Would it be possible to start a small farm in Detroit? (Palmer: tax lien, fit in)
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I have the notion of starting up a fruit and berry farm in Detroit.However there is no part of the city as far as I know that is zoned as agricultural land.There are local gardeners that are allowed to get away with small scale farming because supermarkets are few and far between to my understanding so I think I would be allowed to slide along with them.
Where would be the best location to buy into?I am not from Michigan and I need advice on what area would be the safest.
I've often thought about farming Rapeseed and harvesting the oil - the heavy metals that are in many of the available lots near former manufacturing make me nervous about consuming anything I'd grow. Getting the city to update the zoning for urban farming near residential seems like a no-go as well as the tax rate is far lower for farmland than housing. Sure would be nice if they'd get some tax dollars for land that's just sitting abandoned right now. The storage of machinery is another issue- vandalism and theft are rampant throughout much of the city so finding a safe place for your tools is another problem I could never solve. As far as what areas - google map and look for green space, especially in and around homes. That'll be the safest bet for available land.
There are several groups that are trying to do this. There is a name for the movement "Urban Farming" or something like that. The idea is to buy cheap vacant land in the city and turn it back into farmland. One group has purchased something like 5000 acres. I was told that there is something like 30 square miles of vacant land in Detroit.
I do not think that it is finacnailly practical, but people do it becuase they want to try to social experiment, not to make money.
Getting the variance should nto be a problem. Other groups have already done so, but I am not sure that they have actually planted any crops.
There are some things that you need to consider:
Taxes are very high and you will have to pay the back taxes owed on the property.
There is a possibility that the land will have debris, trash or contamination.
You will have to fence the property in, or you will never see one ounce of produce.
You will have to check the fences daily to see if they have been cut or stolen (Metal fence is often stolen for the scrap value.
Your watering system will have to be protected.
You may have problems spraying with pesticides, fungicides and other necessary chemicals within city limits. You need to pick an area with no nearby residences.
The City council can be very difficult to deal with. Historically, they were only recptive to black individauls, however the new council may be different.
One ht eplus side, it should be easy to hire workers. You also have a great place to sell your produce (Eastern Market). However if you say it was grown in Detroit, people may be afraid of contaminants in the soil tht could have been picked up by your produce. Regardless of whether this fear is justified, it is real and it may be a problem.
The center of your field may be a very attractive place for someone to remove your plants and replace them with Pot plants.
If people perceive you are rich, they may try to find some way to sue you for something.
You will have to remove the rubble of houses and take out the foundations. You will probbaly have to tear a few houses down entirely.
If you think that you can do it, by all means go for it. However go into with your eyes wide open.
If you want to try this, I suggest that you look at Del Rey. There are huge areas with no houses or at elast no occupied houses. There are so few people around that you may not have as much trouble with theft or vandalism. There are probably other areas with vast tracts of vanat land, but Del Rey is the one that I am most familiar with.
Even if they think that you will fail, the City may welcome you. They are desperate to get some of the abandoned homes torn down and cleared away. If you have the money to do that, even if you never plant one tree or seed, they will be happy to see you.
Apples, Cherries and Blueberries grow well in Michigan. Pears do well too. Peaches grow here, but less well than in other places. All forms of Rasberries grow well here. Grapes do OK, not great, but we do have some vineyards/wineries. Citrus does not survive here. Melons and cucumbers can be a good choice becuase they are easy to grow and do very well (they need lots of water, and we have lots of water).
My brother was involved with a group that planned ot grow sunflowers and use the seeds to make Ethanol. There is a refinery somehwere that is closed down, but could be used to convert the produce to ethanol. The idea was to hire unemployed persons to do the work and runt eh plant and then provide the fuel to the City for use in their vehicles. They needed a $40 million grant and I think that they did not get it. At that time, you had to have 51% or more members of your board who were black and lived in Detroit in order to get the City to work with you. However that has probably changed. The new council is much improved.
I've often thought about farming Rapeseed and harvesting the oil - the heavy metals that are in many of the available lots near former manufacturing make me nervous about consuming anything I'd grow. Getting the city to update the zoning for urban farming near residential seems like a no-go as well as the tax rate is far lower for farmland than housing. Sure would be nice if they'd get some tax dollars for land that's just sitting abandoned right now. The storage of machinery is another issue- vandalism and theft are rampant throughout much of the city so finding a safe place for your tools is another problem I could never solve. As far as what areas - google map and look for green space, especially in and around homes. That'll be the safest bet for available land.
