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Then, if the School Resource Officers are members of the Sheriff's office and already trained and armed and spread throughout the district the district is now arming their school security staff, then aren't these school security staff already in the schools as a home base and not driving around the district constantly? If so, then response time is cut drastically.
Additionally, I wouldn't say Columbine was over quickly. Recalling the radio broadcasts, it was the better part of half a day that uncertainty about the situation was being reported. Once everything was analyzed, the actual shootings took place over 90-120, IIRC. That's actually a fair amount of time for school security as well as extended agency response.
Also, I'm hearing reports that these long arms are being locked in specific schools, not in vehicles. Again, another change in response impact.
FWIW, a district in California has recently agreed to allow concealed carry among their teaching staff, provided they complete the local CCL class specific to the school program in addition to the regular CCL program.
Any SROs are employees of the Douglas County Sheriff's Department, not the school district, so it's not DCSD's responsibility to arm them. Your head of security has purchased the weapons to allow the security guards, who are employees of the district, to train at the same level as the county deputies. I think it's a stupid idea, but that's the reasoning.
Right. If the sheriff's office doesn't see the benifit of arming their officers in this manner what makes us think security guards should be. Also I don't think security should have to take on that level of liability and responsibility, it's frankly above their pay grade. With that said there are already guns in school, it is NOT a question of "gun free zones."
Then, if the School Resource Officers are members of the Sheriff's office and already trained and armed and spread throughout the district the district is now arming their school security staff, then aren't these school security staff already in the schools as a home base and not driving around the district constantly? If so, then response time is cut drastically.
Additionally, I wouldn't say Columbine was over quickly. Recalling the radio broadcasts, it was the better part of half a day that uncertainty about the situation was being reported. Once everything was analyzed, the actual shootings took place over 90-120, IIRC. That's actually a fair amount of time for school security as well as extended agency response.
Also, I'm hearing reports that these long arms are being locked in specific schools, not in vehicles. Again, another change in response impact.
FWIW, a district in California has recently agreed to allow concealed carry among their teaching staff, provided they complete the local CCL class specific to the school program in addition to the regular CCL program.
Using Columbine as the example of what a current police response might look like makes zero sense. Nobody understood what was happening because it was the first time. There were no response procedures for such a situation when that event occurred.
Regrettably, I have never had the pleasure of visiting your beautiful State. I hope to one day. I have no doubt that geographical separations are greater than I am accustomed to. However, I never advocated for the 10 security officers to be the SOLE response team to a catastrophic event. By judicious deployment, those few officers can make a 15% impact on near immediate reaction time. Perhaps even enough to slow the devastation of an active shooter long enough for police to arrive, then step aside. It's an old, but true, cliche - when seconds count, the police are minutes away. Why not shorten response time whenever possible?
In a school shooting at Arapahoe High School in Littleton, CO, just north of Douglas County, the shooter entered the building, shot a student, ran into the library looking for a specific victim, ignited a Molotov cocktail and then committed suicide when his intended target got away. This all happened in a span of 2 minutes.
The SRO, a Littleton city police officer in the building, heard the shots and ran to confront the shooter. The shooter was dead by the time he got there.
A security guard with access to a semi-automatic rifle that is stored in his car outside would have made no difference. The incident was over before he would have been able to run to the car, retrieve the weapon, and make it back into the building.
Check this list of school shootings. Last year, there were 6 school shootings at public schools during school hours out of approximately 99,000 public schools. The chances of a school shooting happening at any particular school is very low. As you look through the descriptions, please tell me which of them could have been helped by a security guard, upon hearing gunshots, running to his car, retrieving his rifle and then running back to the scene. I can't find even one.
In a school shooting at Arapahoe High School in Littleton, CO, just north of Douglas County, the shooter entered the building, shot a student, ran into the library looking for a specific victim, ignited a Molotov cocktail and then committed suicide when his intended target got away. This all happened in a span of 2 minutes.
The SRO, a Littleton city police officer in the building, heard the shots and ran to confront the shooter. The shooter was dead by the time he got there.
A security guard with access to a semi-automatic rifle that is stored in his car outside would have made no difference. The incident was over before he would have been able to run to the car, retrieve the weapon, and make it back into the building.
Check this list of school shootings. Last year, there were 6 school shootings at public schools during school hours out of approximately 99,000 public schools. The chances of a school shooting happening at any particular school is very low. As you look through the descriptions, please tell me which of them could have been helped by a security guard, upon hearing gunshots, running to his car, retrieving his rifle and then running back to the scene. I can't find even one.
In a school shooting at Arapahoe High School in Littleton, CO, just north of Douglas County, the shooter entered the building, shot a student, ran into the library looking for a specific victim, ignited a Molotov cocktail and then committed suicide when his intended target got away. This all happened in a span of 2 minutes.
