I had no idea it was this bad (Detroit, Warren: fit in, foreclosures)

[edub]

Originally Posted by Ohio248

This is false. The Census shows that the population loss continues. In fact, it has been accelerating. Job losses are also accelerating.

Detroit is losing the middle class faster than ever. The Census estimates that Detroit has lost about 70% of the middle class folks since 1990. And Detroit wasn't exactly prosperous in 1990.

Some people THINK there is a turnaround, because a few white hipster folks now live around Wayne State and in Corktown. A few college kids do not constitute a turnaround, when 90% of the neighborhoods are rotting away.

Exactly!

According to the poster you quoted, the streets of Detroit are paved with gold, diamonds fall from the sky and it is like something from a Disney film. Please do not feed the trolls.

Really I wish they would just give him his own sub-forum so we wouldn't have to hear his BS. Anyway, I'll probably receive an infraction for this so if you don't hear from me again you know what happened.

[The Homogenizer]

Originally Posted by edub

According to the poster you quoted, the streets of Detroit are paved with gold, diamonds fall from the sky and it is like something from a Disney film.

I thought we were having a nice, logical exchange. Why bring rhetoric into it if you're able to speak rationally?

[us66]

Originally Posted by edub

Exactly!

According to the poster you quoted, the streets of Detroit are paved with gold, diamonds fall from the sky and it is like something from a Disney film. Please do not feed the trolls.

Really I wish they would just give him his own sub-forum so we wouldn't have to hear his BS. Anyway, I'll probably receive an infraction for this so if you don't hear from me again you know what happened.

His Detroit is different than the Detroit most Detroiters experience. His, for the most part, isn't that bad, but the street urchins begging for beer money and the smash and grabs from your parked car get old. Like the old car ads say, "your mileage may vary."

[ForStarters]

Seeing as my previous post has become the centerpiece of this thread, I might as well chime in and clarify...

Homogenizer is correct, I never claimed that Detroit's population was increasing. In fact, Detroit's population is decreasing as it has been for the past 60 years. That trend is consistent with virtually every other Midwestern city, except that Detroit's depopulation has been more dramatic. However, it is also true that occupancy rates in core Detroit neighborhoods have been steadily rising. Many residential buildings hit record highs at 90%+ occupancy this year, and a few months ago, Crain's reported that residential space downtown had nearly reached critical mass. Another survey this year found that Detroit's white population had risen 5% over one year, crediting the number of young people (including hipsters) and empty nesters who have moved into the city. These are classic, early indicators of urban gentrification.

A new trend has emerged in Detroit. Beginning less than 10 years ago, the city began attracting companies back to its central business district. Since that time, more companies have relocated to Detroit than have left. Just from memory, downtown has added several major corporate headquarters including Compuware, GalaxE Solutions, Quicken Loans, Blue Cross Blue Shield, Ernst & Young, and recently, Goodby Sivlerstein Advertising- and many more are rumored to come. Beyond that, in the past 5 years Detroit has added two new sports stadiums, three casinos, multiple urban parks, a three mile-long riverwalk, the Dequindre Cut bike trail, WSU's TechTown, several theaters, many art galleries and studios, scores of new bars and restaurants, and hundreds of cushy lofts. Two historic skyscrapers have been renovated into high-end hotels and luxury condos.

These new developments have reversed a half-century of unabated disinvestment. Growth in Detroit is taking place at the city's core. Whether we're talking about a major corporation or a small fashion designer, parts of Detroit are seeing a renewal. These trends have spurred plans for future developments. Those include the M1 light rail line, plans for a new NHL/NBA stadium, a major shopping district, a new convention center, DMC expansion, WSU expansion, the renovation of several downtown highrises, etc, etc. As I hinted at before, the major players are making moves. Many on the outside looking in are waiting things out to see if Detroit really takes off, but I doubt that in 10 years I will have to sit here and explain myself.

[canudigit]

Originally Posted by edub

Exactly!

According to the poster you quoted, the streets of Detroit are paved with gold, diamonds fall from the sky and it is like something from a Disney film. Please do not feed the trolls.

Really I wish they would just give him his own sub-forum so we wouldn't have to hear his BS. Anyway, I'll probably receive an infraction for this so if you don't hear from me again you know what happened.