Soil testing is critial in considering any land as the Ph balance needs to be tested as well as tests for various viruses that can kill berry plants.Soil quality is a big issue but it seems that alot of Detroit was used only for residential properties but I could be wrong.Regardless soil tests will be conducted.
I have no problem paying normal level taxes.The farm would be a relatively small operation of no more than 1-5 acres depending on land quality,area and cost to establish.
Safety is my biggest issue.I plan to install electrical 8ft high fencing around the entire area to keep out vandals and animals.If there is a home on the property it will be secured with shatterproof windows with bars I can assure you.I am a bit of a safety freak.
I come from a family of farmers that goes back generations and with my older brother and his wife taking over the family farm I have agreed to try to start up my own venture.While I am on the subject and have you here do you know of any good places to find people to work at the farm?Quality workers will be needed and I can pay anywhere from $7.50 - $10.00 an hour.
There are several groups that are trying to do this. There is a name for the movement "Urban Farming" or something like that. The idea is to buy cheap vacant land in the city and turn it back into farmland. One group has purchased something like 5000 acres. I was told that there is something like 30 square miles of vacant land in Detroit.
I do not think that it is finacnailly practical, but people do it becuase they want to try to social experiment, not to make money.
Getting the variance should nto be a problem. Other groups have already done so, but I am not sure that they have actually planted any crops.
There are some things that you need to consider:
Taxes are very high and you will have to pay the back taxes owed on the property.
There is a possibility that the land will have debris, trash or contamination.
You will have to fence the property in, or you will never see one ounce of produce.
You will have to check the fences daily to see if they have been cut or stolen (Metal fence is often stolen for the scrap value.
Your watering system will have to be protected.
You may have problems spraying with pesticides, fungicides and other necessary chemicals within city limits. You need to pick an area with no nearby residences.
The City council can be very difficult to deal with. Historically, they were only recptive to black individauls, however the new council may be different.
One ht eplus side, it should be easy to hire workers. You also have a great place to sell your produce (Eastern Market). However if you say it was grown in Detroit, people may be afraid of contaminants in the soil tht could have been picked up by your produce. Regardless of whether this fear is justified, it is real and it may be a problem.
The center of your field may be a very attractive place for someone to remove your plants and replace them with Pot plants.
If people perceive you are rich, they may try to find some way to sue you for something.
You will have to remove the rubble of houses and take out the foundations. You will probbaly have to tear a few houses down entirely.
If you think that you can do it, by all means go for it. However go into with your eyes wide open.
If you want to try this, I suggest that you look at Del Rey. There are huge areas with no houses or at elast no occupied houses. There are so few people around that you may not have as much trouble with theft or vandalism. There are probably other areas with vast tracts of vanat land, but Del Rey is the one that I am most familiar with.
Even if they think that you will fail, the City may welcome you. They are desperate to get some of the abandoned homes torn down and cleared away. If you have the money to do that, even if you never plant one tree or seed, they will be happy to see you.
Apples, Cherries and Blueberries grow well in Michigan. Pears do well too. Peaches grow here, but less well than in other places. All forms of Rasberries grow well here. Grapes do OK, not great, but we do have some vineyards/wineries. Citrus does not survive here. Melons and cucumbers can be a good choice becuase they are easy to grow and do very well (they need lots of water, and we have lots of water).
My brother was involved with a group that planned ot grow sunflowers and use the seeds to make Ethanol. There is a refinery somehwere that is closed down, but could be used to convert the produce to ethanol. The idea was to hire unemployed persons to do the work and runt eh plant and then provide the fuel to the City for use in their vehicles. They needed a $40 million grant and I think that they did not get it. At that time, you had to have 51% or more members of your board who were black and lived in Detroit in order to get the City to work with you. However that has probably changed. The new council is much improved.
Good Luck. I hope this idea works out for you.
I can afford $10K per acre for just the land.Anything higher is simply out of my price range.
High electrical fencing will be installed as well as irrigation and a good portion of my budget will be spent to insure the safety of my operation.If need be I can hire someone to simply guard the property.Debris and trash I highly expect and before any planting can be done I will need a year to ready the soil.For berry crops we typically till the land under to eliminate any weeds and grow a cover crop to till under before planting the next year.I can not afford to buy contaminated land and will test the soil before purchase.I hope to become organically certified as the pesticides used on the family farm are not good for wildlife.
