don't knock other people that try or want to get things done. Some people find reasons things can't be done. Other people find ways they can and just do them.
These conversations are all too similar to the people that continually tell me that I need to sit in my cubicle for 12 more years, should have X money saved by now, can't do Y, and need to think about Z. They, fellow accountants, how some of the most cookie cutter, boring, unmanageably stale lives I can imagine. And their anger just comes pouring out when others do not want to live the same way.
A couple of years ago I felt the same emotion. Heard that a friend had traveled the entire world, was married, had a child. "That's impossible", I thought, "no one lives that life....no one has that kind of money". What I was really saying is "I'm jealous". Turns out she was working for a tour guide, and had in fact traveled most of the world. She did in fact get married and had a child, and does take that child with her to various countries that she travels to. Unfair right?
Some people find a way to do things, other people find reasons they cannot be done. I find it quite funny how people have posted so vehemently within 20 minutes at the very thought of the OP moving.
And 10 grand is not very much money?? Stop keeping up with the Jones' and it will be. Buy your chicken in bulk at wallmart, basic cable TV, and go with metro PCS. That's what I do.
These conversations are all too similar to the people that continually tell me that I need to sit in my cubicle for 12 more years, should have X money saved by now, can't do Y, and need to think about Z. They, fellow accountants, how some of the most cookie cutter, boring, unmanageably stale lives I can imagine. And their anger just comes pouring out when others do not want to live the same way.
A couple of years ago I felt the same emotion. Heard that a friend had traveled the entire world, was married, had a child. "That's impossible", I thought, "no one lives that life....no one has that kind of money". What I was really saying is "I'm jealous". Turns out she was working for a tour guide, and had in fact traveled most of the world. She did in fact get married and had a child, and does take that child with her to various countries that she travels to. Unfair right?
Some people find a way to do things, other people find reasons they cannot be done. I find it quite funny how people have posted so vehemently within 20 minutes at the very thought of the OP moving.
And 10 grand is not very much money?? Stop keeping up with the Jones' and it will be. Buy your chicken in bulk at wallmart, basic cable TV, and go with metro PCS. That's what I do.
Oh, knock off the psychoanalysis of other posters. We're not jealous; some of us have done the same things, just a little more judiciously.
Big whoop for you. I don't like WalMart's meat and produce. I think their chicken is particularly rank. I prefer Sunflower myself. People also come out here and find the streets of Denver, Colorado Springs, etc are NOT paved with gold, and they go back "home" if they can afford to. If not, they languish here on minimum wage jobs.
$10,000 is a good nest egg. However, an apt. for this family in a "non-ghetto" area will cost at least $1000/mo, meaning about $3000 in initial expenses (first and last month's rent, and deposit of 1 mo rent). When my daughter was in college in a small apt. with a roommate, her living expenses alone were about $1000/mo, just for her. This family obviously has no experience in living on their own.
Last edited by Katarina Witt; 08-12-2012 at 02:03 PM..
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