So shoot the guy for having a positive outlook and believing in the future of his city and keeping us updated on good things that are happening there, for crying out loud!

Why don't all of you who refuse to see anything positive and only come here to talk about how terrible Detroit is start YOUR own sub-forum? You could call it...let's see...how about the "We hate Detroit so therefore you must too" forum?

If ForStarters is happy in Detroit and excited about the positive developments that are happening there then what's it to you? Are you afraid that someone from outside the area might happen to read some of his posts and start to believe that every square inch of Detroit isn't a huge, filthy, murderous ghetto, which is the myth that you seem to want to perpetuate? Sure, Detroit has its challenges, show me a large, urban area that doesn't, and maybe Detroit faces more challenges than most right now, but can't a guy be happy and have a positive outlook without being attacked for it?

Wow.

[TruthBeautyGoodness]

Originally Posted by canudigit

So shoot the guy for having a positive outlook and believing in the future of his city and keeping us updated on good things that are happening there, for crying out loud!

Why don't all of you who refuse to see anything positive and only come here to talk about how terrible Detroit is start YOUR own sub-forum? You could call it...let's see...how about the "We hate Detroit so therefore you must too" forum?

If ForStarters is happy in Detroit and excited about the positive developments that are happening there then what's it to you? Are you afraid that someone from outside the area might happen to read some of his posts and start to believe that every square inch of Detroit isn't a huge, filthy, murderous ghetto, which is the myth that you seem to want to perpetuate? Sure, Detroit has its challenges, show me a large, urban area that doesn't, and maybe Detroit faces more challenges than most right now, but can't a guy be happy and have a positive outlook without being attacked for it?

Wow.

What percentage of Detroit do you think is a "huge, filthy, murderous ghetto?"

[Ohio248]

There's absolutely nothing wrong with positivity, but some of these folks get absolutely outraged when one points out the facts.

There was a false claim that the events of the past 50 years had reversed, and then all sorts of backtracking, saying "oh, I didn't mean that population or businesses were increasing; there's just a new attitude I think I'm feeling", which of course is an absolutely unquantifiable and meaningless statement.

Yes, good things are happening. No, there is (as of now) no solid evidence of a turnaround.

[edub]

What is so funny about this conversation is that I just purchased a building on the Detroit, Hamtramck border and have been busy supervising a crew of guys who are turning the place into a literal fortress to keep out the criminals. So far I've spent a lot of money and time. It's a real challenge trying to figure out all the ways they can find to break in and try to keep them out.

I should start a thread on how to keep criminals out of your building. But ya, when you are reinforcing all your doors and windows with multiple through bolted hasp locks, re-bar, iron gates that could stop an African elephant, corrugated roofing steel, alarm systems and HID security lighting it's easy to forget what a wonderful crime free place the city is. The big trend now is to brick up all the windows and leave a single row of glass block on top for light. That will come soon.

Now I just need to spend a few grand and get a variance from the City to gate in and light up the ally so they don't just break through the cinder block wall.

Anyway, I'm just doing all this because I'm imagining all the break-ins that happen. Note the obvious sarcasm.

[canudigit]

Edub, I totally feel for you and understand where you are coming from. I don't doubt for a minute that all of those things that you have had to do to safeguard your investment are necessary, and it's pretty sad when a guy can't buy a piece of property and not have to worry about it being carted away or burned down.

I never denied that Detroit has a lot of very dangerous, crime-filled areas, way too many, in fact. I have read most of ForStarters' posts and I don't believe that he has ever denied that fact either. However, if he wants to focus his posts on the positive things that are happening in Detroit and the areas of the city where people do feel safe and enjoy being there, then I don't see why we should discourage him. He has a right to be happy in his city and have a positive outlook. If no one felt like he did, then there would be absolutely zero hope for Detroit, thank God there are people like him, right? Maybe with enough effort from people who love Detroit too much to give up on it, things will continue to improve and people like you will someday be able to buy property without having to fortress it just to keep it from being carted away piece by piece.

[Cliffie]

A lot of the houses that get burned down in Detroit are celebrations of Devil's Night -- and since a lot of abandoned places get used as crack houses, all it takes is for one misplaced stem placed on something flammable while it's still hot, and poof.