The crops we grow are in zone 5 and I believe that Detroit is either zone 6 or 7 so berry crops will be well suited.I would love to do a pick your own operation but somehow that sounds like a bad idea.Maybe I am just being paranoid.Either way I am well versed in the alternative marketing strategies and I have no doubt that I can at least break even.Crops I have in mind are raspberries (Both red and gold varieties),apples,peaches,pears,russian pomegranates,blueberries and perhaps cherries.
Here we run a pick your own operation for our raspberries and blueberries.We give the customer a half pint container and let them pick all they can fit in the container for $4.00 which I think would be too high a price in Detroit so I hope to at least gleam $2.50 a pint for raspberries but I will have to do some research and see what the market is like.I suspect that I might be able to do better due to the lack of fresh produce there.
Have you considered Chicken Farming or perhaps Hydroponic Farming in one of the many vacant skyscrapers Detroit offers?
Chickens are mean spirited little creatures and to be perfectly honest I hate seeing them killed.Also chicken farming for eggs requires all kinds of extra licensing which I do not wish to deal with.
Hydroponic farming is not something I have considered or have experience with.However food grown using that method have a higher rate of salmonella and verticillium wilt which is devestating so it would be out of the question for me.
However I have a great interest in historical buildings and with profits generated by the farm I would love to purchase several properties such as The Grande Ballroom and The GAR building for renovation as a hobby and or living space.I am not sure how far apart those buildings are located or if they would be anywhere near my future farm but it is something I am looking into.If I could make it feasable to get my hands on those buildings I would turn the GAR into a retirement home for veterans in keeping with the spirit of the building and turn the downstairs into a small shop for my value added food and food products such as specialty soaps and gifts.As for The Grande I have seen the current state of the building through photographs and I must question if it would even be possible to save the structure do to internal damage and the cost of renovation but I would love to save at least the stage and the dance floor if possible.
One of your biggest concerns will be liability. It is difficult to get insurnace in Detroit. Even car insurance costs a whole lot more becasue of the theft rate.
For the fencing, you will want to have the electrified part as a second fence, inside the perimiter. You will need warning signs all over the place. (Put them inside the fence so that they do not get stolen). This will help to reduce lawsuits. You cannot electrify your primary fence because people will touch it and then sue you. You need to make sure that they are already illegally trespassing before they can come in contact with the fence. Even then there is a risk. Do you know what fencing 5 acres will cost? My answer is: "a lot" I think it will cost more than the land purchase.
I am sure you know that Honeycrisp apples are currently worth their weight in Gold. They might be a good option, but I do not know how you do apples without chemicals. My father has 10-20 apple trees and since he stopped praying them, they quickly became completely worthless. TIny, lumpy, scabby, wormy. They ar enot even good enough for the cider mill. U-pick can be a nightmare. First people take the choice fruit and throw the rest ont eh ground. They damage your trees. They eat as much as they put in the basket and pay you for and then they sue you for something "I got stung by a bee!" However you probably know all that.
Finding employees will not be a problem. Selecting good employees will e the biggest problem. Your best bet for hiring seasonal help is to go to Renneeaince High School and hire some of the better students for the summer. They can work weekends for you before school is out. They woudl be happy to work for $8-$10 per hour and you have a better chance of not getting bangers. I would not put an ad in the paper. You will get 15,000 telephone calls.
Depiste the fence, security etc, you still may have to pay protection fees to the dominant gang in the area. That depends in part on where you settle. If the area is empty, maybe you will not attract attention. If there are other businesses, ask them whether they pay for protection and what the amount is. They may or may not tell you the truth.
Perhaps there is something on the edge of Palmer park where you coudl set up and fall under the protection of their private security forces. Also there are people with money in Palmer Park who might enjoy an Oraganic U-pick place and can pay for the privilege. Another option would be to be near Eastern market. If you are reasonably close, you could shuttle people from Eastern Market to your farm.
If you do settle in the area of a nice neighborhood, maybe you could grow herbs as well. That way people could drop in for fresh herbs for dinner.
I think that you may be able to beat $10k per acre by quite a bit if ou find the right place. If you are going to remove abandoned homes and rubble, you may get some help from the City (or at least cooperation).