The SRO, a Littleton city police officer in the building, heard the shots and ran to confront the shooter. The shooter was dead by the time he got there.
A security guard with access to a semi-automatic rifle that is stored in his car outside would have made no difference. The incident was over before he would have been able to run to the car, retrieve the weapon, and make it back into the building.
Check this list of school shootings. Last year, there were 6 school shootings at public schools during school hours out of approximately 99,000 public schools. The chances of a school shooting happening at any particular school is very low. As you look through the descriptions, please tell me which of them could have been helped by a security guard, upon hearing gunshots, running to his car, retrieving his rifle and then running back to the scene. I can't find even one.
Yes, this. It's an absurd waste of money in a district that has a multitude of needs that should be a higher priority.
Yes, this. It's an absurd waste of money in a district that has a multitude of needs that should be a higher priority.
Exactly. We just received this email this morning from the district.
Dear Douglas County Families and Staff,
I am writing today to provide an update regarding our dispute with the Colorado Department of Education (CDE) over student attendance calculations. As you may remember, last year CDE sought to pull back $4.2 million because they felt that some of our full-time students did not meet the State’s requirements to receive full-time funding in both fiscal years 2012-13 as well as 2013-14.
Although we still disagree with CDE’s assessment because these students were indeed full time, missing the mark by only minutes; officials from both sides recently met to settle the matter in the best interest of the state and DCSD students and staff.
Using his statutory authority to exercise discretion over audit findings, CDE Commissioner Rich Crandall has reduced the amount DCSD will pay back to the state from $4.2 million (plus $342,882 for the transportation route mile audit) to $2.03 million.
DCSD budgets contingency funds every year allowing the District to cover unexpected expenditures – like this student enrollment refund – without impacting schools or its mission of educating students. The Board of Education approved the expenditure moments ago, during its April 19 public meeting.
It is important to note that despite some rumors in the community, this is not a fine or a fee -- it is only a refund. This is part of the regular student count audit and transportation route mile audit of Colorado school districts go through every year.
The annual student count audit is not an inspection of school schedules but an inspection of each individual student’s class schedule. In order to receive full time funding for a student, they must be scheduled for 360 hours of instruction as of October 1 of each year and must show that each specific class requires attendance to be taken.
CDE engaged in a 100 percent audit of each of our students for the 2012-13 school year as well as a high school focused audit applicable to the 2013-14 school year.
These audit findings were largely focused on the way schools clerically accounted for student time - not the academic achievement of our students. While almost all of these students graduated on time and many with more than the minimum required credits, the accounting of seat time minutes did not meet CDE’s requirements in all circumstances. The CDE audit in no way affects the diplomas earned by our graduates.
I would like to thank Commissioner Crandall for his thoughtful consideration of our position and the facts in the case. Instead of only looking at the regulations and the findings of the audit, Commissioner Crandall worked with us over the past several months to gain an understanding of the situation and our good faith efforts to meet the state’s regulations.
Additionally, we would like to thank Commissioner Crandall and his team for helping to create additional clarity regarding the student-time requirements and expectations. Based on this guidance, DCSD schools have already adopted new practices to avoid student count issues in the future.
Using Columbine as the example of what a current police response might look like makes zero sense. Nobody understood what was happening because it was the first time. There were no response procedures for such a situation when that event occurred.
Not necessarily. While Combine was the first such incident with double digit deaths, there have been several subsequent events with similarly high death tolls, according to the list posted by davidv, where instituions should have been prepared with a rapid response. Looking at those events, most of them, with the exception of Sandy Hook and Virginia Tech (Sandy Hook was over in minutes, Virginia Tech lasted hours), took place over 10-20 minute periods. Adequate time, IMO, for a trained officer to retrieve a long arm or call in back-up to bring in the weapons. Which is another possibility. If the on sight responding officer can contain a shooter with a sidearm, back up can bring additional resources with long arms.
Have all the listed incidences with single digit deaths been due to rapid response by agencies, possibly. I'll agree that is probably what has prevented these events form becoming bigger. However, it appears when that cannot be done, these events take up roughly a quarter of an hour and in those instances the one thing that appears consistent with the shooters in these scenarios is they do not come lightly armed.
Do we know for certain that the Douglas County arms are contained in cars or buildings? I have heard conflicting reports on their actual location. Perhaps that is on purpose.
I agree the odds are low of such events occurring and the funds could be better spent in other arenas, FWIW. I'm not advocating everyone arm themselves. But if there are people and institutions that wish to do so, I don't see a problem in doing so with proper and regular training.
Now that JeffCo schools is back OUT of the news every day, it looks like DougCo will step in to fill the void.
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