You will have to have the property un-subdivided so that you are not taxed on each lot. You will also need ot make sure that there are no back taxes owed on the property, or make a deal withht ecity for tax forgiveness, it you can. Back taxes are one reason why the houses being offered for $1 are not selling. You also may run into a problem finding out who owns a given parcel. Since you will be buying individual lots and combining them. you may find one lot int he middle of your farm that you cannot find the owner. Sometimes, people just left and their descendants do not even know that they own the property. If you can get them to like you and work with you, the City may be able to help by foreclosing on tax liens and then selling the property to you.
Since there are several other groups with a simlar idea, you may want to contact them and see what problems they have encountereed. They may be abel to smooth things over for you.
You also might want to try to incorporate as a non profit or even as a charity. Your goal can be to provide jobs, make use of worthless land and provide a source of fresh produce to the community. You can pay yourself a reaosnable salary, but the charity would own the land and equipment. I am not certain, but I think that you cna loan the charity the start up money (or donate and take a tax deduction if you get 501(c)(3) status.
If you get approved as a charity, you may be able to apply for block grant funds.
There are lots of options for you.
Keep in mind that the City of Detroit has the highest real estate taxes around. They also have an income tax for anyone working in the city and a bigger income tax for people who live int he city. On the other hand, if you are in an enterprise zone, you will get breaks for creating new jobs.
For the fencing, you will want to have the electrified part as a second fence, inside the perimiter. You will need warning signs all over the place. (Put them inside the fence so that they do not get stolen). This will help to reduce lawsuits. You cannot electrify your primary fence because people will touch it and then sue you. You need to make sure that they are already illegally trespassing before they can come in contact with the fence. Even then there is a risk. Do you know what fencing 5 acres will cost? My answer is: "a lot" I think it will cost more than the land purchase.
I am sure you know that Honeycrisp apples are currently worth their weight in Gold. They might be a good option, but I do not know how you do apples without chemicals. My father has 10-20 apple trees and since he stopped praying them, they quickly became completely worthless. TIny, lumpy, scabby, wormy. They ar enot even good enough for the cider mill. U-pick can be a nightmare. First people take the choice fruit and throw the rest ont eh ground. They damage your trees. They eat as much as they put in the basket and pay you for and then they sue you for something "I got stung by a bee!" However you probably know all that.
Finding employees will not be a problem. Selecting good employees will e the biggest problem. Your best bet for hiring seasonal help is to go to Renneeaince High School and hire some of the better students for the summer. They can work weekends for you before school is out. They woudl be happy to work for $8-$10 per hour and you have a better chance of not getting bangers. I would not put an ad in the paper. You will get 15,000 telephone calls.
Depiste the fence, security etc, you still may have to pay protection fees to the dominant gang in the area. That depends in part on where you settle. If the area is empty, maybe you will not attract attention. If there are other businesses, ask them whether they pay for protection and what the amount is. They may or may not tell you the truth.
Keep in mind that the City of Detroit has the highest real estate taxes around. They also have an income tax for anyone working in the city and a bigger income tax for people who live int he city. On the other hand, if you are in an enterprise zone, you will get breaks for creating new jobs.
Fencing costs are sky high but they will be vital to protecting my investment and I will easily pay more for the fencing then any other expense.
We sell Honeycrisp apples and yes we do make quite the pretty penny selling them.U-pickers do damage to the property and trees.We run on over 50 acres currently so losing product due to people eating the fruit is not a concern but in a smaller operation I am sure it would quickly ruin me so I probably will not be running such an outfit.
Looking to high schools for workers sounds like a fine idea.If a kid stays in school it is a good sign that they are really trying to lift themselves up and that is exactly what I am looking for.
Protection fees?Goodness I didn't think that Detroit was that bad yet!I don't really like that idea because I am firm about not getting involved with any kind of gang activity.
Real estate taxes are insane but understandable.I was unaware that the city would be open to giving back tax forgiveness but I would imagine that if I bought enough land and put enough people to work along with brightening a neighborhood that they might be open to such a proposal.
My ideal scenario would be to find a farm area with or near a historically significant building that would allow me to have a place for me and my workers to live along with the lower floor dedicated as an office and store for the farm.I would also love to reinvest the farms profits into buying up additional land and properties surrounding the farm and further improving the neighborhood.However I realize that is probably a pipe dream but this is America and I can dream as big as I want.
Please keep us posted. In a couple years we'll be looking for the "pick your own" signs while traversing the expressways.
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